Only possible things happen. Is free choice an illusion?

by Terry 25 Replies latest jw friends

  • myelaine
    myelaine

    i would say 'free choice is a joke & a token gesture' because as humans, in physical bodies, our will can never be free. if my will says i can fly, and i want to fly, so i jump, the reality is gravity, and i will go splat. so i do not consider the choice making that we humans are capeable of as anything more than a token gesture, freedom within a constrained and controlled environment.

    We as humans are trapped in a constrained and controlled environment. we can never be free IF CHOICE IS A TOKEN GESTURE illusion is a nicer word than i would use.

    we as humans are NOT trapped in a constrained and controlled environment we can be free. IF CHOICE IS A REALLY

    who said we have a choice? GOD

    who said (ina round about way) we have no choice? hint..surely you won't die?

    In God's Word we are told that we have a choice based on free will and the true choice (based on true knowledge) will set you free.

    Have you read AUG 11 posting THE SEED? please read it.

    love michelle

  • belbab
    belbab

    I will have to review this interesting topic when I have more time. Great discussion!

    Have any of you read about Mandelbrot and the theory of chaos?

    Chaos leads to design.

    Check it out. http://www.mathjmendl.org/chaos/

    belbab

  • myelaine
    myelaine

    I suspect we really don't disagree, because I also think it's futile to fight your nature. Our nature fights back and it seems to me we usually lose, although I can't speak for others really. But we often try, and isn't the thing in us that makes us TRY to go against our natures something we might identify as free will?

    that "thing" that is trying to get us to go against our natures is God's spirit in us helping us to make a choice - of our own free will - based on the knowledge that what God's spirit leads us into is good and what our nature leads us into is bad.. we still make the choice.

    If you make the correct choice, the correct choice is promised to be easier to make next time because you are (you continue/) to be in tune with God's spirit in us.

  • myauntfanny
    myauntfanny

    Hi myelaine

    Welcome to the board.

    that "thing" that is trying to get us to go against our natures is God's spirit in us helping us to make a choice - of our own free will - based on the knowledge that what God's spirit leads us into is good and what our nature leads us into is bad.. we still make the choice.

    I don't take quite such a dim view of human nature as you do, but otherwise I find it possible that in some sense you are right.

    Best wishes, hope you enjoy yourself here.

  • Golf
    Golf

    Absolute freedom, NO! Relative freedom, Yes! Don't pay your taxes and find out how free you are.

    Guest 77

  • Terry
    Terry

    http://reason.com/rb/rb021903.shtml

    A mini-synopsis of a book I read about the "choice" in our nature.

    Daniel Dennet's book FREEDOM EVOLVES is the source.

    Terry

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