by Norm 27 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
New Light............with all due respect, how do you know that other animals feel this way? This is the point I'm trying to make. How do we know what other animal species are saying? Our human animal egos get in the way without us even realizing. BTW, have a nice time in Amsterdam.
Terri
You're absolutely right, Terri. Maybe the other animals are diplomatic. But we don't know either way and I was in the mood to make a counterpoint. I am a Gemini, after all
Sunnybabe.....I agree with your point.
Perception is in the eye of the beholder. We suppose we are above a dog in intelligence, yet a dog has senses far superior to ours. Think if the tsunami victims had the senses of a dog and other animals. Thes animals "sense" danger and howl BEFORE these events happen.
Each living thing has it's own perception of it world.....humans are no different. Try facing a grizzly bear and tell him you have "dominion" over his arse! *starts shakin*
Gumby
Yes, New Light/Matt you are a Gemini ........and I parse you...........
Gumbrilliant, totally got my point, hon!
I read a science fiction novel entitled "A Place Beyond Man" back quite a few years before I left the Borg which really got me to thinking about the whole "human as superior" thing...........by the way, great book if you can get your hands on it..........it's out of print now.............
A Backyard Goldfish Pond:
Goldfish One, "Hey! Our food god has just rained down some great stuff!"
Goldfish Two, "What food god? I see no food god. Food happens that's all don't be stupid."
Goldfish One, "I'm not stupid. Don't you know the food god made this pond just for us? Everything here is just for us."
Goldfish Two, "Prove it."
Goldfish One, "Everything here is just right, it's so beautiful and we're the only ones here that can enjoy it. I mean, the plants can't really enjoy it and this food keeps raining down just when we need it. Faith you got to take it on faith."
Goldfish Two, "Uh, yeah whatever. Look this pond has been the same for eons and we have shown that eons before that this pond was just a puddle of water filled with worms. Science has proven that those ancient worms evolved into other species and then finally the top of the line: us. There's no food god only us here and you'll be a lost fool until you accept that.
Goldfish One, "So just take your word on it then? You say there's no food god and that's the way it is? Well, I don't buy it, this pond was made for us and our food god gives us everything because to him we are everything.
Goldfish Two, "Look, you like your ignorance? Wallow in it for all I care. I'm going over to feed on the naturally occurring food stuffs produced by this naturally occurring pond in which we are nothing but naturally occurring living organic matter. I'm finished trying to educate you!"
In the backyard:
"Daddy, I fed the goldfish!"
"Great honey, do you like your goldfish pond?"
"I love it Daddy. It's the best present you ever gave me."
"Thanks honey. Now remember to feed them the same time everyday and also remove any dead plants and leaves from the water. Okay?"
"Oh, yes Daddy! I want to keep my goldfish healthy and pretty because you gave them to me."
"No honey, I brought them here and built the pond for them but the truth is it was God who gave us the goldfish."
"But Daddy, my friend says there is no God!?"
Worldview > Imagination > Symbolism > Language.
Man is first of all a linguistical predator, feeding his imaginary "world" by naming every bit of reality and making it a human-like, rational, thinkable, representable figure. By science or poetry equally.
To me there is no escape from that, only awareness -- which is painful yet helpful.
Nark,
What if man developed awareness that transended language,,more of an highly developed intuitiveness that knows not thru language but much more deeply?
CRR I'm with you- What's up with the apologistic leanings of some? What's so wrong with being at the top of the food chain (most of the time anyway)?
Who said "God" made things just for us? Maybe we were made just for all of these things! Tell a woman that a diamond is just a rock (which it really is). Tell me that a womans body is merely a lactating suppository for eggs to procreate the species (mmmm curves). When did "science" become an entitiy of it's own. You state how "humans" thought they were the center of the universe (how arrogant!) - no not really, just ignorant. It was these same "humans" that figured out the truth of the matter - not "science". Science was merely the methodology used to figure it out- a tool (that we "humans" named).
Humans (although capable of much wickedness) are the most compassionate creatures on the planet. Very few individuals purposely try and hurt the earth or it's inhabitants. Most people are pushed by making a living, big business, governments and org. religion. Left on their own with adequate resources people are good to the planet (ie ideginous tribes, "indians" etc). Most people on the planet can't afford to be "tree huggers", that's a luxury of the rich and spoiled. The rain forests get cut down by men trying to feed their children- they are driven by big business or government. Most of us are pawns (whether you like to admit it or not). We're slaves with relative freedom. Don't believe me, try traveling the world without money or a passport, don't pay your taxes, grow pot in your front yard. See what happens- if you stop following the rules! Many a hippie has tried and learned a sad and painful lesson. Don't get me wrong, I don't like it... but that's the way life is right now.
Instead of feeling humanocentric, I feel more of a responsibility to take care of what's been GIVEN us and to enjoy it. Maybe humans seem 'centric because we're the only ones that communicate and store knowledge to be passed on to the next generation resulting in a modern society. Animals are programmed to a great degree to run on instinct. Remember the people who have wild animals for pets and forget to feed them? They end up on the news as being EATEN by the animal they LOVED.
Remember DISNEY FILMS AREN'T REAL!
u/d
Deep down inside us I feel we beg to know what is the universe and what place do we take in it or is everything just one with no second. Is every thing that exist just conciousness with no boundaries of space- time.
I'm afraid the answer is unattainable if the mind is pruely physical and operates only inside space and time. But if it operates at that level and also a higher level or at the Quantum level of probability and uncertainty then perhaps we can experience it,,, but only as a void by the physical part of the mind and something totally unspeakable by the higher operating mind. Maybe that union crushes ego alittle each time until the ego just is a weak little voice that the mind hardly notices?
Although I've always considered myself a "spirtually minded" person, I have to admit I LIKE BEING PHYSICAL. I love the creation, the way my body is made (they way many other "bodies" are made), the limitations as well as the pleasurable "perks".
Kind of like on the Matrix when the dude says (referring to his steak dinner)I know it's not real, but it tastes sooo gooood!
Just another lowly mammal soaking up the suns rays and feeling good for NO DAMN REASON. Okay maybe it's the endorphins, but I still FEEL GOOD.
u/d
