tug of war ensuing

by And1 43 Replies latest jw friends

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  AlmostAtheist

  What are some good questions to ask the Witness camp?

  70. If eating liver and getting a liver transplant are clearly two different things, why is a blood transfusion considered the same as eating blood? (The Watchtower has called blood an organ, and quoted a doctor calling a 'blood transfusion the same as a blood transplant'. The fact that they can feed you with an IV is irrelevant, since they actually do *feed* you. Your body consumes that food. Your body doesn't 'consume' a blood transfusion, it uses it as the organ that it is.) Dave
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  Nosferatu

  There really isn't one thing that led me to leaving. It was an accumulation of many things. I had trouble dealing with the physical abuse from my JW mother and the elders discredited me by saying "but your mother is so spiritual in the congregation bla bla bla". There is much hypocricy (Jesus can have a beard but the brothers can't) and I got tired of attending the 3 meetings a month. Also, I was a horny teenager and I liked women. I also liked to masurbate. I had normal desires, but I felt bad for going through what's totally normal.

  I began to realize that there was something really wrong. I began to believe it's necessary to have dating experience rather than getting married at 20 years old because you can't handle holding yourself any longer. It's bullshit.

  Before I left, I was depressed with low self-esteem and low self-confidence issues. I no longer have these problems. I've become one of the happiest individuals you'll ever meet!
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  undercover

  I didn't read all 70 questions ahead of me....

  Just ask them who mediator between man and God is. If they say Jesus, ask them to clairfy. Is Jesus your mediator? If they say yes, you can take them to WT articles that teach otherwise.

  *** Watchtower 1979 April 1 p.31 Questions from Readers ***

  Questions from Readers

  ? Is Jesus the "mediator" only for anointed Christians?

  The term "mediator" occurs just six times in the Christian Greek Scriptures and Scripturally is always used regarding a formal covenant.

  Moses was the "mediator" of the Law covenant made between God and the nation of Israel. (Gal. 3:19, 20) Christ, though, is the "mediator of a new covenant" between Jehovah and spiritual Israel, the "Israel of God" that will serve as kings and priests in heaven with Jesus. (Heb. 8:6; 9:15; 12:24; Gal. 6:16) At a time when God was selecting those to be taken into that new covenant, the apostle Paul wrote that Christ was the "one mediator between God and men." (1 Tim. 2:5) Reasonably Paul was here using the word "mediator" in the same way he did the other five times, which occurred before the writing of 1 Timothy 2:5, referring to those then being taken into the new covenant for which Christ is "mediator." So in this strict Biblical sense Jesus is the "mediator" only for anointed Christians.

  *** Worldwide Security Under the "Prince of Peace" (1986) pp.10-11 ch.1 The Desire for Peace and Security Worldwide ***

  16 Just as the ancient nation of Israel was in a covenant relationship with Jehovah God through the mediator Moses, so the nation of spiritual Israel, "the Israel of God," has a covenant relationship through a mediator. (Galatians 6:16) It is as the apostle Paul wrote to his Christian fellow worker: "There is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus." (1 Timothy 2:5) Was Moses the mediator between Jehovah God and mankind in general? No, he was the mediator between the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob and the nation of their fleshly descendants. Likewise, the Greater Moses, Jesus Christ, is not the Mediator between Jehovah God and all mankind. He is the Mediator between his heavenly Father, Jehovah God, and the nation of spiritual Israel, which is limited to only 144,000 members. This spiritual nation is like a little flock of Jehovah's sheeplike ones.?Romans 9:6; Revelation 7:4.

  A lot of JWs don't realize this teaching. Especially younger ones and newer ones. If put on the spot they'll say "Jesus" is their mediator. There are some that will remember the correct teaching and answer as the WTS teaches, however, they'll beat around the bush in doing so. Even then all you have to do is say that the Bible says "There is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus." (1 Timothy 2:5) . How is that the Bible says one thing and JWs say something different.
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  AlmostAtheist

  A lot of JWs don't realize this teaching.

  For more of this sort of thing, check out http://quotes.watchtower.ca

  It's a site full of nothing but quotations from Watchtower publications showing what they really teach. Amazing stuff.

  Dave
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  Jez

  And1: You are thinking, the first step in becoming an apostate.

  I never left, I was kicked out on my ass. I devoted my whole life to JWs, my husband of 14 years finally got arrested and thrown in jail for abuse, I informed the elders, they only publically reproved him even though he confessed to them and did not stop the abuse, I left him in spite of their admonition to stay and work it out, I met someone else 6 months later, I was quickly df'ed. You can read my story, and worse stories than mine under the women's section at www.freeminds.org

  Since then, the unloving attitude of the JW has shocked me. Love is not THE identifying mark of their religion therefore they are not the true religion. Shunning is wrong, unloving, cruel, destroys families, not at all like Jesus, read the thread on shunning www.jehovahs-witness.com/12/84299/1384364/post.ashx

  So much of what I have learned is just by following my instincts about this religion and seeing it for what it really is, not 'the truth', just a group of men who prey on ppl that are really really afraid of death.

  Jez
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  tepic

  Others have said it much better than I can. I'll just mention that COC did it for me after 40 yrs. Also the unloving attitude in spite of preaching love.
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  Country Girl

  Christianity is not a religion, it's a relationship. With you and God. You *can* join fellow believers in worship fests to God, but really.. it's just between you and him.

  CG
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  garybuss

  The Witness people were mean to me, the Watch Tower Publishing Corporation printed error that was required to be accepted for "belief", then denied the error. I was stalked by Witnesses, my three year old son and I were pushed by assembly attendants for using a vending machine, Witness people harassed me about wearing a neck tie, and the Witness people told my sons to shun me. The Witness people I know have been mean, unethical, and unreliable. They made it easy to not want to be around them.
  
  
  
  
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  Kenneson

  The Bible identifies Jesus as "the Way, the Truth and the Life." (John 14:6) It's all about a Person and my relationship to Him. Rather than point to Jesus as the Truth, the Watchtower Society usurps Jesus' position. It claims that no one can have the "truth" and understand the Bible without their explanations. What arrogance! Mankind has had the Bible for eons before the Watchtower Society came into existence in 1881. Rather than have mankind wait in darkness until the Watchtower's "light" came along, why didn't Jehovah just give us the Bible at the same time He supposedly "gave" us the Watchtower Society rather than do such a non-sensical thing?
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  Heatmiser

  Some of my best friends are witnesses and part of me feels reluctant to talk to them about anything I have concern with.

  This statement speaks volumes for itself. You as a thinking person already KNOWS that something smells fishy.