JW's at my door tommorow!

zev

yep, they were here yesterday, and gwen asked them to come back saturday at 10.

i've ben waiting for an oportunity to "reverse witness" to them for 3 years now, and i have a chance to do something good here.

where do i start?

what would you do?

I'll begin with a wager, how long will you remain cool?

Kill them with kindness. If they suspect that your out to get them they will excuse themselves, if their experienced.

I'm interested in the results.

Guest77

zev

ah....i shall be kind. i have no plans to jump in their junk. i want to educate them, not build walls to scale..

Mary

Hmmm........where to start............decisions, decisions!

I've always thought that if you can make them see the false date of 607 BCE, that can get them questioning the whole Organization. I've found through experience, that as long as you believe that Jesus returned invisibly to "set up the Kingdom" in 1914 and that the F&DSC were appointed in 1918 or 1919 (can't remember which year), that every other error in this religion can be explained away by "new light".

By casting doubt on the whole 1914/1919 date, it will make them stop and wonder about the whole structure of the Organization.

You might also want to mention the UN fiasco with stuff printed off from the UN's website PROVING that the WTS was an active member for over 10 years. Most Witnesses still know nothing about this and it would be a shocker for them, especially if you've got written proof. You may also want to download the Society's official response and then show how it would be impossible for them NOT to know they were upholding the UN by being a member. That would throw an Dub for a loop.

Or, seeing as the Memorial is coming up, you might want to get some information about how many actually go to heaven. I remember reading in Crisis of Conscience, that Ray and others came to the conclusion when they read about the Great Crowd in Revelation, that it was clear this is a second group of people not on earth---but in heaven. I would also ask them where on earth they came up with the ridiculous idea that Jesus is the Mediator ONLY for 144,000 when the bible clearly states he's the Mediator for all mankind.

Don't let them jump from topic to topic. Make them stay on one topic until they realize they have no answer. I guarantee they won't come back.

Good luck and let us know how it goes!

rebel8

You might also want to mention the UN fiasco with stuff printed off from the UN's website PROVING that the WTS was an active member for over 10 years.

OP, I think the UN thing is a great topic for your project tomorrow. I don't have much knowledge on this topic, but I heard that the WTS also told the press they never really were members....they just signed up for a library card to have access to the UN library. Yet, apparently, in order to be a NGO, there are application forms that must be submitted and re-submitted to maintain NGO status....not just a library card. In other words, the WTS lied about it!

vitty

I would start with Jesus not being our mediator, unbelievebly most JWs think he is. I know I did and I had studied that watchtower, it didnt sink in until I read about it on freeminds, and looked up the watchtower again and saw that Jehovah is my "grand father" thier words. I was absorlutly shocked!!!

Im sorry I dont know which watchtower it was in now, but if that doesnt make them think, I dont know what will

If you go straight into 607 you might put them on the defensive and I dont think most dubs care about dates anyway

AlmostAtheist

If you're going to go the UN route, you might also want to print off the YMCA article from the CD. It was a Questions from Readers, something like, "Is it wrong for one of your members to join the YMCA?" Just search on YMCA, you'll find it. It says that it would be inappropriate for a JW to join the YMCA, even just to get access to the pool. So why can the Watchtower join the UN to get access to the library?

I was shocked to see how often they misquote outside sources. Quoting a person to make it appear that he's anti-Trinity, without carrying enough context to show he's an atheist, for instance. Or where they quoted Dawkins, making it look like he thought there just might be a god. When you look at the source material, that wasn't his point at all.

Dave

Effervescent

I just found a book yesterday called "Answering Jehovahs Witnesses" by David A. Reed. An awesome book by the way. Im going to go out and look for more of his books when Im done with this one.

He has a lot of great suggestions for turning around the thinking of dyed in the wool JWs. The main point he had I think is to not give them any reason to think that youre attacking their doctrine or belief system. They are so ingrained with the thought of not giving an "apostate" any chance to worm their "demonic" thinking into their brains that they will put up their guards right off the bat.

He suggests using the approach that you have sincere questions to make them think that they may actually really help you. He also said that you have to initially cause them to question for themselves the leadership and authority of the GB. You have to strike at the base to topple the tree, so to speak. By asking leading questions (with an angelic countanence of course) you can introduce doubt regarding doctrinal flip flops, prophetic failures, and cover-ups. By causing them to doubt the leadership, (while they *think* they are teaching you) you will help them get through the brainwashing. Only then will they be able to begin questioning their own faith in the doctrine.

Its hard getting through to people who are so programmed. I know... I have a family full of them- hence the reading matter.

I dont know if that helps... Just thought Id share some information I found helpful for myself. My first instinct would be to attack attack attack!

Effie

Poztate

Well I always wanted to know why if jesus started his reign in 1914 and just about all of revelation has already happened as explained in the "climax" book (love that word) why we are still going to the memorial that looks forward to him coming??

Also do the 90 or so years that christ has been reigning already come off of the thousand year reign?? Does this mean that those of the remnant here on earth (non GB) get the short end of the stick compared to those "lucky"enough to die right away and start ruling??

Also if a member of the remnant (long standing) decides to go to bethel to help to "govern" why do they assign him to clean toilets to start with instead of inviting him to be a member of the GB??

Have fun with it Zev....You know it is hard to impossible to make a dent on any dub's brain cells.You just have to look at the WT clones who are still posting here to see the truth.

IT'S MEMORIAL... THEY ARE THINKING MEMORIAL... NOW IS THE TIME FOR MEMORIAL QUESTIONS..

zev

hmmm.

interesting, thanks for the input.

i haven't decided what to do. maybe, just let them decide what they want to talk about and go from their. i'm sure that anything they want to talk about, will have something i can run with.