Questions for those who know...

by newholland 17 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  NewLight2

  Additional thoughts on the JW belief system:
  
  Jw's believe in a two class system of salvation - The "anointed class" and the "other sheep class". They believe that most of the NT, or "Christian Greek Scriptures" as they call it, only applies to the "anointed class" and does not apply to the "other sheep class" to which most JW's today belong. (Unless you were born in 1935 or before you are considered one of the "other sheep class".)
  
  This two class salvation belief is why a JW can read the book of Romans and NOT see what is really being taught. All the while they are reading it, they are thinking to themselves, "This passage does not apply to ME, it only applies to the annointed ones." God's New Covenet does not include the "other sheep class" to which they belong.
  
  In effect, they have put themselves back under the Jewish System of Laws. Most of the Watchtower study articles deal with OT subjects. The NT is used only when convienent to bring out some point that the WT wants to make.
  
  You asked if their Bible was different from the NIV - the simple answer is: "Yes it is very different".
  
  The NWT is a very JW biased work. The writers started with a 'set of doctines' and wrote the NWT to fit within that pattern. Many words were added and many words were changed to make the passage 'fit just right'. Whole books have been written on the subject. I'm sure that you can find many web pages that will also explain how the NWT has been 'corrupted' from the original Hebrew and Greek texts.
  
  JW's measure "spirituality" by the number of hours that one puts in going door to door and the FAITHFUL attendance at the 5 weekly meetings. The more 'service hours' one has per month and the more meetings attended equates to being 'strong in the truth' or being 'very spiritual'. Someone who misses lots of meeting and has low service hours is said to be 'weak in the truth' or 'spirituality weak'. One's personal relationship with the Creator is never even once considered as a mark of spirituality.
  
  NewLight2
• 

  Honesty

  As for the 144,000.......these are a special group who will live in heaven with Jesus and act as a government over those who will live forever on the earth. Both groups are composed of only Jehovahs Witnesses.

  Let's cut to the chase. If those in that special group who act as a government are represented by the Governing Body of Satan's Jehovah's Witnesses, I pass.

  Destroy me at Armageddon you hateful demonic Watch Tower god, if you can.

  That's all I've got to say 'bout that.
• 

  Chance

  Hello newholland, (And hello everyone else, sorry I've been gone. I was really interested in some of the discussions we were having on these forums but I had a death in the family and havent really had the time to sit down and catch-up with things here.) I just thought I would mention one site that has really helped me understand doctrinal issues with the JW(and my family). www.witforjesus.org Perticularly I enjoyed the "Audio library" section under JW.
• 

  newholland

  To All: It's late, maybe that's why all this is confusing to me. No where in the Bible does it say there is a class of "other sheep". My DH tried to talked to them 3 yrs. ago and got nowhere, so we've dropped that and witness by showing love and compassion. If you know Jesus Christ and accept Him as your Savior, then you are going to heaven, works don't get you there. If you are trying to live the life God want's and you are seeking His direction, then yes, you will do good works but not to get into heaven.

  How, just how do they brainwash these people? I will have to check out websites above that were recommended. Thanks so much. Nothing is any clearer to me, though. Toodles for now....... I'll check back tomorrow.
• 

  NewLight2

  newholland,
  
  I can truely understand your basic confusion with the JW belief system. A book that may help you sort it all out in your mind is:
  
  "Reasoning from the Scriptures with the Jehovah's Witnesses"
  by Ron Rhodes
  Harvest House Publishers c/r 1993
  
  ISBN 1-56507-106-9
  It can be ordered by most bookstores
  
  
  Chapter 10 deals with the "other sheep" vs "anointed ones" doctrine and will be quite helpful to you.
  
  
  There are some on this forum who will disagree with some parts of the book, but it will help in understanding the basic diferences between Evangelical beliefs and those of the JW's.
  
  NewLight2
• 

  NewLight2

  newholland,
  
  Here is something else that may help you to understand the JW Doctrinal System. Basically their belief structure is just the reverse of that of the Evangelical belief system. It is as if you turned the doctrinal structure upside down.
  
  Quoted from:
  ?Understanding Jehovah?s Witnesses: Why They Read the Bible the way they do"
  pp. 91-92
  
  by Robert M Bowman, Jr.
  C/r 1991 Baker Book House
  ISBN 0-8010-0995-2
  
  
  "Doctrinally, the Jehovah?s Witnesses? beliefs tend to be self-reinforcing . . . The first level I would characterize as the primary doctrinal system. This is the system of interlocking doctrinal beliefs that constitutes the Jehovah?s Witnesses? main belief structure, their view of God and the world. These doctrines are interdependent and thus both rely on each other and serve to reinforce each other.
  
  Beginning where Charles Taze Russell began?the denial of eternal punishment?it is possible to see how all major doctrines of the Jehovah?s Witnesses interrelate, as follows:
  
  There is no hell,
  Because death is annihilation. But if that is so,
  Jesus cannot be God, because Jesus died, and God cannot be annihilated.
  Therefore the Trinity is false. But if that is so,
  The Holy Spirit must not be a divine person.
  
  Moreover, if Jesus was annihilated, there is no reason to expect that his body would be raised form the dead.
  Thus we may conclude that Jesus was raised as a spirit.
  But that implies that Jesus will not return physically to the earth.
  Therefore, his second advent will be a spiritual presence rather than a physical return.
  
  This allows his second presence to be understood to be happening at this time, unseen except to those who have spiritual insight.
  
  Moreover, if Jesus is a spirit and is to remain forever in heaven, and yet the Bible teaches both that there will be a bodily resurrection and that some will live with Christ and share his nature, that implies that there will be two classes of the redeemed?an earthly class and a heavenly class.
  
  If there is a heavenly class as well as an earthly class, then it follows that the requirements for admission to one class will be somewhat different from the requirements for admission to the other.
  
  Therefore, it makes sense to say that admission to the earthly class requires works in addition to faith and is basically a matter of proving oneself worthy, whereas admission to the heavenly class as a higher privilege is based solely on God?s choice?with the qualification that members of the heavenly class all fulfill the requirements for membership in the earthly class.
  
  This explains why some parts of the Bible speak of salvation as requiring obedience and good works, while others speak of everlasting life with God as a free gift.
  
  From this somewhat simplified presentation it should be clear that to challenge any one of these beliefs will have to ve perceived as a challenge, as least indirectly to the whole system. Thus, whenever confidence in one part of the system is challenged, the Jehovah?s Witnesses? confidence in the rest of the system bolsters their confidence in the part under attack."
• 

  mnb77

  Went to JW "memorial talk" for a friend. I'm not gonna give too many details, because I don't want to lose connection I have with our friends. I have done a little research on JWs, and now I am confused. The elder who gave the talk closed in prayer saying something to the effect of "in the name of Jesus Christ the Son of God". I thought JWs believed Jesus was a man or angel who became a man and that they did not believe He was the son of God. ... Also, he said the 144,000 would be the governing force over the rest of those here in Paradise on Earth. I thought 144,000 was the entire amount and no more. I really wanted to flip through my friend's Bible and see how it compared to my NIV Bible but that would have been very obvious. Any insights would be appreciated. I felt like this elder was saying what he did to make us "others" feel comfortable and that it was a lie. ?? I was listening very carefully, so I know I did not misunderstand. When we left my friend that I went with stated the same thing. What's up?? JW's pray in the name of christ because this is what the bible tell them to do, but they don't pray to christ, because that was never told for them to do. Jesus is God's son, but in terms of 1st angel type of thing. Mormon's had the thing with christ being a man who earned up to glorification (god-hood) JW believe that only 144,000 will be in heaven reigning with christ type of thing, but everyone has the opportunity for paradise. in order to be part of the 144000, you needed to be born before the 1935 point and several other factors and only those in the choosen group can take communion (actually eating the bread and wine) The bible thing, they interpret the bible wrong New World Translation. Some differences occur in John 1:1 where Christ is a god, not God. Colossians has several verses where they (society) inserted several "other" and different words. To check it out for yourself look at the JW website http://www.watchtower.org/bible/index.htm check it out for yourself. they are slick speakers. they have talented ways of speaking to people, but much of the translation differences in the NWT, have gramatical errors from greek to english. becareful and pray often!
• 

  mnb77

  Here is an example of how the New World Translation is incorrect:

  The Jehovah's Witnesses teach their followers that the Bible teaches that Jesus is "a" god instead of God incarnate. They have mistranslated (either intentionally or unintentionally) John 1:1, which reads:
  
  "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." (John 1:1 NKJV)
  
  The typical Jehovah's Witness will tell you that the actual wording of John 1:1 reads:
  "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god."
  
  They claim that the definite article "a" is in the original Greek, and that Jesus is "a" god (little g) and not part of the triune Godhead of the Trinity.
  
  Several problems arise right away. First, the original Greek does not insert the definite article "a" in the text.
  Secondly, there is no "little g" in the Translation. Here is the original Greek writing along with the English translation, which most Jehovah's Witnesses refer to, yet still claim that an "a" and lower case g are present:
  
  http://www.hopeandreason.org/jw.htm (see middle to this page for Greek translation of John 1:1)
  
  You've got to see the page in order to see get the translation from Greek to English. this page has some information about JW's, but I thought that the translation was neat.

  Guard your heart!