by JH 35 Replies latest jw friends
In the book of Revelation, talking about things to come, Babylone the Great is to be destroyed, in one hour.
Some think that Babylon the Great symbolizes America, while others like the JW's say it's the false relgions that will be destroyed by the UN...
Who do you think Babylon the Great represents?
I think I married the whore!
ROME - So don't worry about it!
Rome is a diversion. Scripture is clear who the whore is.
God is not the author of *confusion* or Mystery Babylon
Jerusalem is called a city of *confusion* in Isaiah 24:10.
Israel is a whore, an adulterous rejected queen, and a witch practicing sorcery: *but draw near hither, ye sons of the sorceress, the seed of the adulterer and the whore (Isaiah 57:3* (This is illegitimate Israel. The remnant of the Godly Israel all came into the New Israel, the New Testament Church).
The city of Jerusalem became a harlot, full of murderers: *How is the faithful city become an harlot! It was full of judgment; righteousness lodged in it; but now murderers (Isaiah 1:21)*.
Israel was a fornicating wife: *But thou didst trust in thine own beauty, and playedst the harlot because of thy renown, and pouredst out thy fornication on every one that passed by; his it was (Ezekiel 16:15)*.
Israel was old in her adultery: *Then said I unto her that was old in adulteries, Will they now commit whoredom with her, and she with them (Ezekiel 23:43)*?
The judgment of the great whore: *And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither, I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth (is scattered) upon many waters (Revelation 17:1)*.
The whore of Babylon further proven: 1.) Jeremiah 2:20-Israel played the harlot. 2.) Jeremiah 3:1-Israel played the harlot. 3.) Jeremiah 3:8-Israel is divorced per Deuteronomy 4:1-4. 4.) Ezekiel 16:15- Playedst the harlot and whore. 5.) Hosea 1:2-Israel a wife of whoredom. 6.) Hosea 1:9-Lo-Ammi, ye are not my people.
Mystery Babylon is apostate Judaism in all of her adulterous fame. Only by Rome joining the secret societies through mystical connection to Judaistic gnosticism has she become a daughter of the great whore. Only by Islam also being brought into the family by joining the secret societies and producing Arabic freemasonry has she become a daughter. Judaism claims that she is the mother of both mystical Catholicism and mystical Islam. The whore and her harlot daughters are thus identified. The Whore of Mystery Babylon can not hide her endtime identity any longer. Several other facts will identify her:
The Woman = Jerusalem
The Woman has killed the Saints - the Prophets, Apostles, and Jesus (Revelation 11:8; 17:6; 18: 20,24).
Jerusalem has killed the Saints - the Prophets, Apostles, and Jesus (Matthew 23:29-36; Luke 6:22-23, 26; 11:47-52; 13:28,33-34; Acts 2:23,36; 3:15; 4:10; 5:30; 7:51-52; Romans 11:2-5; 1 Corinthians 2:7-8; 1 Thessalonians 2:14-15, James 5:10).
The 7 Mountains (Revelation 17:9) refer to Jerusalem, not Rome. The seven mountains upon which Jerusalem was built are Mount Zion, Mount Ophel, Mount Moriah, Mount Bezetha, Mount Acra, Mount Gareb, and Mount Goath.
Notice of Divorce
In Jeremiah 31:32, God said he was ?an husband? to Israel. In Jeremiah 3:8-14 and Isaiah 50:1, God states that he was married to Israel, and gave Israel a bill of divorcement, because Israel committed adultery. This occured around 721 B.C.
The text itself assumes Rome to be Babylon the Great, and this was a common designation in post-70 Judaism and Christianity. Think about the similarities. Like Babylon, Rome was a world empire, situated on a river, which destroyed Jerusalem. Quite a few Jewish pseudepigraphal works circulated in the late first century A.D., including 2 Baruch and 4 Ezra -- apocalyptic works very much in the vein of Revelation -- which described the destruction of Jerusalem in coded language referring to the first assault by Nebuchadnezzer. The Sybilline Oracles, especially the fourth book, also unmistakably refers to Rome as Babylon and even links the coming destruction of Babylon with Nero redivivus, a character also latent in Revelation (cf. ch. 9, 13). The Protestant idea that Roman Catholicism was Babylon the Great (which the JWs have generalized to all other religions other than themselves) is itself based on the ancient understanding that Rome was the Babylon referred to in Revelation.
I don't think anthing on this matter is clear but this;
The Watchtower Society never got anything right when interpreting matters of prophetic significance - neither has anyone else that I have seen in modern times - but there will always be those who think they know! And they will be proved wrong since the scriptures say it is a 'mystery' -
But someone will always claim to have the 'obvious answer' - why swallow more nonsense after getting out of the mire we were in? Interpreters are a dime a dozen - and worth about as much. No offense intended to anyone here.
Just my opinion
Jeff
stop lying leo, Rome was never married to God, only Israel was. Than in Jeremiah 3:8 God divorces Israel for her WHOREDOM.
| Jeremiah 3:8 | And I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, and given her a bill of divorce; yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not, but went and played the harlot also. |
Jeremiah 2:20-Israel played the harlot
Jeremiah 3:1-Israel played the harlot.
Ezekiel 16:15- Playedst the harlot and whore.
Hosea 1:2-Israel a wife of whoredom.
Ianone....Let's please be civil and not accuse another a liar for having a different opinion. I gave good reasons for the traditional understanding from the literature from the time. As for your arguments, where does Revelation, ch. 17-19, refer to the whore has having been previously married to God? In the OT, both Israel and Babylon (cf. Isaiah 47:7-8) were described as whores. But it is the scriptures referring to Babylon that are used in this passage in Revelation. See, for instance, Jeremiah 51:6-7, 13:
"Escape out of Babylon (save your lives, each one of you); do not perish yourselves in her punishment, for this is the time of Yahweh's vengeance: he is paying her her reward! Babylon was a golden cup in Yahweh's hand, she made the whole world drunk, the nations drank her wine and then went mad. Babylon has suddenly fallen, is broken: lament for her! ... Enthroned beside abundant waters, rich in treasures, you now meet your end, the finish of your pillaging".
These words are directly employed in Revelation 17-18. Note especially how the sentence about her making "the whole world drunk, the nations drank her wine" is specifically interpreted as "drunk with the wine of her adultery". The text also alludes heavily to the oracles against Tyre in Ezekiel 27-28, as well as Isaiah 23:17 referring to the city who "will play the whore with all the kingdoms on the surface of the earth". The language far better fits Rome (which was like Babylon also enthroned beside a river, unlike Jerusalem), and Jerusalem or Israel had no such effect on the world at large, making them "drunk" (being herself a dependency on Rome).
Right on Leolaia -
I do not know where you get your research materials - and I don't always agree - but I know of no one on this forum that presents a more concise and clear argumentation on the battles you pick to enter - you have my respect for your diligence
Jeff
Here?s another twist; the ?woman? in Rev. 12, might be the same ?woman? mentioned in Rev. 17. The ?woman? began as the Jewish system that produced the ?male child,? the promised Messiah. When the New Covenant became active and the Mosaic Law was terminated, the ?woman? continued as the Christen system. Rev. 12:6 says that she ?fled into the wilderness,? initially under God?s protection; no mention is made that she leaves the "wilderness." However, later, she comes out of the ?wilderness,? but now as a ?harlot? (Rev. 17). This seems to correspond to period when the ?Christian Church? became the state religion, even seating and dethroning Kings.
