Is Early Christianity the Basis For JW Practices? (page 2)

IP_SEC

The basis for this religion is Pharisaical Judaism.

Here, here. (insert clapping smiley)

I wasn't intending to present a defense of early Christianity here. I intended to offer a reference list against which the JW claims of being based on early Christianity can be evaluated. I apologize if I conveyed a wrong impression.

minimus,

I disagree. Pharisaical Judaism could have learned a lot about manipulation, gnat straining, and camel swallowing from the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses. Just kidding , spot on, spot!

Respectfully,
OldSoul

M.J.

Great topic. I have been meaning to get the book entitled, Paul's Idea of Community - The Early House Churches in Their Historical Setting. Not sure how good a book it is but it would be great to know more about the 1st century church, which the JWs claim they are a continuation of. For the record, so do the Mormons, the Iglesia ni Cristo, the Restored Church of God, Living Church of God, United Church of God, the Way International, the International Churches of Christ, etc....

Good point about Paul not corresponding with Jerusalem for so many years. But this brings up another point. Since Jerusalem and its church was totally wiped out in 70AD, what happened to the supposed organization then?

If so it would seem your 144,000 teaching is in danger because that number could have easily been filled by the end of the 1st century.

Think about this. About 70 years elapsed from the founding of the church until the writings of John. This is the church established by Christ and the Apostles themselves. Yet the WTS must claim that in those 70 years this pure church could not have realized much over 100,000 conversions. By the time John was writing in the 90s CE he never even hinted at an encroaching limit to the seats available in heaven, suggesting quite the opposite. In CONTRAST, the followers of Rutherford grew by about 5 million in 70 years. And by their own admission they started pretty far removed from the "pure" teachings of the original church, with new light coming in throughout the years to get closer to that ideal standard.

Was it that slow going for the early church? Well Acts 2:41 shows that 3,000 were saved in one day alone...

Honesty

JWism is just an apocalyptic cult that twists scriptures to fit its ever-changing doctrines of light. The only thing they have in common with early christianity is Acts 20:28-30:
29 I know that after my going away oppressive wolves will enter in among YOU and will not treat the flock with tenderness, 30 and from among YOU yourselves men will rise and speak twisted things to draw away the disciples after themselves.

lawrence

Mind you, the apostles had the gifts and were not passing out tracts, so obviously the "numbers swelled." The apostles had real power, not DF decrees from micro-managers, bozos, and common goons. The apostles taught, these bastards "lord over." The Pharisees were a step above the WTS (that's piss poor). These bastards have always used Armageddon better than the Inquisition used HELL.

Lieu

They're Millerites. Prophecy nuts. Consumed with doom and gloom for their own selfish purposes. Like Jonah, and unlike Abraham God's friend, JWs are elated to go give a death message to the inhabitants of modern Ninevah....and would be pissed if people didn't get killed for repenting. Abraham, on the other hand, would be bargaining for lives to the end as he did in the case of Sodom and Gomorrah.

JWs whole premise for existance as God's channel is their being "in the know" of when Christ returned (um, invisibly)....and that 1914 date wasn't even the one,of the many, chosen by the originators of the religion.

What amazes me is that every Biblical writer (AD) said no one knows when Christ's return would be, not even Christ.....but nooooooo! Millerites and their spawn offspring JWs HAVE to keep trying to say and guess exactly when it will be in defiance to God.

Its like Adam and Eve .... God can't have his own tree .... Adam and Eve stole from God when they ate from His tree.

With JWs he can't have his own "appointed time" ...JWs are obsessed with trying to steal the date from God.

Begin rant...

The reason you see no signs of Christianity (love, inner happiness, Good Samaritan behavior, bible wisdom) in JWism is because their leaders are all up on a tree they don't belong on, like a certain snake. Its not about the happy message Christ or the Apostles preached. JWs are obsessed with dates and the big A, not the Bible's message of love. They're focused on the negative not the positive.

Hypocrites! Sons of vipers! Making God's word meaningless with all their stupid rman made rules. God's word the Bible; who needs that thing anyway? We don't need a Bible, we have something better than God's word. We have the Watchtower rag coming from imperfect men who claim not to be prophets although appointed but not....'cause the Bible is not good enough for us by itself.

I feel much better now. End rant.

Terry

There is a flaw in the premise. A fly in the ointment. A monkey wrench in the works. (Or, spanner, if you prefer).

Early Christianity wasn't JUST ONE THING. It was many things. Many things contradictory to one another.

Early Christianity was a fragmentation of transitional Judaism without a priesthood and a politically correct protective cabal.

Doctrines were all over the map. So too practices.

Several councils were convoked by the various heads of state (Constantine, for example) to stop the internecine squabbles.

All to little avail. A doctrine or creed would take a majority opinion and the other faction would be anathema. Then, a polar shift would take place the "disfellowshipped group" would find favor. Back and forth over time.

Eventually it took the fist of the state to smash the splinter groups into enough political weakness to render them unviable.

They became like the International bible students after Russell died. They are a flicker of an Adventist splinter group. One splinter became 7th Day Adventist, another became Jehovah's Witnesses and another the IBS. etc.

So, there was no "there" there for modern day Jehovah's Witnesses to conform to. THAT IS A MYTH OF THEIR OWN MAKING.

I repeat: early Christianity as a model for modern true worship is A MYTHOLOGY created solely for ad hoc orthodoxy.

This is an important thought.

greendawn

A door to door preaching would certainly be suicidal and out of the question after the emperor Domitian made Christianity a capital crime around 90AD. And the early christians partook of the bread and wine every Sunday not once a year.

Terry I am not an expert in early Christian history (33-313 AD) but my impression is that it was not so highly fragmented.There were pro mosaic law jewish christians. Also there were agnostic sects but we don't think of them as part of mainstream early christianity. The rest of the christian church was fairly unified in doctrine.

Narkissos

There were pro mosaic law jewish christians. Also there were agnostic sects but we don't think of them as part of mainstream early christianity. The rest of the christian church was fairly unified in doctrine.

Imo the problem precisely lies within our retrospective representation of "mainstream early christianity": the pattern of Church history as drawn from Luke-Acts down to Eusebius does not accurately represent the antagonistic teachings and practices attested elsewhere in the NT (e.g. Matthew or James vs. Paul, Mark or John) and in later literature (e.g. the Judeo-Christian portions of the pseudo-Clementines which depict Paul as an apostate, or the gnostic writings in Nag Hammadi). To put it differently, "the early Church" is a mythical retrojection of the later "great Church," sweeping the real complexity of Christian origins under the carpet.

ozziepost

Narkissos. From what I've learned (since not relying on the WTS!!!!!) this would be my response too.

As a sidelight, I've been with a church which sought to establish a "first century" fellowship - it just didn't work - our conclusion (or maybe just mine!) was that we were ignoring the context of the times.

Is Early Christianity the Basis For JW Practices?

Share this