New to site - letting it out

by jimakazi 25 Replies latest jw friends

  • jimakazi
    jimakazi

    It is interesting to read the comments of so many who are no longer "in the truth". I have not associated for 18 years but as my parents are still very much "in the truth". I never disassociated myself as I feel to do so is to acknowledge some form of official status over me. They have no authority over me.

    Currently one of my parents is about to undergo surgery for cancer so for my parents there is an intense need to believe. However due to their belief it appears that they have missed many oportunites to enjoy the present, and maybe it's too late.

    I have no strong objections to people who are Jehovahs Witnesses, on average they are well meaning and try hard to lead good lives.

    However I disagree with many of their beliefs; and as I have found to seek to raise such "doubts" AKA rational questions, is to invite accustations of appostacy, and near histeria from ones parents, let alone elders. I find it ironic that they challenge people to question their belief if they are of another faith and ahve a bible study, but once a witness you are not permitted to question anything. The so called "book study" and "watch tower" study where you repeat what is written in the text in resposne to prepared questions, with children and new converts reading ansers and the older more lnger term convicts [oops] putting it into their own words - such intellectual challenge! And if you no longer beleive where do you go - if you can no longer beleive in a trinity, and cannot accept hell - then you better be strong enough in yourself to not need a formal religion any more.

    There is no soul: They don't seem to have thought this one through, what good is a resurection if there is no soul? They seem to think that a clone / with your thoughts and memory is "you", personally this is just too creepy to contemplate - pod people anyone?

    Birthdays are Unscriptual: There is no scriptual basis for this stand - other than sheer bloody mindedness. I can remember my parents proudly declaring how they could give gifts at any time of the year and thinking "if only". Now I have my own kids I celebrate their birth with all the joy I can.

    That they have the only truth, and at armagedon all not JW's will die; Since leaving I have encounted many good people with true faith [as in belief without evidence]. My answer to this is a scenario that goes like this; A highschool, the principal puts the final exam notice up in a crytic code. There is much debate and he refuses to give any sign he is in the office. Some kids turn up on when they thought the exam would be, but there was no exam, some eother kids turn up and they are lucky, sit and pass their exams, the kids from the 1st group and all the kids who thought it was tomorrow have just failed. As imperfect human beings would we accept this? That principals arse would be toast - right? Yet we are expected to beleive that Jehovah puts critical information pertinant to our very survivial in cryptic bible passages, gives no sign that he favours any one of thousands of faiths, yet will kill you forever for not figuring it out, [AKA trusting the Watch Tower Bible and Tract society to get it right]. If this is indeed true then this would be a god I could not respect let alone love. I will NOT love someone just because to do otherwise measn they will kill me - it's insane.

    That there was a worldwide flood; So the Kanagaros exited the Ark and thought "strewth mate - I'm outa here" and hoped off to Australia. Of course early Kangaroos were bigger and could hop over ocenas in a single hop, or could hop so fast they hoped on water. The Koala bear went along for the ride as did the wombat. Kiwis [a flightless bird - and a whole lot of flightless birds come to think of it] thought "middle earth" AKA New Zealand would be a great place to hang out and "teleported" or otherwise magically gott themselves off the ark to the southern hemisphere. You can add you own local touch to this [I'm from New Zealand] but it just doesn't stack up in light of the physical evidence.

    That there is no evolution; How come you can take blind cave fish with no eyes, and raise some in light and within a few generations the offspring have eyes? Seems to be some very advanced enviromental feedback at work - and I'm prepared to give God credit, but to deny eveloution is once agian to have ones head in the sand.

    That they are guided by "holy spirit". When I was about 20 I was as "in to it" as I ever got and spent almost every Saturday with my brother and best friend [none of whom are now JW's] witnessing in remote rural areas where others were reluctant to go as it involved driving up to 300km's in a single day. On Sundays we landscpaed the grounds of the newly built kingdom hall. The circut overseer came and went and one of our friends [secretly drinking, hooning around in his car, listening to ACDC] was made a "ministerial servant" - he was putting on an act to secure the attentions of a young "sister", although ironically he's now still "in the truth" and an elder. As I have since found out from my dad [who was one of the leders] It turned out the elders "suspected" we were just mucking arround on the Saturdays so we were passed over [thanks for the support!]. It shook our faith so to prove that holy spirit" has nothing to do with this we embarked on a deliberate campaign to test the system. We stopped the rural witnessing, stopped landscaping the hall, dropped out level of particiaption at meetings, then we witnessing for a couple of hours on a Saturady, on Sunday afternoons, and shortly before the circuit overseer returned massively upped our levels of participation at the meetings - and now we were appointed "ministerial servants" by the seemily blind "holy spirit". Why blind? well just as for our friend the "Holy Spirit" either didn't see or apparently didn't mind our going to night clubs dancing to "worldly" music, or drinking, or speeding in our cars. It was being seen to conform by the elders that mattered, nothing else, it wasn't anything to do with gog, it was politics. From this point on I only kept going for a few years more to avoid hurting my parents.

    In the end they seemed to be saying if you were a witness for the wrong reasons [i.e. any reason other than loving Jehovah, such as to please someone else, to avoid death at armagedon] then god would know and you would die anyway. So I stopped. And since I have been told it's better to doit for the worong reasons than not do it at all, or so my children will be saved. When I was serrously injured in a motorcyle accident my mothers comment was there would have been an up side if I had been killed - I would have gotten a resurection. Did I mention "INSANE".

    Anyway I need to finish, my wife ias complaining that I am writing a novel. I guess it's just some kind of release to be able to say these things in a forum where I won't be the bad guy. I should have sought this site out long ago. I guess I'm wrong - they do have some form of hold on me as now 18 years later it still afects my life and my relationship with my parents.

    The saddest thing is that my father consideres himself a failure; why? because his two sons, both happily married, with childern, no afairs, not one arrest, sucessful in business, respected in their fields, are no longer Jehovahs Witnesses. It is INSANE.

  • ozziepost
    ozziepost

    May I simply say "Welcome aboard!"

    I trust that in time, by sharing experiences etc, you will feel you have benefitted greatly from your deciding to make this first post.

    Thanks for sharing.

    Cheers, Ozzie (Down Under class)

  • IP_SEC
    IP_SEC

    jim,

    Welcome to the board. Sorry about your parent. Agrees with you on each point I do.

    Post on please.

  • MidwichCuckoo
    MidwichCuckoo

    Jimakazi - welcome, welcome, welcome

    Can appreciate so much what you're saying - the ''so wanting'' the future, they cannot enjoy the present. Am sorry to hear that one of your parents is having to undergo surgery - must be a difficult time for you all.

    You made me laugh though :-

    When I was serrously injured in a motorcyle accident my mothers comment was there would have been an up side if I had been killed - I would have gotten a resurection. Did I mention "INSANE". .....

    The saddest thing is that my father consideres himself a failure; why? because his two sons, both happily married, with childern, no afairs, not one arrest, sucessful in business, respected in their fields, are no longer Jehovahs Witnesses. It is INSANE.

    You let your parents down TWICE - lol - first you DON'T die, and THEN you go and get a good job and a stable family - how selfish is THAT? LOL
  • Black Sheep
    Black Sheep

    Hi jimakazi

    Welcome to the board. It's nice to see another kiwi here.

    The saddest thing is that my father consideres himself a failure; why? because his two sons, both happily married, with childern, no afairs, not one arrest, sucessful in business, respected in their fields, are no longer Jehovahs Witnesses. It is INSANE.

    You got that right. My father is is the same boat and he hasn't got a paddle either.

    Enjoy your stay.

    Chris

  • Jeffro
    Jeffro
    I never disassociated myself as I feel to do so is to acknowledge some form of official status over me.


    I didn't disassociate myself either. I actually wrote them a letter specifically stating that they were not to make any announcement saying that I was either 'disfellowshipped' or 'disassociated'.

    But they 'disassociated' me anyway. They didn't 'disfellowship' me because I hadn't done anything they could get me for, but because the elders couldn't counter any of the faulty beliefs I highlighted to them, they said I had 'disassociated' in case I try to 'stumble' anyone.

  • jimakazi
    jimakazi

    Thanks for the welcome.

    I think I'll be doing a lot of reading of the posts. I've already read one where the peron talked about being a "neutral witness". I was the same - the meetings didn't work for me any more I was bored, however when a young elder and his wife set up a Saturday evening group for the youth in the congregation they were made to stop. It didn't conform, if we were not getting "enough" from the meetings then there was something wrong - somehow it was not scriptual because the Govening body didn't say to do it!

    For those still witnesses it would for them if there was some fresh blood injected into the givening body - but with that only being made up of the annointed who are mostly old people there's no chance is there?

    Interestingly how come it's so wrong for the Pope to be gods representative on earth but Ok for them??? At least the catholic church has admitted it has done things wrong and asked forgiveness. So whens the Govening body going to do the same. I must admit to being shocked with the 1934 Greman Year book declaration that appears to be outright anti british, USA, and endorses the Nazi Anti Jew sentiment. However it is in some strange way re-assuring, it confirms that the holy spirit was sadly ineffective in 1934 too, and not being an active JW isn't the death sentance for my family my parents think it is.

  • greendawn
    greendawn

    Welcome to the board Jimakazi and congratulations for having seen so acutely through the deceptive propaganda of the WTS.

    The only thing though, about the Australian fauna wasn't there a land connection in ancient days with Asia through which they could pass?

  • JW83
    JW83

    Greendawn, I think the land connection was a little before the Flood (6 thousand years ago?!)

  • kls
    kls

    Welcome Jimakazi to the forum

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