Can't buy god idea! What about Aliens? (page 2)

the_classicist

Oh, I forgot:

3. If they did make themselves known, what would the most important question be for you.

The most important question: Do you speak English?

tetrapod.sapien

The most important question: Do you speak English?

HA HA, LOL!

...as they ask you the equivalent in their language:

ACK ACK AAAAACK, ACK AAACK. ACK AACK ACK; AAACKK???

talesin

IMO, quite likely, when you consider the number of galaxies, stars, planets around those stars, and the prevalence of hydrogen in the universe. the probability of intelligent life is obviously less that the probability of microscopic life.

Ah, think outside the box, carbon-based unit!

Must all life-forms conform to our limited, earthling view of what is necessary to support said life?

tal

tetrapod.sapien

i don't see how it is not thinking outside of my box? (was that a bad thing i just wrote? )

anyways, i did not say what life would be like, just simply how we, as carbon based units calculate probability.

life could be 11 dimensional, for all we know. or some whispy gas-like form of intelligence.

how's that?

TS

talesin

lol, tetra! Yes, science calculates the possibilities on what we know, which is but a grain of sand on the seashore ... possibilities are endless, neh?

I do find that science can be quite pretentious, like the medical community ... PROVE IT, they cry! Why must I prove it? As Sagan says, we have lost so much in recent years .. the true nature of the scientist should include curiosity as a main trait, and an openness to believe in the unbelievable. You know the book, I can't remember the name offhand ...

tal

*you know I was just teasing you, right?

dh

1. How likely do you think it is that life exist away from this planet.

I think it is very likely. It is more unlikely in my opinion that out of the whole universe, we are the only life forms in existence. Likewise all religious people believe in aliens of some sort, if they believe in God, Devil, Angels etc... These are all non-human life forms from a place other than this planet.

2. Do you believe they visit this world (the Greys, Roswell crash, Area 51, etc).

Yes, although I don't know if they were grey or crashed at Roswell.

3. If they did make themselves known, what would the most important question be for you.

Do you want to buy the Watchtower & Awake

greendawn

Even though many stories exist about extra terrestrials and UFOs they are just myths if they really visited the earth everyone would know, extra terrestrial life is sheer speculation to excite the imagination.

DannyBloem

This is a fun topic.

I think the probability is that there are other inhabited planets. It is very difficult (read impossible) to give any estimation of the percentage of planets. It can't be do densely populated though, otherwise we would have more efidence.

That aliens ever visited the earth is very unlickely. In all millions of years there is not any proof.

Maybe the speed of light is absolute barrier and it is just impossible to travel any faster. Then all alien races can't spreat through space too far. E.g. it would be almost impossible to go to aother galaxy. Like andromeda, more then 2 miljoen years raveling, would not make sence.

proplog2

I posted the information below back in 2001 http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/18868/1.ashx I want to report the most significant thing that ever happened to
me. It is an event that I haven't been able to integrate into my
life. It has created a state of cognitive dissonance that I am
sure will last 'til I die.

Having been raised as a JW I have been conditioned to assign all
bizarre phenomena to the antics of demons. Ouija boards? - Demons.
Magic shows ie David Blaine - Demons. Meditation? - Demons. Fortune
Tellers - Demons? This is not an exhaustive list by any means but
I must include UFO's.

I have come to the point in my skepticism where I don't believe
that the poor epileptics in the Bible were demonized. Dilantin is
the preferred way of exorcising demons in epileptics. Demon
possession seems to be quieted if not cured by modern drugs. Ouija
boards don't work if the players are blind folded. etc. But what
about UFO's?

The Watchtower is quick to label UFOs as a subtle tool of Satan.
After all if there really are material entities visiting our planet
who made them? Isn't the earth the sole locus of material life?
Isn't this the only game in the universe? Jehovah's witnesses are
discouraged from speculating about the possibility of humans
eventually populating some other planet. The idea that there may
be some other planet with intelligent inhabitants circling some
other sun is strictly forbidden.

As a skeptic I don't believe that demons cause UFO's. Frankly I
have always been amused by reports of UFO's. Like most people I
cracked jokes about the "types" of people who claimed to see flying
saucers. Until one of these saucers lands on the White House lawn,
and some creatures lifts the hatch and emerges in broad daylight on
national television I didn't think it necessary to take this
phenomena seriously.

THEN IT HAPPENED. THIS IS MY UFO EXPERIENCE.

I work for myself in my basement office. It was about 10:30 pm.
I had been working at my computer for quite a while and decided to
come upstairs for some fresh air and to munch on a little leftover
chicken - maybe catch Jay Leno's monologue.

At about 10:45 (after Jay's monologue) I hear a strange rumbling
sound outside. It sounded a little like a jet airplane but it also
had some strange qualities to the sound. My intuition suggested
that this was not some ordinary sound and that I ought to step
outside and investigate the source. I am usually quick about
checking things out but I decided that it was probably a jet
airplane and I descended into my dungeon/office - without
investigating. I put on my head-set and listened to my favorite
jazz station as I worked on a mailing list.

My wife was up in our bedroom with my 11 yr old daughter sitting on
the bed and doing homework. My 15 year old son was in his bedroom
listening to music before going to sleep. As I sat in the basement
I was vaguely aware that the house was vibrating. After about 15
minutes my wife called me on my business line and told me I ought
to get upstairs and figure out what the loud noise was. No sooner
than I got to the main floor when my son came running out of his
room screaming "holy shit I just saw a meteor or something". The
noise stopped abruptly at that point.

My wife said something passed over the house from the southwest to
the northeast. She claimed her left ear was ringing and hurting
from the noise. My 11 year-old daughter was very disturbed. My
wife said that it sounded like a dozen jet airplanes flew over the
house for the last 20 minutes. I asked my 15 year old son what he
saw. He said that the noise was so loud he couldn't hear his music
so he turned out the light and decided to just go to bed. No
sooner had he pulled open the window shade when he saw a light
about as big as a basket ball and bright as the sun zoom at tree
height from west to east. As soon as the light flashed he said the
sound stopped.

I finally stepped out the front door. I looked all over and didn't
see anything. It was a partly cloudy night with large patches of
stars visible. I got in my car and drove North East hoping to get
a look a what I thought might be some kind of squadron of
helicopters that would possibly explain what my family experienced.
Nothing.

When I got home about mid-night I called the police and asked if
there were any reports of strange noises. The police said it was
a dull night. I called the air-port and asked if there were any
planes in the area? They said nothing big comes in between 9:00pm
and 5:00am. They suggested I call Noise Abatement. I left my
phone number with the noise abatement department.

The next day I saw my next door neighbor and thought I would do a
little reality testing. She said she heard a loud noise that
frightened her kids. She said it shook the house like an earth
quake. She went to her side door and looked up in the sky where it
seemed the noise was coming from and saw nothing. So far this
experience involved 8 people.

Later in the day I saw a neighbor lady (about 27) and I asked her
if she heard a loud noise. She said she thought it was an
earthquake. She stepped outside and stood in the drive way looking
up into the sky but couldn't see anything. That made it 9
witnesses to the sound.

The next day the noise abatement man called me. He said they were
doing some engine testing at about 11pm. I told him that the
airport is three miles away and that I was familiar with that sound
which consists of 5 second thrusts that didn't sound any louder
than a jet take-off three miles away. I asked about the possibility
of some kind of government aircraft. He said all aircraft
including government aircraft would need the required lights. I
asked if it may have been a harrier jet hovering over our house.
He said Harriers hover only a short period of time to enable take-
off and landing because it uses up a tremendous amount of fuel.
Finally he said that he doesn't do UFO reports. I replied that I
don't believe in UFO's. He said that he believes in UFO's and that
we will probably never another similar experience the rest of our
lives.

When I went to the Service Meeting I asked an Elder who lives about
3 blocks Southwest of our house if he heard the strange noise. He
said he was asleep but that his wife and 14 year old son mentioned
that it sounded like something was going to crash into the house.
I asked her about it. She had been really terrified. She said the
house was shaking and that she was too afraid to look out the
window to see what it was. She seemed convinced that it was
something "not of this world and demonic".

About two weeks later we had a JW couple stop over for an evening
of chat. I told them about the strange noise. They live about six
miles southwest of us. They mentioned that they heard it too.
They had gone to bed and were just about asleep. They thought it
was a jet flying very low over their house and rattling things. But
it got really irritating because unlike a jet that may pass over in
15 seconds this went on for a long time. Neither of them looked
outside either.

So there were at least 12 people involved in this experience. The
JW's involved concluded it was probably a UFO/Demons carrying on
some kind of deceptive trick. This is a convenient way to reach a
cheap closure of the event. In my case I carry this experience
close to the surface of my thought processes because of the
implications this has.

There is a place on the web where people can report their UFO
experiences. Every month there is a list of a couple hundred
events. I have examined thousands of these reports and about 5% of
them involve an experience similar to the one I just described. The
main features involve a jet-like roar that shakes the house and
goes on for an unusually long period of time. About half of those
who report the sound also report seeing a huge low hovering
wingless structure. Some have reported a bright shooting light
after which the sound ceases - similar to my 15 year old son.
According to the MUFON Web-Site the date of this experience was one
of busiest nights of reporting the site has ever experienced. All
across North America their were sightings.

My conclusion is that this is definitely something from out of our
world. I still doubt claims about alien abductions and crashed
saucers (Roswell). In fact I doubt all claims except those that
are similar to what I experienced. I know what I experienced. The
fact that others have reported similar occurrences is confirming
evidence - to me. I am not asking you to believe this. I am just
saying that because I experienced this it has made me more open to
this kind of stuff.
What does this do for my faith? Whatever these entities are that
passed over my house I believe they are material. After all they
use physical craft to get around. They propel these craft with
some kind of energy generator. I don't know if they are from some
distant planet or if they are able to pop into our world through
some so-called "gate". Undoubtedly they have an advanced
technology. I now have great faith in the potential of humans to
achieve a similar level of scientific achievement.

I could kick myself for not going outside to investigate. I don't
believe in God but I am sure we are not alone.

tetrapod.sapien

very interesting proplog,

you should start a thread discussing it. would make for interesting banter.

talesin,

the true nature of the scientist should include curiosity as a main trait,

i agree with this very much. and as you say, it is sadly missing in many. perhaps, because enrollment in science studies has become so very common of late. but the true masters, and wielders of knowledge, still have that einsteinian childlike sense of wonder that enobles them as scientists. hawkin, sagan, wilson, kaku, dawkins , etc etc. i think the younger scientists learn this trait again, as they get older.

unfortunately, many have taken advantage of this sense of curiosity to put forth their hypotheses as fact, when there is little evidence to support them. and they often have an underlying motive. so some scientists become more gaurdians of sorts. this is sad. but disinformation should not be allowed in the public sphere, as this causes harm.

*you know I was just teasing you, right?

oh yeah. no worries. i like getting my hide tanned occasionally too. keeps me truckin'.

Can't buy god idea! What about Aliens?

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