Truth hurts (page 2)

Tina

Yes unsure,
The trooth hurts. YOUR version of the TROOTH hurts.
It hurts by killing people with a specious and nonsensical blood policy. Not to mention past medical policies that killed as well(i.e. transplants etc)
It hurts by breaking up families and relationships via disfellowshipping.
It hurts many who have been criminally sexually victimized by WT policies that protect their freedon to abuse rather than protecting innocent children.
It hurts economically when you are struggling to survive because you weren't allowed the freedom of higher education and the benefits that ensue.
It hurts you intellectually by not allowing you freedom of information and freedom to think for yourself.
It hurts children socially as they grow up deficient in social skills and missed opportunities and the opportunity to interact with the world around them.
It hurts because it lies,built on a foundation of manipulation , shame and guilt.
It hurts by wishing 99% of the world population destroyed,and gleefully at that.

And forget about that 'bitter apostate' line. That one is so worn and old. That line is used ad nauseum when WTS defenders can't refute the facts. And it couldn't be further from the truth.
These people are some of the happiest folk anywhere. How could on NOT be happy after re-claiming one's life back from a deceptive dangerous cult?
Oh and look up cult,mind control. Compare it honestly against methods used by the WTS.
Tina

expatbrit

Unsure:

All their writings simply criticize and tear down! Nothing is upbuilding.

Yes, most of the writing of what the WT calls "apostates" is critical of the WT. Obviously, to them that will not be viewed as upbuilding. But it depends on your relative position doesn't it. Reading confirmation that the reasons I stopped participating were valid was very upbuilding to me from my point of view, since it confirmed the correctness of my decision.

Tell me, how much of the WT's own writing do you think is critical of other religions and any non-JW organisation? Read any magazine and you will see many non-upbuilding articles that tear down non-WT organisations.

It simply depends on your point of view.

Expatbrit

joelbear

Hey guys,

I don't think any of you are addressing Decided's main point.

I think Decided has a valid point in saying that its easy to sit and try to tear down something we no longer believe in, but what alternative do we offer?

Decided states a specific goal of becoming closer to God. I think that is a good goal, no matter what definition of God one may have.

I agree that all of us should contemplate more positive issues and discuss those here more.

I agree that we should try to upbuild each other with positive experiences, thoughts and directions our lives have taken.

Good post Decided. You really got me thinking.

hugs

Joel

Seeker

Positive alternatives are offered all the time here, but it's any number of positive alternatives. Some say to try this new religious belief, others say try this belief. They are all positive about it. The problem is, you don't find the same conformity you see among the Witnesses, and so it doesn't seem like it's a unified message. It isn't. We've had enough of forced conformity. Now we respect an individual's right to decide for him- or herself what to believe. That's why you don't find one positive message here, but many different ones. Use your God-given mind and decide for yourself which way is the best way to follow the Bible.

As for only tearing down, what could be more positive that offering truth? If you happen to be exposing some liars in the process, well that's what telling the truth does. Here's an illustration:

Two kids are playing in a mud puddle, and one of their parents comes along and says:

"Hey, get out of the puddle. You're all dirty."

One kid says to the other kid:

"Don't listen to her. All she's doing is criticizing and tearing down. What good alternative is she offering? All she can do is tell you you're dirty. Don't listen to her."

In fact, telling someone they are up to their armpits in dirt is a positive thing, for it helps them come to their senses and begin to make positive changes in their lives. Which direction they go from there is entirely up to them -- no one will force them to follow anything. You are used to the WTS concept of being told 'this is the way.' But all that accomplished was to take you on a ride down a dead-end path. Never again, we say.

Truth is always positive.

SixofNine

There is much wrong with the WT, but I haven't seen the critics here consider the relative "before and after WT" states of spirituality generally. And not referring to the WT def. of sspirituality (=meeting attendence etc.) but true closeness to God.

Oh, that's easy. Much better after . Actually, as I took spiritually more and more seriously in my life, I saw for the first time the "truth about the truth". Just like you. BTW, your word are not the words of someone "decidedly unsure". You sound quite sure of the WTS failings.

I'll admit that once out, I continued looking hard at EVERYTHING I had believed w/o questioning. The bible did not hold up to questioning, so, I've ditched it. Beyond that, no one really has any more insight into God than I do, and I don't have much, so why worry. Be happy. Be good. The really nice thing is that for all your fears, it turns out that there is no void to be filled. It's was all your imagination all along.

If God exist, It is way bigger than you, me, or some silly book of hebrew mythology.

Now, wasn't that positive?

Englishman

Notice how, once again , the WTBTS exploits the dub fear of demons. I reckon most JW's fear demons more than Satan himself!

Lets turn this "table of demons" thing around a little. Imagine that the way that you think about yourself is represented by a table of food. Your thoughts about yourself are pictured by what you choose to eat. Do you choose thoughts that are delicious and piquant, or do you choose the thoughts that the WTBTS would have come into your head, thoughts of unworthiness, thoughts of shunning others, thoughts of the beautiful world we live in being destroyed by its Creator?

Now tell me which is the table of demons!

Englishman.

..... fanaticism masquerading beneath a cloak of reasoned logic.

SixofNine

Joel, why the need for a replacement? No one is saying that JW's don't have a life, just that it is a life with a heavy, silly, and sometimes deadly, burden on it.

I've been hearing this a lot around here lately. Rex, Duns, Decidedly, and now you, Joel.

I don't get it. What on earth makes you think you have to offer some replacement just for pointing out the worthlesness of a certain destructive belief?

A person can ditch the org. and be just fine, in fact better off, w/o running to some other org.

As far as belief, I think most of us realize the impact of cognitive dissonance in our lives. Loosing an erroneous belief does not mean we have to replace it in any way. Holding conflicting, or even just somewhat conflicting beliefs will make one depressed and miserable, at least if you are like me.

LDH

------>>> agreeing with 6 of 9....

DU,

All I can tell you is you are experiencing what we have all gone through. Yes it hurts to have something you were convinced was the truth be exposed for the man-made organization it is.

Someone on this board once summed it up nicely regarding baptism. "You never know the right questions to ask until it's too late."

Only you can decide if you want your children selling books and magazines instead of getting ready for soccer. Only you can decide if you want to be free to with your friend a HAPPY BIRTHDAY and mean it. Or make your children be ostracised in the classroom and every where else.

When I first started looking on the web I came across a site entitled "Shaun's research on the JW's". There was one page that hit me hard enough to take the breath out. It was called "Become a JW and you can't".......

If you'd like I could email you the link. Sorry for the consternation this is causing you, everyone here knows how it feels.

As far as coming up with something 'to substitute' for JW guess what? It is up to each person to discover God and worship or deny him as they see fit. There is no institution that can do that for you.

Love,
Lisa

Sunchild

As a result, whatever they had developed of the new personality is gone. What motivates them is, not holy spirit, but vitriolic bitterness. They are obsessed with only one aim-beating their former fellow slaves, as Jesus foretold.-Matthew 24:48, 49.

*scratches her head* Really? I walked away well over a year ago, and I can honestly say that I don't feel any bitterness at all towards the JWs. I was angry at first over having wasted about seven years of my life, but I got over it. Now, I'm simply grateful that that episode is over, and that I can finally explore who I really am and what I want from life without feeling like the secret police are looking over my shoulder, or like God will kill me Real Soon Now for some unnamed transgression.

I hang around here because I'm nosy, and because I like to help people when they make it clear they want to be helped. Other than that, though, I'm sort of... apathetic towards the whole thing. I have my own life to live without being "filled with vitriolic bitterness" over how others choose to live theirs. I've seen enough of human nature to know that people can't be changed until they're ready to change themselves, and that some never change at all.

*Rochelle.

---------
http://www.dreamsphere.net/ -- See it, live it, wear it.
"Most men complacently accept 'knowledge' as 'truth'. They are sheep, ruled by fear."
-- Sydney Losstarot, "Vagrant Story."

BoozeRunner

Rochelle...amen!!

Those who visit this site are looking to either:

1.Freely express theirselves w/o repercussions
2.Looking for answers to any number of JW questions.

All are welcomed. If they want info, it is given and many are told that they may do as they wish with that info.

My point is, as you said, no one changes unless they want to.
This site is an info exchange as well as its own little community in a way.

Boozy

Truth hurts

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