Why do you worship your god? Or do you?

by AlmostAtheist 15 Replies latest jw friends

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  JamesThomas

  My sense is the awe-of-conscious-existence - which Trevor is beautifully expressing - is key to the questions regarding worship.

  There seems a natural and innate desire to show respect and appreciation to the Source and Sustenance of the all-ness of the unspeakable wonder of existence and universe. The problem I feel occurs when the mind - in it's desire to honour it's origin - makes it's Author into a god separate and then writes "holy" books in it's name and worships it. The mind ironically accepts it's own creation as it's Creator; and from there the confusions and divisions of religious worship and faiths unfolds.

  Why continue to believe that what the word G-o-d points to, is separate from and less than the wholeness and awe of existence which sparks worship in the first place???

  Be still and enter into the sense of awe within. Surrender all attention into it's/your center and see. If a river was separated from it's source and fountainhead it would stop flowing, stop being. The one undeniable truth we all know is there is conscious existence and the flow of life right now, right here. Are we cut-off from our Source? Look, and see.

  Is the Beloved, that religious people worship, actually the reality of the worship-er, right now?

  j
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  OldSoul

  [Alvin's voice] Okay, Dave!

  I'll try: I don't worship out of expectation. I don't believe children love their parents out of a sense of expectation either, even children who do not have basic needs met often love their parents anyway. I am nurtured by what I get from life and from earth and from other people, I just recognize a source for this that differs from the source you identify. I worship God because I want to. My experiences have not led me to believe I must worship God, but they have led me to believe I want to.

  So, I was not saying that the love of a parent to child is the same, but it is of the same nature. It cannot be explained and it is real anyway.

  Respectfully,
  OldSoul
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  LittleToe

  Here's the skinny, from my perspective: As part of my early experiences I enjoyed transcendant states (such as James speaks of), and I also had a very personal "Christ-experience" in which all I could do was worship, while overwhelmed. It was a spontaneous thing.

  As time moved on I've come to a position of "accepting the Christ within", living in the "Spirit's flow" in the power of an all-abiding love. God certainly appears to be as omnipresent as the Orthodox mystics would claim.

  OldSoul's attempt to describe it in terms of human love is a good analogy, though (as I'm sure he'd agree) it doesn't describe the intensity. It has that kind of a "feel", but "more so". It's awesome and can invoke an observable dialog (prayer), while retaining the transcendant state.

  By your definition, that's worship, and I have no difficulty with that. It doesn't happen out of a desire to abase myself, nor currie favour, but as a reaction to a tangible "presence". It's very humbling.

  I don't know if that helps any. Best felt that telled, I guess.
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  Big Dog

  Dog, by worship I mean "The reverent love and devotion accorded a deity, an idol, or a sacred object." Or to make it simple, if you pray to it, we'll consider that worship. If you're simply aware of it, believe it exists, but don't expect it to know or care that you exist, then we'll say that isn't worship.

  
  

  
  Dave,

  I was raised by a dub (my father) who spent 15 years in the military and never lost that edge. Respect was taught to me from the get go, and if there is a God that's what I have for he/she/it. A deep and abiding respect for a being that if responsible for all we percieve is impressive to say the least, and deserves my respect for this existence. I always remember dad talking about superior officers that he didn't like, he might have hated them personally, but he rendered them the respect their uniform demanded. I don't hate God like many here do, but on the other hand I have never felt that overwhelming love that many profess to feel for God, and I have sometimes wondered if I was defective because I do not. But when I go with my wife to church (Roman Catholic) on Sundays I sit and meditate and go along with the program as a show of respect and appreciation for my possible creator and what I have.

  So, does that count as worship? I don't know, don't really care to be honest, its what I feel and I go with it.
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  OldSoul

  But even "more so" is so inadequate. And it takes on aspects that defy explanation (as does love for a child or a mate) but can be felt with such ... intent conjoining of being. And peace! Dammit! Can't do it...language utterly fails to express what I have experienced.

  I can use poetic terms to describe it, but they do no good except as a fleeting frame of reference to something sort of like what somthing kind of like that might feel like. And, I would be very surprised if scientists could recreate that experience for me in a lab. At least not recreate it without long term damage after sustaining the "subject's state" for over an hour.

  BigDog,

  I don't think not experiencing something is reason enough in itself to disbelieve it. I didn't experience first hand the Tsunami, nor did I live through the hurricane, and I didn't experience the recent quake. I believe they were real, though.

  I saw was a picture, mind you. Just lighted dots on a screen. But I would be hard pressed to scientifically prove that these disasters took place with the limited data I have available.

  Respectfully,
  OldSoul
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  Carmel

  How do you define worship? For the most part protestants have an aversion to god being a law giver while Catholics tend to have no problem with rules of behavior. If worshiping means following commandments that improve our individual and collective lives, then I worship. If it means some hand ringing swooning about "baby Jesus" or "almighty Jehovah" leave me out.

  carmel