darkspilver

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Posts by darkspilver

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  38

  In the last 20 years How Many Changes Have Occurred in Watchtower Beliefs?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  jehovah's witnesses say that they have the truth and the truth is constant.

  they believe that what they teach is the truth that comes directly from jehovah god.

  can you think of anything that has changed in the last 20 years to show a jehovah's witness that the truth is not necessarily the truth..

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  darkspilver

  darkspilver: It's no secret, in fact the GB proudly highlight the changes they've made... Listed in the Index under the heading 'Beliefs Clarified'
  

  FAKE

  There seems to be an issue here with the use of 'changes' / 'clarification'

  The OP originally asked about changes

  darkspilver linked to the WT Online Index, and pasted a summary of clarifications

  Clarifications are NOT changes and should NOT be confused.

  Sorry about that - I should have re-worded my original reply to emphasize 'clarifications' rather than 'changes' in order to avoid the confusion - thanks to careful for picking this up!
  
  For example
  

  2000: use of one’s own blood: w00 10/15 30-31
  

  This was a clarification in view of medical advances - such as the introduction of the 'cell-saver' machine:
  

  Watchtower, October 15, 2000

  Questions From Readers: In the light of Bible commands about the proper use of blood, how do Jehovah’s Witnesses view medical procedures using one’s own blood?

  Blood that flows into a wound may be captured and filtered so that the red cells can be returned to the patient; this is called cell salvage. In a different process, blood may be directed to a machine that temporarily carries on a function normally handled by body organs (for example, the heart, lungs, or kidneys). The blood from the machine is then returned to the patient. In other procedures, blood is diverted to a separator (centrifuge) so that damaging or defective portions of it can be eliminated. Or the goal may be to isolate some of a blood component and apply that elsewhere on the body. There are also tests in which a quantity of blood is withdrawn in order to tag it or to mix it with medicine, whereupon it is put back into the patient.

  The details may vary, and new procedures, treatments, and tests will certainly be developed. It is not our place to analyze each variation and render a decision. A Christian must decide for himself how his own blood will be handled in the course of a surgical procedure, medical test, or current therapy.

  
  This, in principle, is no different from the following from 1978 - and hence, in the example, this is NOT a change, but a clarification.
  

  Watchtower June 15, 1978

  Questions From Readers: What about a device such as a heart-lung pump or a dialysis (artificial kidney) machine? Might a Christian use such?

  There are Christian witnesses of Jehovah who, with a good conscience, have allowed these devices to be used, provided that the machines were primed with a nonblood fluid, such as Ringer’s lactate solution.

  When this sort of device is operating, the patient’s blood flows from a blood vessel through tubing and the machine (where it is pumped, oxygenated and/or filtered) and then flows back into his circulatory system. The machine temporarily performs some of the functions normally handled by the patient’s own organs.

  Some Christians have conscientiously reasoned that the blood is flowing continuously and that the external circuit might be viewed as an extension of the circulatory system. They have considered it comparable to a piece of tubing that might be implanted in the body to shunt blood around a blockage in a vessel.

  Of course, each Christian should weigh what is involved in the use of these and similar devices. He could consider whether he views the blood involved to be blood that clearly has left his body and so should be disposed of or as blood that, basically, is still part of his circulatory system. (Deut. 12:16) Then he can make a decision that will leave him with a clear conscience before God.—1 Pet. 3:16.

  MacHislopp: The change, very carefully worded is clear! “Each Christian decides for himself how his own blood will be handled..”
  

  Isn't that really just a slightly shorter way to express the same principle as contained in the last paragraph I quoted above from the 1978 Watchtower?
  
  
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  57

  interesting EX-CO AMA ( Ask Me Anything) over on exjwreddit

  by Diogenesister in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  ex-circuit overseer here, ama.

  https://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/6usaky/excircuit_overseer_here_ama/.

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  darkspilver

  More answers....
  
  
  So what is the punishment for a JW who visits another church and goes inside the building?

  As long as you don't "worship" in there then there is technically nothing wrong with going inside. Many witnesses visit St. Patrick's Cathedral in New York, but not during the service.

  However when someone does go in, some elders use that to give them counsel. No big deal really. But they make it seem like it is.
  
  
  What it's like to be a Circuit Overseer - Part 7
  

  Sunday morning

  The entire congregation would show up to preach. I mean everyone. Even non-publishers would show up sometimes and Bible Studies. I let them go out preaching to "observe." The elders and I would preach a little then try to resolve last minute issues.

  Sunday Afternoon

  Public Talk, which I hated to give. Boring and repetitive. Plus no Halls back then had air conditioning so I would be dripping with sweat by the end of my talk. Then a quick WT and then my final talk. I often didn't even use my notes since I gave the same talk so much. I tried to encourage everyone. I thanked everyone for their hospitality. I tried to create enthusiasm for upcoming assemblies.

  After the meeting we would go in the back room with the elders and I would read my report and have them sign it. The report includes all the numbers, publishers, new baptized, attendance at meetings, accounts, etc. On the other side of that page were my comments. What are the congregations needs, what I did to help the congregation, etc. The second paper is the recommendations for elder and servant. I know that's all changed now. But anyhow we reviewed who was going to be recommended and then we all signed it. They kept a copy and I sent the other copy to the Branch.

  Then they would give me an envelope with some money in it, usually about $50. Handshakes all around.

  And that was it. I would drive away relieved. I would drive back to the missionary home blasting music in my car and think about my day off the next day. The other CO would usually be there already, drinking a beer. I would watch a movie or sports with him and his wife and another single missionary brother. Usually it was an R-rated action flick. We would talk about mostly fun stuff.

  That's about it. Every few months we had Circuit assemblies to prepare for and that was fun. Pioneer Schools once or twice a year. I also taught Kingdom Ministry School for Elders. But basically that's the weekly routine. And that's what the dozens of CO's I have interacted with do also. Give talks, go in service, try to solve problems, and move on to the next congregation. It's draining. I enjoyed having the position of Circuit Overseer but not really the work of a Circuit Overseer. I think it's because you never get to see Armageddon. Everything we do is preparing for Armageddon and helping others get ready. But it never comes. So I drummed up enthusiasm week after week, month after month and year after year but there was never the fulfillment. There was some joy in seeing younger people become pioneers or servants or bethelites, and sometimes a feeling of having encouraged everyone, but that's about it. So I liked the position, but the work was drudgery. Weeks and months and years of drudgery. And you can't complain about it, because you're the Circuit Overseer! You can't even admit it's drudgery, EVEN TO YOURSELF!

  I remember one night getting a phone call from another missionary CO, a married brother. He said he felt so empty after the convention even though he had given two talks, and that he felt the same after his CO visits. He asked me if I felt the same. I told him he was giving out a lot so that's why he was tired.

  If Armageddon had come, then in retrospect circuit work would have been great. I would have sacrificed all that time for a good cause, my talks would have helped people make it through. But that's not what is happening

  Now that I look back, I remember the strange feeling that I often had years ago, that underneath it all we had been tricked. It's a hollow, horrible empty feeling that I tried to push away all the time.

  You know when I was really waking up about 5 years ago, I went in service with the local CO here. He knew I had been a missionary. He called on me to comment any time I raised my hand at the meeting. So in field service one day between doors I asked him how he was doing. He gave the usual answer about how great everything was going.

  But in his eyes and in his words I could see the same hollowness I used to have when I was a CO.

  I'm so glad I got out.
• 
  10

  Jw meeting locator

  by Done in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was born in and a jw for about 40 years, most of it in the same state.

  im getting ready to move about an hour away and typed in my possible new zip code to the meeting locator to see who of my past contacts i will possibly run into.. when the locator gives you the list of nearest congos, is congo "a" the one that your address would be "assigned" to?

  the congo that works your territory?

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  darkspilver

  OK - I get the same result as I got before.

  The East Saginaw St KH is listed first with the two congregations that meet their listed alphabetically, ie:

  First: East Lansing - MI (USA)
  Second: Okemos - MI (USA)

  The fact that I can't replicate your results means something is going on - which may be device specific - and it is highly unlikely to be based on congregation territory.
  

  BUT I note that when using 'any language' - the E and F congregations at North East St are not listed alphabetically for me - that may be a 'foreign language' issue, but alphabetically English (cong F) is before Spanish (cong E), and the two letter codes the WT use are EN (English) and ES (Spanish).

  From the programming side I would expect some kind of 'listing order' to be used, if only to speed up the results.

  Interestingly the other congregation identifier that WT uses is the 'congregation number' (used internally for literature and magazine shipping etc etc) - this could explain the results in my earlier post where I have most, but not all the data, but numerical order by congregation number could be what is happening to my results (and by coincidence they're alphabetical aswell) - but again interesting that I can't replicate your results using the same location.

  You could be in any one of three congregations - I would say unlikely to be East Lansing (they'll probably have enough territory in the built up areas) which leaves either St Johns or Owosso - but it's anybody's guess....
  
  
  
• 
  10

  Jw meeting locator

  by Done in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was born in and a jw for about 40 years, most of it in the same state.

  im getting ready to move about an hour away and typed in my possible new zip code to the meeting locator to see who of my past contacts i will possibly run into.. when the locator gives you the list of nearest congos, is congo "a" the one that your address would be "assigned" to?

  the congo that works your territory?

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  darkspilver

  Interesting - are you on a mobile / tablet?

  I'm currently using a laptop / PC

  When I do a search using my location as either
  

  Shaftsburg
  Okemos
  Williamston

  Every time the East Saginaw St KH is listed first with the two congregations that meet their listed alphabetically, ie:

  First: East Lansing - MI (USA)
  Second: Okemos - MI (USA)
  
  
  
  
  
• 
  3

  John Shuttleworth on JWs

  by punkofnice in

  1. social
  2. humour

  this graham fellows (jilted john), character makes me depressed but laugh at the same time..... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9ixjk1tgvk.

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  darkspilver

  In a similiar vein - if you haven't already seen it, check out Count Arthur Strong recent TV series.

  Series 3, Episode 6: "The Lucky Streak" - He joins a cult (AKA Scientology)

  http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b08xhbtq
  

  
  
• 
  37

  Was there really a specific request for money in this week's meeting?

  by stuckinarut2 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have seen a few comments about this week's meeting.. was there actually a part that specified an actual per-publisher amount that should be donated regularly?.

  can this be confirmed please?.

  i truly cant believe just how brazen the society seems to be getting - and how desperate they are!.

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  darkspilver

  steve2: a smelly begging letter system
  

  TBH, I wonder why a congregation resolution is even really needed for the GAA and the COAA.
  
  They would both seem to be regular annual expenses incured as part of the congregation's normal recurring operating expenses and therefore do NOT need a resolution?

  Actually I would have thought the only need for a resolution would be if the elders wanted to give more than what was required (ie they rounded up the amount).

  The principle is outlined in the letter below:

  BoE Letter, May 25, 2011 - Re: Public speakers

  Travel expenses for visiting speakers should be considered recurring operating expenses. Thus, a congregation resolution is not needed. Congregation funds should not be used to cover expenses for other forms of hospitality, such as entertaining or providing meals.

  Of course the requirements for the need for resolutions may change depending on the country you are in - and thus there may be some countries / congregations that present and pass a resolution every time the electricity company issues a bill, or more toilet paper needs to be bought....
  
• 
  10

  Jw meeting locator

  by Done in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was born in and a jw for about 40 years, most of it in the same state.

  im getting ready to move about an hour away and typed in my possible new zip code to the meeting locator to see who of my past contacts i will possibly run into.. when the locator gives you the list of nearest congos, is congo "a" the one that your address would be "assigned" to?

  the congo that works your territory?

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  darkspilver

  Done: When the locator gives you the list of nearest congos, is congo "A" the one that your address would be "assigned" to? The congo that works your territory? There is a congo A and B at the same hall.
  

  The JWorg Meeting Location Finder is available at: https://apps.jw.org/E_SRCHMTGMAPS

  Interesting question.

  Short answer: NO

  Long answer: NO. The meeting finder lists, in order, firstly the physically closest Kingdom Hall to your location and then, secondly it lists the congregations that meet at that KH in alpabetical order.

  I've tested the above with location zip/post codes in congregation territories I'm familiar with and which go to multi-use KHs.

  One of the locations I tested was physically closest to one KH, which was listed as the first result, BUT actually the location is within the territory of a congregation that meets in a different KH (which was listed third, as two congregations meet at the physically closest KH).

  Thus, although the local Bethel does have a 'masterplan' of each congregation's territory, the public online meeting finder appears to work on a purely mathematical 'straight-line' geo-distance/alphabetical basis.
  

  In addition, while discussing this, it is probably worth mentioning that there are also two other 'limiters' that effect results on the JWorg meeting finder - which interestingly Nicholaus Kopernicus fell foul of last year when doing some research on foreign language congregations:

  The congregation search facility on JWorg appears to have two 'limiters' on the results you get - a maximum number and a maximum distance:

  • Firstly it limits any search to a maximum of 100 results

  • Secondly it limits search results to a maximum distance - from a quick check this appears to be 100 miles

  READ MORE: https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6349425083416576/britain-doldrums
  
• 
  9

  Why do some British journalists ...

  by LoveUniHateExams in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ... go full retard whenever an arabic name appears on the autocue, and 'give it the full arabic', so to speak?.

  rageh omar is a british somali of sunni muslim heritage so it's understandable when he pronounces arabic names with an arabic pronunciation/accent.. but what about people who have nothing to do with arabic - huw edwards, emily maitlis, moira stewart, etc.?

  they don't speak arabic, do they?.

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  darkspilver

  LoveUniHateExams: My OP was talking about place names.

  Your OP said "whenever an Arabic name appears" - it was just by coincidence that all your examples where place name.
  

  I understand that Arabic, although a 'common' language, is pronouced differently (dialect?) depending on the actual country you are from with cross-country broadcasters such as Al Jazeera using a formal form of Arabic.

  Indeed, the WT's website JWorg lists 'Arabic' along with seven variations: Algerian Arabic, Egyptian Arabic, Jordanian Arabic, Lebanon Arabic, Moroccan Arabic, Sudanese Arabic and Tunisian Arabic - that's eight version of 'one language'
  
  
• 
  9

  Why do some British journalists ...

  by LoveUniHateExams in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ... go full retard whenever an arabic name appears on the autocue, and 'give it the full arabic', so to speak?.

  rageh omar is a british somali of sunni muslim heritage so it's understandable when he pronounces arabic names with an arabic pronunciation/accent.. but what about people who have nothing to do with arabic - huw edwards, emily maitlis, moira stewart, etc.?

  they don't speak arabic, do they?.

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  darkspilver

  LoveUniHateExams: Rageh Omar... Huw Edwards, Emily Maitlis, Moira Stewart, etc.?
  

  All the examples you mention appear to be BBC news presenters?

  Oh! Is this a BBC-bashing thread??

  Just wondering.

  Anyway, the BBC have what is called the 'BBC Pronunciation Unit' - they tell presenters how to pronouce words and names.

  The BBC Pronunciation unit is staffed by professional linguists who research and provide advice about pronunciations in any language. This advice is free of charge and is available exclusively to BBC staff, programme makers and independent production companies producing content for the BBC.

  READ MORE: http://www.bbc.co.uk/commissioning/tv/production/articles/production-resources#pronunciation-unit

  See also: http://www.bbc.co.uk/informationandarchives/archivenews/2013/bbc_pronunciation
• 
  36

  Jehovahs witnesses that believe its "The Truth" vs JW's who know it isn't

  by Christian Gutierrez in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hey guys!

  what do you think is the percentage of jw's believe that it is the truth and the percentage of those who think it might be some false or all false??

  ?.

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  darkspilver

  Christian Gutierrez
  

  see this recent discussion here:
  

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6205543758692352/watchtower-doctrines-jws-most-commonly-dont-believe
  

  and you can compare with the previous discussion here:

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/132878/percentage-jws-that-undercover

  You could do a youtube video comparing the above two threads