ExCO: My personal progression? Publisher at 5 years old. Baptized at 15. Pioneer at 16. MS at 20. MTS at 23. Missionary at 24. Appointed elder at my assignment at 24. CO at 28.
Considering his fast-track (and young) progression - I was slightly surprised he was not baptized younger than 15, especially considering he was an unbaptized-publisher at only 5..... but part of one of his answers below perhaps answers that when he reveals:
ExCO: When I was in school as a kid, my mother was a Witness and still is, and my father never was.
Interesting.
More answers....
This reminded me of being at work the other day. My boss gave me a clip board and asked me to go around the show we were setting up to see what still needed to be done and what was. My co workers instantly started razzing me for having a clip board so I (jokingly) told them I was giving grades and taking notes on them. In which they (jokingly) told me to f-off and we all had a good laugh. But wow, you actually were taking notes on and grading people! Was it hard for you to acclimate in to the real world after being such a lemming rock star? And don't take this in a mean way, but I'm sure it was hard to come to the realization that you aren't as special as you thought. Just a guy spinning around on a rock through space. I'm sure many CO's stay in just because they love the constant ego pump. I give you a lot of credit.
Yes I did take notes on all the talks. I wanted everyone to put real effort to apply what we learned at the Theocratic Ministry School.
Looking back, it was a joke. Being a CO didn't help me at all in the real world, in fact it hurt me. CO's are nothing, I walked around like I was important when in reality I wasn't doing anything special at all.
Regarding the MS who was cooking the books and stealing congregation money and had been for years.... Wow. That is so infuriating. Here he was literally stealing from the people he was supposed to be protecting so much. Did anyone in the congregation ever find out about it?
As far as I know, no one ever did. He became a servant again years later.
When my husband and I were pioneering and he was an elder, we had the theocratic goal of getting in the circuit work. We had both been raised in the truth and were brainwashed to wait for the new system to have a natural part of life - family. So what would be a natural next step for a pioneer couple serving in the foreign language field - circuit work... when we inquired to a then CO how to achieve that goal - he told us because we asked we were now disqualified - have you ever heard this rule? I've always wanted to ask a CO this mind boggling question...
Because you asked you were disqualified? Nonsense. First of all, there is no application for Circuit Work. You have to be recommended. So a brother approaching the CO regarding the circuit work would be welcomed. I was always on the lookout for brothers so I could recommend them. There are only two basic requirements. Elder and regular pioneer. After that, the brother, if married, must have a wife also pioneering. They must have been married at least two years. They must be available to travel, in other words, the Society didn't want more substitute Circuit Overseers that were tied down to a job. They wanted brothers who could be permanent CO's.
So if a brother or a couple asked me, I would always ask them those questions. If they filled the bill, then I would write a letter of recommendation to the Branch. I would also fill out a PQR - a Personal Qualifications Report, on both of them. It's a two page questionnaire that focuses on someone's personality, talents and skills. I would send that in also.
That CO had something against you. Normally a CO would LOVE to recommend someone, it looks great on his resume as well and shows the Branch he is on the ball. The Society was always sending us letters telling us to be on the lookout for good elders who were pioneers who could be a candidate for circuit work.
So that "rule" you were told is bogus.
How would you get a substitute CO in trouble for being an asshole? We have a guy here in Dallas who is known as a HUGE asshat. He was one of the reasons I woke up. I served with him as a MS and the shit he pulled blew my mind. Point his finger at your nose, get in your face right there in front of everyone. Make 'my way or the highway rules'. I mean, what could someone do to get someone called to task over this kind of behavior? He's an elder, but a substitute CO also. Write a letter to bethal outlining his behavior? It seems guys like him are untouchable in this org.
First of all, write a letter. Anytime the Branch receives a letter complaining about an elder or a CO, someone is assigned to handle it. I received letters from the Branch based on a letter they had received from someone, and I had to investigate. So here is what to do:
Write a letter
Try to get multiple people to sign it and identify themselves. Anonymous letters go nowhere.
Make a strong BIBLICAL accusation. Make sure you use a scripture in 1 Tim 3:1-5 or Titus 1:5-9 on elders qualifications. Accuse him of losing his temper. Specifically state that he put his finger in your face and several witnesses will corroborate that. Or get some more info on him, but only that Witnesses can verify.
They will have to address it at a special meeting and you will have to be there. So will your witnesses. I have seen young, timid publishers take down mighty elders because of this two-Witness rule. It goes both ways ha ha.
So yes, you can take this guy down. Get your biblical accusations ready, have your witnesses ready to testify in front of this guy.
But it will take time. Will it be worth it to you? It's a lot of hassle. I have been on a lot of these cases. If you decide to do it, PM me, and I can give you some more detailed info.
It most probably is a waste of your time, and he might be actually helping to wake people up, so there's that to think about as well.
But he's not untouchable. No one is in the organization.
Is there anything that we used to teach, "the deep things of God", that was explained by Watchtower that just never sat well with you but you couldn't give it the mental attention it deserved because it would lead to doubts. In other words. When the mental road block signs came off after you woke up what teachings were huge red flags for you?
Great question.
I was raised a Witness, so I fully believed. But some things did bother me, while others didn't. Let me start with what DIDN'T bother me, in fact it had the opposite effect.
The 144,000. The anointed. That was one of the STRONGEST things that kept me in. I knew some anointed ones growing up. They were knowledgeable about the Bible, well, about Witness teachings anyway. And some were shy, reserved. I used to talk to them as a young man. I was impressed by their humility. They weren't elders or servants, some were female. They loved the scriptures. I was impressed by them and I thought that's how the anointed should be, not the loud, prominent ones but the ones that Jehovah deemed worthy. It just seemed right. That helped to keep me convinced I was in the right organization.
But years later, when I was a missionary CO, I was at Bethel getting my eyes surgically fixed, so I had to stay at Brooklyn for a couple of months. I saw GB members close up. I had only talked to them at assemblies and meetings and in my assignment brother Jaracz visited who impressed me a lot. But this time I remember a friend of mine who was visiting Bethel, he approached a GB member who was at the Monday night Bethel Family Watchtower study. He asked him a biblical question, and I could tell the GB member had no idea. He also didn't seem to care. That bothered me. Then I heard other stories of anointed ones who were very haughty or strange. But overall, they impressed me as a youth until other things became clear and I met more of them as an adult and then the mystique of the anointed started to wear off.
Another thing was that I looked up John 1:1 in a Greek only Bible. I saw with my own eyes the definite article ("The") before the first mention of God and no definite article before the second mention of God. So I was convinced that the NWT had it right that Jesus was "a god." That also convinced me the organization had it right.
Another thing that convinced me was that I believed in the account of Adam and Eve. I always thought, if Adam and Eve hadn't sinned, where would they be now? On earth in a paradise without sin!
So those were some of the things that convinced me. Now on to what bothered me
What bothered me?
When I was in school as a kid, my mother was a Witness and still is, and my father never was. I remember asking my mother why we don't celebrate Thanksgiving. I was assigned a project at school for Thanksgiving and of course I couldn't participate. I asked my mom why and she said because it's worldly. I said, "OK, but what do I tell the teacher, just that I can't because I'm a Witness?" She said, "No, don't say that because they will think you are not being allowed to. Just say it goes against your conscience." I told my Mom, "OK then if my conscience allows me to then I can?" She said no, we would have to tell the elders and I would be in trouble. So that bothered me, I was telling a lie to the teacher. It wasn't my conscience, I had to obey or get in trouble by the elders.
Another thing that bothered me was the generation. I lived and breathed the 1914 generation will not pass away. I even kept the famous 1989 WT in my briefcase that said the preaching work would be completed by the end of the twentieth century. I just knew we were so close to the end. And then I became a missionary and in 1995 the generation teaching was changed. I remember studying it at the missionary home table with everyone. It was a sad study. I tried to make it work in my mind but it really bothered me. I felt like the GB was hedging their bets, that they had to say something because too much time had gone by and the end hadn't come. I put it out of my mind though.
Then there was the appointment of elders and ministerial servants. When I became a CO, I found out that the local branch appoints the elders and servants, not Brooklyn. The Service Department at the Branch was one brother who was a very simple man. He made a lot of mistakes. He appointed an 18 year old as an elder by mistake. i tried to talk to him about recommendations but he just kept the topic simple. And I saw a lot of elders and servants appointed who had been committing sins and we're found out. Were they appointed by Holy Spirit?
Appointed by Holy Spirit is not really a deep teaching but it did bother me.
Another thing that did bother me was the lack of scriptures talking about the paradise earth. The Bible is so big, and there is so much information about other stuff, why not more about the paradise earth?
All those things bothered me and started to add up more and more.
