Posts by Strangelove

18

A shaved Head

by HowTheBibleWasCreated in

my wife complained along time that i let my hair grow to long (i don't belive in this anyway) but to make peach i asked her to buzz my hair 4 months ago.... shorter... shorter... let me shave the rest.. it' been shaved since then and i like the yul brynner look.. i feel like pharoah...j.k. at the kh few have questioned... i mean im hardly breaking 1 corinthians lol.

as for wordly styles this style is almost what a certian governing body member has.... and they know it... they hate sanderson!.

now i have since experiance the sun on my head in summer...feels good... my wife liking it now.... .

Strangelove

Growing up, and while in, I only ever shaved my head. Did not like hair.

As an adult I had a change of heart, and started to fall in love with all sorts of hair. So I let mine grow out. (Keep in mind I hadn't had hair since I was probably 4 years old)

What I've found is that everyone finds a way to complain no matter what. My bald head was seen as unchristian. "Jehovah gave you hair for a reason! It's disrespectful to not let it grow." My grandmother told me that one. However, when I did grow it out, it became "You look like a worldly person! Your hair is too long, you need to cut it!"

Keep in mind I did not have hair growing over my ears. Ugh. I gave up caring about what they thought of me. Its very simple, what others think of me is no concern of mine.

So I let it grow however long I want. Don't really shave anymore either. To which my aunt yesturday said, "What the hell is on your face!"

"The way I see it, Abraham or Moses started this trend, so it seems okay with my conscious." I know of course Moses or Lot did not set the Beard trend. I just find it funny how we overglorify Bible Characters with massive facial hair and yet, when someone comes in to a meeting with a gotee, they are scolded behind everyone's back. The supposal welcoming attitude we have to show to newcomers was never present in my congragation. Some of the most judgemental people I ever met were in The Kingdom Halls.

10

Keeping it simple.

by gingerbread in

jw
friends

as the convention season is upon many of us, i recall my first assembly that we attended during the very beginning of our questioning if this religion that we were raised in was 'right'.

by really listening to the talks and observing the behavior of the other attendees, we came away that weekend with real focus on uncovering the realities of being one of jehovah's witnesses.. i had, for many years, issues with some basic organizational practices and customs : turning in a time slip, counting hours, re-hashing material over and over, dress and grooming rules, congregational politics/favoritism/discrimination, the 'judicial committee', etc.. at the same time we were researching the history of the watchtower and it's core beliefs : what were the origins of the belief in a paradise earth, the faithful and discreet slave, and (most importantly) the watchtower's chronology/dating that leads to the 1914 conclusion.. to all who are in the beginning of this process, i recommend you keep it simple.

take one topic or issue at a time and prove to yourself that the watchtower's stance is biblical.

Strangelove

Yeah, there was a time in my period of growing up in this institution that I started to actually pay attention to the talks. My family thought I was becoming more spiritual for actually studying more then they did. It backfired for them later, because it was actually paying attention that helped me see all the problems.

In service, I recall someone discouraging me from debating at a door. That, "If they aren't interested, we move on, we have the Truth and they've shown they don't want it, so lets not waste are time." It made sense at the time, but I was also struggling between Evolution and Intelligent Design at the moment. I thought that, if we really did have the Truth, then why would a debate matter? We'd be able to convince them, right? I realize now there are reasons debates are not encouraged. Because the foundation the Troof stands upon is as empty and souless as the men running it are.

I like the OP's point. Take one issue at a time. I seem to recall I myself disagreeing with certain teaching of 1914. Seemed far fetched for anyone to get to that number. (When I hear of someone using math in connection with Bible Years, I run far away. The Simpsons had an interesting episode on that. In fact, The Simpsons helped me be a critical thinker at an early age. Thank you Matt Groening for all the questions and jabs at Chrisendom and other religons. Satire helped me see how silly it can be)

But I digress, I'm getting off topic. Bottom Line; It started with why Dinosaurs were killed off, How boring and repetetive everything was and then progressed. To why Evolution is wrong and not compatible with Bible Teaching. To the Propheices like 1914 being convoluted. To why Women are treated like second class citizens. Shunning not being loving. Wordly being a derogatory label. Giving and accepting blood was supposedly wrong. How after I read the Bible front to back, I realized the Revelation accounts could be bended any which way to fit their doctrine. That some verses were taken litteraly and others as metaphor. I had to believe the men in charge had the right interpretation. And I eventually concluded that I didn't think they had a direct channel to God.

I just studied each very slowly while growing up. Till It all just clicked one day, and I ran! Didn't care what my family thought, I wasn't spending another second in the mind altering cult.

16

shepherding call

by DesirousOfChange in

you don't say why you are inactive.. if you can control your tongue and not blurt out anything you have learned about ttatt, then perhaps no harm in agreeing to a visit if you feel the need to be polite and cooperative.

no doubt, they will inquire as to why you are inactive.. don't you know it's the truth(tm)?.

don't you know the end(tm) is close?.

Strangelove

You don't, or shouldn't have to do anything you are not comfortable doing.

Granted, if they continue to pester, I don't think one brief visit hurts. Just be cautious. They are damn manipulative.

---

I hope it all transpires to your benefit. ;)

---

If it were me, I'd decline intsantly and politely every single time. I simply don't have the patience for it anymore. Even when I was in, I declinded to have the Circut Overseet on our Bible Study. Too much pressure. Then again, I am not everyone.

17

The OT is not all blood and guts, there is some humor.

by jam in

1) god sneezes,ex.

2)god drinks wine ..judges 9:13.

3)a man named dodo... judges 10:1 .

Strangelove

Am I the only one who chuckled when reading about the names of Jacob and Bilha's Sons? Naphtali and Dan. I mean, talk about all the over complicated names in the bible book of Genesis. Some of them are badass. We have Methuselah, Abraham, Israel, And here we have...Dan. Doesn't convey the same power? Does it? Sounds like some loner wearing overalls with a cable workshop show.

Mostly though, I found myself appauled by the Old Testament. I mean, for feminism, The Book of Judges is cool, but holy hell is it violent! Some of the advice in Proverbs and Ecclesiastes is insightful, but others make absolutely no sense what so ever. (Song of Solomon is still the best book for having absolutely nothing to do with anything. ) And am I the only one who is confused by how Jacob can be seen as a good role model when he decietfully stol Esaus Birth right? What a dick move. (But seriously though esau, was the lentil soup worth it?) I mean, Jacob is supposed to be this Ritoues dude, and here is intentionally lying. I guess it's okay, even if we all know who the original "Father of the lie" is. Hmmm.

And why is it no one ever refers to Jacob as Israel? Yet we all call Abram, Abraham?

Propehcy books would be funny if they wern't so boring and vague. I think Daniel and Jonah are the only ones that had some entertainment value. The rest though, forgetable.

1 Samual-2Kings is still pretty epic stuff though. They should adapt more Bible movies of those books. I wouldn't mind seeing Absalom hanging from 5 feet of hair after rebelling against David. It's dramatically heartbreaking, and comedically hilarious.

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But I digress. Old Testament is still pretty appauling to me. And you know what, I think the New Testament is still pretty bad too. Maybe not in the Bloodshed category, but the morality of it. Pauls Writings, need I say more. That dude wasn't just a terrible and trite writer, but his whole idea conflicted with everything. We really get to see the makings of a seriously fucked up cult in The NT.

12

Harry Pothead

by Strangelove in

my apologies, but there actually is no refference to marijuana in this post.

i just needed an attention grabbing title to get at least one person to answer the question i am to...ask.

i left the orginization only a few months ago.

Strangelove

All excellent advice, thank you all. :D

Definetly be reading and watching the films. See what the fuss is about. Hyped media like this usually has atleast one interesting merit to it. At the very least I hope to see the appeal.

@SarahSmile: Yes, I am aware of the Witch of Endor. When asking others what it meant, they would always say, "That's not really Samual, but a demon impersonating samual."

To which I would reply, "But how do you know for sure? They don't explicitly say it was a demon. Wouldn't a book from God not play so coy and specifically mention it was a Demon? Why the needless confusion? I mean, they don't even mention Satan in the Genesis account. Many years and books later did they refer to the Satan as the original serphant."

I've never been given a clear and understandable answer.

@Problemaddict: Well, that's a really long story I detailed better in a past welcoming thread. And detail even better in a memoir I'll never finish. But I will give you the low down to some of it.

*Read a lot of Dinosaur books before age 5. (I am a product of the 90's) So I constantly came into conflict with the theory of evolution, how we got here, why we are here, etc.

*Meetings ARE boring. (They were as a child, including the spankings. And even as a teen when I tried to make them interesting, my attention dazed)

*Parents were not the pushing type, but flawed enough to help me see the hypocrisy in the religon itself without realizing it.

*The idea my classmates would probably die in Armageddon, depressed me.

*When I was 16, I doubted the existance of God. And was terrified at what this implied. So, for the next 4 years, I read the Bible front to back.

When I started, I had some faith, when I finished, I had no faith.

*It was more or less my personal struggle with the Bible. I hold very strong views within feminism. And hated how The Bible and Society portrays them as second class citizens. I could not support that no matter how much I tried. The weaker vessel crap. I read so much philosophy and feminist literature. Came across Apostate sites from time to time. They at first scared me, but the sentences never left me. I always wondered why we shunned Apostates. Shouldn't we have enough faith to stand up against any who dare challenge us. We have the true religon right? (Which in of itself is a big coincidence when you think about it. Being born in the exact right religon. What are the fucking odds right?)

*When they shove harmony at you. No, there are inconsistancies. Faith can only patch up so much bullshit before it comes crumbling down. And of course, hearing the same damn message over and over and over. Pretending you were encouraged by the same information you heard last year.

*Outside influence helps. I, at 17 wanted to pursue marriage. But had noticed how all JW Marriages seemed miserable. My standards so high, how could I just go from Kingdom Hall to Kingdom Hall asking elders if there were any single sisters. That is so, ugh, goodbye dignity. I developed feelings for a non religous co worker, and it really helps when you love someone more than God. Ya know? Than you don't mind questioning things as much. Got involved in Yoga, which has been really helpful in overcoming the whole despair of things. I mean, I really don't know why I should even carry on. Seeing as I have thrown away all my dreams for a false religon.

*I honestly just kept asking questions and ran into dead ends. I realized I could never dedicate my life to something I only half believed in. So why waste my time any longer? I spoke with an elder why he wouldn't see me at any more meetings, and havn't been back since. My father has been the only issue. He kicked me out for some time. Only now, after these past few months have I been able to work my way back in.

Though he does family worship with my sister over the phone. I of course feel like the asshole. Being that I'm rolling my eyes and pretending it's reppellent like I once thought of the cross. I mean, even the music is just ugh. He overplays it on purpose.

But I digress. That's just me venting.

35

Public Speaker Cries During His Talk

by James Jackson in

his talk was about reaching out for the real life.. he is in his mid seventies, then begins to rant on about staying loyal to the organization because many of us have lost loved ones in death and if we want to see them again we must remain in the organization.

he says he wants to see his father again, then the tears begin to flow right there on the stage.... then an elderly sister during the watchtower study admits to regetting leaving her daughter behind to seek a better life in the u.s, and she is crying.... these 2 meetings was just plain weird..

Strangelove

Whenever I warn others about Jehovah's Wittnesses, they sometimes ask how even supposedly "Smart" people get suckered into it.

That's usually to do with manipulation. If you have a dead loved one, I noticed in service how the householder would jump to scriptures pertaining to the ressurection. It's an emotional tactic that even Intelligent people are susceptible to. Getting them when they are weak. How tacky can you get? (rhetorical)

I've seen a few elders cry on stage. It never came off as sincere to me. Kind of like the Dramas.

62

How We Come Across On The Board

by minimus in

jw
friends

most people here have never met you.

we converse, discuss, argue, laugh, agree, question, share our lives..... quite often, you kind of get to know what a person is like.

some people, we tend to gravitate to and others, we shy away from.. how do you think you come across to other people?

Strangelove

As a result of all of this, I often wonder how I come accross to others, because I still don't feel that I know myself. Yikes!

~QUANDRY

***

From that post of yours, I think it's safe to assume you are a sincere, earnest and humble woman.

I myself struggled between outside opinions from the Philosophy books I was reading, and dedication to the Watchtower. So much so, that I don't think I know who I am either. Spent so much time without an identidy.

Now, skeptical of everything, It's as though I am permenently on the fence for good. Maybe, it's not so bad. Hemingway once said the only way to know if you can trust someone, is to trust them. I like that, but frankly, after being so anti trusting to anyone, it's much harder to get hurt. Though the quality of your life seems iffyer.

I occasionally ask myself why I am on this earth, and can't come up with squat diddly. (Much worse than Diddly Sqaut)

---

Good god I went off topic a lot back there.

Bottom line, I wouldn't be too concerned with who you are. Just focus on being the best person you can be. And if you don't know what that is, research who you believe to be good role models, and take some of there life lessons and make them apart of your ideals. Have a form of integrity to a standard. Then find another person who seems relativly well off, and differentiate their good qualities from their bad. And yeah, that's what i do. Take the best part of people I meet and make it part of my personality.

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24

If Jealousy is a sin, why is God a jealous God?

by jam in

i'm sure someone will explain the difference between a. sinful jealousy and a holy jealousy..

Strangelove

Well, revenge is a concept reserved only to God (According to the doctrine)

Same thing can be applied to violence. We may not be able to kill others, but God(Or Jehovah mind you) can. Because... Well, because he's god I guess.

---

That's actually one of my biggest issues with morality. We are supposed to be appreciative for "God" creating us and the universe, and that we have to just want to serve him because of that. I'm sorry, but I can't operate that way. It's an artificial way of removing free will. Tricking yourself into believing it's okay. Because God said so. Why is Jelousy, Homosexuality, Blood Transfusions etc. Wrong? Because God said it is, and he made everything, so you have to listen, or should want to listen.

---

That's not a good enough answer for me, and one of the zillion reasons I left in the first place. As someone cool once said, "Such a god does not deserve my worship."

62

How We Come Across On The Board

by minimus in

jw
friends

most people here have never met you.

we converse, discuss, argue, laugh, agree, question, share our lives..... quite often, you kind of get to know what a person is like.

some people, we tend to gravitate to and others, we shy away from.. how do you think you come across to other people?

Strangelove

I try to be as close to my real self as possible. It's an attempt I haven't failed at as of yet. But there is always tempation to seem better or worse than you really are. That can an IRL issue as well. (Which has often led me to be very critical of myself in interviews)

As far as how I come across. Hmmm. I would assume somewhat naive. Someone who is still getting there footing after leaving a monstrous cult they spent almost 20 years in, brainwashed. There might be a rebellious anger, I admit I cannot hide that one well in certain scenarious. The Watchtower brings the worst out of me.

I still hope I come across as kind. Just a bit of a venter.

And I also realize I am not the most active poster in the world. But I do watch over this place with consistancy. I steer towards members like "Outlaw" and "Don't call me Shirley." They are, as I would describe, Intellectual jesters. They make me laugh and think, the best damn combination reachable in an insightful conversation. Oh and "Breakfast of Champions." Because even though I've never spoken with this memeber, we both share in common a particular liking for a certain writer. ;)

There are too many to count, a lot of the members on here are fantastic! Though if I were to avoid a certain kind, I admit to skimming through the religous apostate's posts. Not to make enemies of course, but the type of apostate who leaves the Watchtower and joins another religon. It's nothing against them, I just have a lower tolerance or patience for religous matters anymore. I am by no means an Atheist, but I listen to them a tad more. If that makes sense.

12

Harry Pothead

by Strangelove in

my apologies, but there actually is no refference to marijuana in this post.

i just needed an attention grabbing title to get at least one person to answer the question i am to...ask.

i left the orginization only a few months ago.

Strangelove

My apologies, but there actually is no refference to marijuana in this post. I just needed an attention grabbing title to get at least one person to answer the question I am to...ask.

---

I left the orginization only a few months ago.

And on occasion, I have wondered, is a normal life possible beyond The Watchtower? The answer is yes, I know that much. But it's become increasingly apparent how difficult it is to achieve. It's like its very own Mid-Life crisis.

I am more aware of all the things I missed out on as a child growing up. No finances or mental preparation for college, having to tell every school friend why I had to decline there birthday gift or why I would not be attending theres. Yeesh. I felt like an asshole then, and still do.

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So here is a breif bio on the whole "Magic" concept with me and my family. From my research, it appears every hall and individual is different.

Wizard of Oz/Disney = Good.

Harry Potter/Lord of the Rings = Bad.

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I must admit, most "Friends" I knew had either seen "LOTR" or at least read the Hobbit. With at least one or two holding massive convincing stances against Lord of the Rings.

One thing that everyone seemed decided on though, was that Harry Potter was evil, demonic, etc. I heard so many talks on it at conventions or sunday. An example would be: "Just look at the movies coming out today, with their Wizards and..."

Time has progressed though, replace Wizards with Vampires, and you are now caught up on what they condem in entertainment. (Don't get me started on the debates concerning Jame's Camerons Avatar)

I tried to, at the time, be the best Wittness I could be. So when my family was off having fun, I would decline to see the Lord of Rings and such. Never truly reminising how everyone thought Disney was somehow OKAY. I mean, what's the difference. Perhaps the tones, but magic is magic.

I'm pretty sure the only reason the whole "Consious Matter" thing is still going, is so The Governing Body and bethelites can read and quote from questionable material. I mean, it's a guess. They seem to have a double meaning or standard for everything.

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Now, as someone trying to be the Best Apostate they can be, I wanted to explore Harry Potter. Yeah, simple enough.

Again, I don't know if this is just me rationalizing a way to reckindle with everything I didn't have as a child. Or that I am genuinly curious.

I guess my Question is, is Harry Potter any good? I'm an avid reader, and wonder if I should just read the books first. Than start the films. (In private of course, my family would have a hissy fit.)

Would I at all, look a bit odd (An Adult) Reading books for children? (I read Twain, with his Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Finn. Those were intended for children, but at least it's kind of understandable why an adult could be discovered reading them.)

All answers are appreciated, even negative constructivly critical ones. ;)