Posts by OneEyedJoe

12

For All Of Us That Doubt 1914...

by pixel in

for all of us that think the wt/gb/fds will fade away 1914, this is what they have to say on a news release from the website talking about the international convention: .

the program will highlight a central theme of the bible and two core beliefs of jehovahs witnesses: that gods kingdom was established in 1914 and that jesus christ is the king of that kingdom.

really, the convention marks the centennial of gods kingdom.. lol.

OneEyedJoe

They'll try.

Something tells me the XJW community ain't gonna make it too easy, though.

Yeah, that pesky 'ol internet really ruins things...It's a shame it wasn't around in 1874.

12

For All Of Us That Doubt 1914...

by pixel in

for all of us that think the wt/gb/fds will fade away 1914, this is what they have to say on a news release from the website talking about the international convention: .

the program will highlight a central theme of the bible and two core beliefs of jehovahs witnesses: that gods kingdom was established in 1914 and that jesus christ is the king of that kingdom.

really, the convention marks the centennial of gods kingdom.. lol.

I don't think this means that they're not changing it, they're just doing damage control. Right now, its in everyone's mind because anyone that's been in for ~10 years or more has always thought to themselves (whether they'll admit it or not) that surely this system will end by 2014, as there's just no way a generation can be more than 100 years. So there's likely a lot of discouragement out there, and likely some are talking about it. Just like in advertising, when you don't like what people are saying, change the message. So in the short term, they're going to celebrate 2014 like it's a good thing, convince everyone how great it is, then in the next year or so they'll stop talking about 1914 all together. After a little time has passed, they'll slip in a WT article that will reduce the significance of 1914. Then slowly they'll replace it with something else and let it fade into history along side 1874.

45

BOE: Re: Midweek meetings during visit of circuit overseer

by pixel in

you read it here first!.

to all congregations.

re: midweek meetings during visit of circuit overseer .

OneEyedJoe

This is good news. One less talk by the always charismatic CO may help in my endeavor to get my wife to wake up. Hopefully I'll only have to attend one or two more CO visits anyway, but I suspect it's going to take longer than that.

It's funny, as the reduction in meeting length and the reduction of the number of meetings was one of the many small pushes that made me reexamine things. I just couldn't reconcile their constant urging to think to yourself that the end will be the day after tomorrow with the reduction in activity. Surely if the end is so near, we should be ramping up!

16

If your not baptized in the name of the father, son and holy spirit. was your baptism official

by goingthruthemotions in

matt 28:19 "go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the father and the son and the holy spirit,.

i don't ever remember hearing at my baptism nor any other baptism of a jw.

the person giving the baptism talk or person doing the dunking saying that i/we are baptized in the name of the father, son and holy spirit.. so i have come to the conclusion that my/our baptism's are not official.

OneEyedJoe

My baptism was the result of my being a victim of fraud, so I need no further justification for considering it entirely invalid.

43

"Only if you get a court order." wink, wink

by rebel8 in

recently had a discussion with a surgeon who said jw parents "usually" (her word, not mine) privately say they will take blood if the provider gets a court order.. yet another person, with no connection to dubs and no motive to make this up, saying this same thing.

interesting.. i'm surprised the thought police have not come out with an article saying jehoopla reads the hearts and judges as bloodguilty those who are relieved when forced to take blood..

OneEyedJoe

If that were so, I doubt it is recent teachings. As already mentioned, the WTBTS is wriggling out of the no blood stance ever-so-slowly, and may be soon a 'conscience matter'.

I hope this happens soon. I think it would serve as a great catalyst to help my wife (and likely others) to wake up. If they make all blood transfusion a conscience matter, I'll ask my wife: "Now that it's OK to accept blood, how do you feel about the fact that you could have been made blood guilty by participating in the preaching work?" When she doesn't understand, I'll present the scenario of studying with someone who gets baptised and later dies because they refuse blood. Wouldn't you be, at least partially, responsible for their unneccesary death?

One of the things I'm most thankful for is that I was never actually "successful" in my ministry and none of my studies ever progressed.

64

First Post - Emotionally Torn

by scaredtospeak in

i haven't been on here long but i found this site a couple days ago and quickly realised it had a lot of posts by people going through similar experiences as me.

i read some of the answers and it helped relieve some inner anguish i've been carrying since everything i came clean to my parents about everything i've been reading about.. .

i just have been going through a rough patch right now; that might be an under or overstatement depending on your own personal experiences with this kind of stuff.

OneEyedJoe

You're absolutely not alone. Thank you for sharing, as your words are bound to be a similar comfort to others as the stories you've read here were to you. I know they are to me.

I've had many of the same thoughts that you had, but was (for a while, at least) more successful at suppressing them. I would always make excuses for the illogical and circular reasoning often employed in the WT/Awake magazines to explain why evolution is false, why Noah's flood really happened, etc, etc. Eventually I finally started to realize that the truly logical and well-reasoned arguments made in the magazines were, by far, in the minority. I let that fester in me for several years before fully "waking up" and I certainly wish I'd done it sooner.

For a while I felt guilty for my doubts, but when I realized that I was merely using my "god-given" powers of reason purely motivated by a true desire to find the truth, I realized that there was nothing that I could possibly be guilty of. In the back of my mind, my conscience accused me of being selfish, that I just wanted to be able to sleep in on saturdays and watch TV on thursday nights, but when I made an honest appraisal of my motives, I found that I would be elated if I found that the JWs had the truth, and I would gladly "seek first the kingdom" if that was what was the logical conclusion. It just wasn't. So I hope you are similarly able to fight feeling guilty (it's still a challenge at times for me too) and realize that any difficulties that arrise from your realization are not your own fault. It sounds like you've truely acted out of pure motives to know what really is the truth, if others reject you because of it, that is their choice and their fault, and something that they should feel guilty for, not you. For an organization that throws the word "truth" around so much, it's insightful what happens when you actually set out in search of truth.

I wish you the best of luck in dealing with your parents. I know mine would go insane if they knew what I truely thought, even more so if it where at your age. Try to be patient, though, and realize that they've been lied to by the organization even more than you have, and they're victims of it as well.

I feel it need be stated again, though. Never feel guilty for thinking for yourself. Never feel guilty for seeking truth with a pure motive. Never feel guilty for asking questions. Never feel guilty for pointing out flawed reasoning. It's probably going to be impossible to completely avoid feelings of guilt, as it is hammered into anyone who spends any amount of time in the organization. When you start to feel guilt, or doubt your conclusions, remind yourself of how and why you came to them.

10

I need to verify some information

by JeffT in

jw
friends

there have been a lot of threads regarding changes in donations, kingdom hall ownership etc.

and what it all means.

i'm about to put on my accounting hat on and seriously consider the what it all means part (and why they may be doing it).

OneEyedJoe

or this has nothing to do with legal concerns over loans and property ownership. I think it's that last part. I think it is simply the Borg thinking short-term and seizing the cash to pay off the lawsuits known and upcoming.

That seems plausible. Someone noticed the large supply of money being held by individual congregations and wanted to figure out a way to get thier hands on it. So they work backwards from the desired end result:

We need the money they have on deposit, but many are saving for remodels/major repairs.

We need them not to save for remodels, and need to make the solution appear 'loving' -> so tell them that we'll pay for remodels and all loans are forgiven.

We don't want to lose the revenue stream from the loans for unneccessary renos, so tell them to continue at least what the loan was, but just call it a 'contribution'

Hey, while we're at it, maybe we can use the oppurtunity to "equalize" and get everyone to pay like they've got a loan, even if they didn't have one!

And boom, there's your 3/29 BOE letter.

103

Additional BOE Letter: Please Be Advised that Further Direction Will Soon be Sent to the Bodies of Elders...

by TTATTelder in

dear brothers:.

we are writing as a follow-up to the letters dated january 24, 2014, and march 29, 2014,. to all congregations regarding the adjustments now underway to accelerate construction of king-.

dom halls and assembly halls.. .

OneEyedJoe

Is that what the letter is referring to when it "suggests" to the Elders to "resolve" the same amount as their payment?? If I understand correctly, that is what is being kept from the sheep. I also wonder if the Eldums realize what we suspect, that is, an indefinite "resolved donation."

Yep. In halls that have a loan (even if it's going to be paid off in 3 months) they're not supposed to bother passing out slips and just resolve to continue paying AT LEAST as much as their current loan payment. They'll then throw away the loan documents (who needs 'em now!) and there will be no evidence of when the loan would have been paid off. Then next May when they go to pass a new resolution, they'll make sure to make it for at least as much as the previous year, and that'll continue forever.

I half expect the new letter they said to wait on will re-emphasize that they expect congregations that had a loan payment to continue paying at least as much as the payment. They're probably not so concerned about people misunderstanding whether or not to put down their total dontation or just the amount to send for this new fund, but I sure bet they're worried when they hear that people think their loan has been forgiven and they no longer have to pay it.

103

Additional BOE Letter: Please Be Advised that Further Direction Will Soon be Sent to the Bodies of Elders...

by TTATTelder in

dear brothers:.

we are writing as a follow-up to the letters dated january 24, 2014, and march 29, 2014,. to all congregations regarding the adjustments now underway to accelerate construction of king-.

dom halls and assembly halls.. .

OneEyedJoe

The emphasis was kept on the "WORLD WIDE PROJECTS" during the discussion. I wondered, " How is a surplus going to off-set a deficiency when those with deficiencies are asked to donate even more? If they can't donate, then obviously the past arrangement didn't work. or there would be no deficiencies. If no one is thinking of actually increasing their personal donations because we are $300.00 ahead, and that will just be the new "resolved" donation, then NOTHING has changed at all. There still won't be a surplus, just a re-shuffling." Does that make sense??

The difference is that before, once you paid off the loan, that extra $300 would no longer be needed. Either people would reduce the amount that they donate once it's announced that the loan is paid for, or the extra $300 would go into the congregation's account. With the new arrangement, that $300 will continue to be paid forever, likely with future pressure to increase the amount yearly.

30

"we must be ready to obey, even if it doesnt sound reasonable from a human standpoint"

by stuckinarut2 in

so its now all clear!.

the reason why that damned wt article several months back said the quote:.

"we may be asked to do something by jehovahs organization, and we should be ready to obey even if it doesnt seem reasonable from a human standpoint or not".

OneEyedJoe

In a recent circuit overseer talk this "Crazy but obey clause" fulfillment was said to be coming in the FUTURE, soon.

in other words: " you have seen nutting yet "

Our CO presented a hypothetical situation in which we were told to go to the KH, and then told that we couldn't leave (possibly for days/weeks) and asked if we'd have enough faith to do so, not worrying about our material posessions and even our pets. He essentially said that god would take care of our pets for us. This was among the many small pushes that got me to realize TTATT. Even my wife afterwards said "I don't know if I could leave the dog at home alone" and she's not even particularly fond of the dog.