Posts by OneEyedJoe

13

Is Watchtowers view & practices currently split in two? Split leadership direction?

by thedepressedsoul in

i've been deeply following jw "culture" the last 2 years and i am getting the impression that the leadership is currently split in two different directions.

on one hand you get this sense of a happy, joyful and less strict religion and on the other hand there is still this strict, harsh religion of the past.

let me explain more.. there have been a lot of video's lately that show dancing in kingdom halls, bethel dancing to the "happy" song, jw.org downplaying their beliefs and making it sound like daisies.

OneEyedJoe

I'll say it before vidiot comes in here and says it (I happen to agree)

the rebranding is about presenting the appearance of "mainstreaming", whilst keeping the internal policies unchanged.

I think in most cases where you have leadership by committee, you'll see some degree of mixed messages coming through, so that may be a part of it as well. I think GB 2.0 is much more in the loop as to what's really going on than their predecessors, (even if they don't realize it and consider themselves to be true believers) so they're inevitably going to be more manipulative about presenting a great facade for the org while leaving the insides rotten. I think it all started with the public/study WT split - at least for me that seems to have been the beginning of their efforts to put on a good face for the public while keeping the true policies as harsh as ever.

19

Has the WT ever specifically said in print that GB is NOT the FDS in contradiction of current position?

by Pubsinger in

just out of interest.

OneEyedJoe

That '81 article is pretty damaging to it's current position. If I ever get asked if I believe that the FDS is God's channel for communication on earth today, I will say something to the effect of: "How can I believe that when they where confused as to who the FDS even was until 98 years after Christ was enthroned! They didn't even realize when they were appointed, and what they were appointed over. How can I believe that they are God's channel if they couldn't get that on simple thing straight 100 years ago?"

In my head, I've played out the possible scenario of being asked the 'apostasy question' about believing the GB is the FDS. I think I'll start with "First, I'd like to point out that you didn't believe that until a couple years ago." Then say something like "there's actually some pretty firm scriptural evidence that this is not the case" and pull out the '81 WT article. Depending on the situation (i.e. if I really don't care if I'm DF'd) I might add - "this article makes it clear that anyone that insists that the GB is the FDS is an apostate!"

19

Has the WT ever specifically said in print that GB is NOT the FDS in contradiction of current position?

by Pubsinger in

just out of interest.

OneEyedJoe

One other thing - if you have time to read the full article it's actually sorta funny in light of their current stance. In hindsight, it reads almost like a case study in how to manipulate scripture to "force an interpretation of the parable" (right after saying there's no point in doing so). If I remember correctly, much of the reasoning rests on the way isreal is refereed to sometimes as a single entity and sometimes as a group of individuals. It really demonstrates that they can interpret anything anyway that they want to and they'll find backing for it somewhere in the scripture. Of course, this isn't unique to JWs.

19

Has the WT ever specifically said in print that GB is NOT the FDS in contradiction of current position?

by Pubsinger in

just out of interest.

OneEyedJoe

"Witnesses of Jehovah understand that the "slave" is comprised of all anointed Christians as a group on earth at any given time during the 19 centuries since Pentecost. Accordingly, the "domestics" are these followers of Christ as individuals.

Some readers may feel that this is a rather sectarian view of matters. Or they may object to the idea that the "slave" and the "domestics" represent the same class, one as a composite body and the other as individuals. The objectors may arguethat not all of Christ's anointed disciples have a share in preparing the spiritual food, so that perhaps the "slave" pictures only the leading ones, and the "domestics" those they serve in the congregation.

There is no point in trying to force an interpretation of the parable. Self-deception is of no benefit and is spiritually damaging. Therefore, we must look to the Scriptures for an understanding. In doing this, what do we find?
[ ... ]
Thus we see a clear Scriptural basis for saying that all anointed followers of Christ Jesus make up God's "servant," with Jesus as its Master." Watchtower1981 Mar 1 pp.24-26

Pulled this from the jwfacts article on the FDS. The 1981 WT (during the ray franz apostasy scare) specifically describes the idea that only the leadership is the FDS as an apostate teaching.

111

Conti Appeal Preview - Oral Argument Jan 14

by Chaserious in

with hopefully a good deal of interest here in the conti appeal tomorrow (or later today, depending on where you are), i thought that on my ride home from work tonight i'd preview what to expect and what i think the key issues are for any who are interested.

i have had a busy few weeks and haven't had time to read everything, but i had some time to look at the appeal briefs during my work commute the past couple days.

it'll be interesting to see what develops out of the network news coverage of this case.

OneEyedJoe

That'd potentially be a double kick to the WT's balls, actually.
If the number of alleged past offenders are as high as we suspect and were no longer able to hold their positions, the sudden dearth of "qualified brothers" would severely hamper the Org's ability to function internally.

I hadn't thought of this angle before. This could be a significant factor in their refusal to comply with Zalkin's subpoena for their DB of child molesters - they don't want that list to make it to the public domain because many of the folks on it are elders/COs/etc. Imagine someone setting up something like the sex offender DB for JWs. That would cause quite a stir if only a small percentage of JWs stumbled upon the fact that there were child molesters working as elders in their congregation.

13

No Natural Affection

by Sail Away in

do you remember how the wt society likes to quote the scriptures that say "the love of the greater number will cool off" in "the last days" and men will have "no natural affection"?

they applied this to "worldly people".

even before my exit i, used to think that scripture applied to members of the "christian congregation" too.. i haven't written to my jw mil in about a year and a half.

OneEyedJoe

This is a sad story, and I'm sure one that too many here can relate too.

I'm constantly amazed by the stark contrast between the love I've seen in the supposed one true religion and that which I'm continually shown here, in a community of apostates.

55

The contempt of Anthony Morris: the face doesn't lie.

by freemindfade in

i have noticed something even long before even looking into ttatt, something about morris bothered me.

i am personally very attuned to body language, facial expressions and general subtleties in human interaction.

there was something about his face that really bothered me, and i will explain it.

OneEyedJoe

I think Lett needs to be examined as well!

Easy - he's just a complete idiot.

53

Display of National Flags in Kingdom Halls in Chile: WTS' Response

by BluesBrother in

remember this and other threads a few months back, on the subject that some kingdom halls in chile acquiesced to govt rules that every building should display the national flag on the day of celebration?.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/262505/kingdom-hall-chile-has-national-flag?size=20&page=1.

many of us here and around the net, calling on our dub experiences cried "never would that happen!

OneEyedJoe

Why couldn't they have had the same stance with the political cards in Malawi? Why were sisters raped and people killed due to this. How senseless.
It's amazing how things are changed (new light BS) when it fits THEIR agenda. Hypocrites!!!

Yes, it's absolutely disgusting. There was no ceremony involved in the purchase of a political card, neither did they actually have to vote or take part in any political activity, but it was important that they do as they're told and not exercise their conscience in that case. Similarly, when faced with loss of life due to blood loss, there's no room for conscience these days. It's amazing how this divinely appointed organization flawlessly gives the appearance that they're just making it up as they go along.

2

Tom Cruise, leaked Scientology video

by clarity in

just heard about this on a local radio station ... another cult being exposed!.

watchtower, it is getting hotter for you too!.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1575760/tom-cruise-scientology-video-leaked-on-web.html.

OneEyedJoe

Thought I was having deja-vu until I realized this story was from 2008. Brings back memories...I never saw the video but I read about it when it leaked. There was something in there where he was saying scientologists have a responsibility to stop and help if there's a car stopped on the side of the road because they're the only ones who can help. When I read that, it made me really uncomfortable as a JW because it sounded so utterly stupid, but at the same time sounded like something I'd expect to hear during a convention.

46

JW TV is the reason for the hysteria in the KH

by campaign of hate in

jw
friends

if you, like me, have noticed the sudden increase in hysteria in the khs right now, i put it down to that jw tv site.

its's far more extensive than i thought it was, i thought it was just 1, 1 hour program a month.

there's a s*** load of videos on that site.. and the real problem, from just watching a clip from each video, is that these guys are clearly "mentally unstable".

OneEyedJoe

I think they are trying to strain out the Fence Sitters and Faders. They are in the midst of building their new Headquarters and I hope they realize that with the Fence sitters and Faders goes the $$$$$$.

You may well be right about them using it to out fence-sitters and faders. I guess time will tell. Since it's 'optional' to watch the online stuff, those who aren't buying it anymore won't watch and it will be a little conspicuous from time to time allowing them to be identified more easily. I can also see them making it a regular feature of the meetings, though. The opportunity for increased indoctrination straight from the top (as well as fulfilling the GB's apparent need for the spotlight) will probably win out over picking out the ones that are only going to leave anyway.

I disagree, though, on the money. The fence-sitters and faders (faders especially) probably donate very little if anything at all. I tapered off donating at the KH probably 8 years ago, and stopped donating at conventions 3 years before I woke up to TTATT. If anything, the faders are costing them money, because if not for them taking up extra seats and not paying, they could consolidate KHs and sell some off, keeping the cash.