Posts by Adonai438

132

Can any Witness possibly anwser this question?

by jerome in

hello all... i came across this line of questioning many months on the inet so i decided that i would submit just this once to peer pressure and make a usefull contribution to the board.. here is the question... is jesus just "a god?".

many of the regular inet surfers would have come across this line of questioning before so if you have you could just sit back and relax and read the replys.. <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>.

me: so is he a 'lesser true god' or a 'lesser false god?'.

Adonai438

To Moxy:
Yes those scriptures refer to other 'gods' but what does it say about them? It is mocking the humans that have claimed godhood in their hearts-- it says 'but you will die like mere men'. It's a contrasting statement used to show how absurd it is to think of anyone as God but JEhovah/Yahweh Almighty.
To Annie:
You have valid questions but their is truth and answers to them

When God said to be making man in "our" image, as already posted--it couldn't be "angels" He spoke to, and the only logical explanation would have to be Jesus who was there.

You are correct-- as it later says its in the image of GOD (not God and angels) man is created. Angels where not created in the image of God.

So (1)if there were no other Gods before or after...and Jesus is globally referred to as "Lord and Savior"...HOW does this add up?

Exactly. Scripture says many things about the nature of God.
*Scripture says there is one and only one true God, Yahweh.
None other have been created or exist-- only 1 true God, all else are false.
*Scripture shows that there is one God that is plural in nature--
Genesis 1:26 'let US make man in OUR image...In the Image of GOD he created him.'
Genesis3:22-'The man has now become like one of US, knowing good and evil....'
Dueteronomy 6:4, the Jewish Shema said many times by Jews every where every day, 'Hear oh Israel, Yahweh our God, Yahweh is ONE':
The word for 'ONE' in the hebrew is 'echod' which is not hebrew for the number one, there is a separate word for the number, it's hebrew for one in unity. Like the word 'Church' is one church but indicates plural members. But especially like when the Bible says The two shall become 'ONE' in marraige. Two in ONE union.
*Scripture also calls all three- Father (duh ), Jesus, and Holy Spirit-God and says that all three have all the qualities of God.
I can elaborate on this as neccessary so if Scripture says all those things:
Only 1 God, Plural Nature, Describes only those 3 as God, then you have what Christian believe:
The trinity. The trinity has existed in Christian doctrine in writting since the beggining of Christianity (long before Nicea or the Catholic Church!) so this also lends some backup evidence that the belief is accurate.

And if (2) God and Jesus are one and the same, as some people say, HOW could God be talking to himself and saying to make man in "OUR" image?

God-Yahweh- in christian belief- is a trinity- tri-unity. Not three Gods, not one god with three faces, etc.. but 1 God revealed as Father, Son, & Holy Spirit. Each of these three are separate persons just like three people are separate, but the Bible says that they are one in purpose, essence, & being- they are one God. Since they are all three individual persons that have all existed eternity past and future, as they don't exist in time, they can talk to each other and do tons and tons-- even in the OT! I dont think the questions is how can they talk to eachother, it is how can they create man in BOTH their images if their images are allegedly opposite- created under-god VS. 'Almighty' Jehovah. Their images would not be the same then or compatible.

And if (3) God and Jesus are the same "person", and Jesus prayed to GOD...it's got to be explained somehow.

God is three personal, as the scriptures teach. The father, Jesus, and Holy Spirit are not alleged by the trinity or scripture to be the same person. See above answers

And when (4) Jesus died, (and they're, again, both the same, did God die, and commend his soul to himself???

Yes, Jesus being God incarnate, died. It actually makes sense that someone much greater than just a perfect person would be neccessary for the sacrifice that Saves the WHOLE world past, present, and future from ALL sin. Just a p[erfect man wouldn't be comprable to that. But contrary to JW doctrine the sould does not cease to exist-which is a whole other line of scripture!-- so Jesus didn't cease to exist at death. He commanded his spirit to the Father, not himself. Jesus took on the nature of man to save man from our sins.

[quote]A 30 year "bible student" has come down to asking questions that sound like they come from someone who doesn't know Jack about the bible. Discouraging, ain't it folks?
STILL loking for answers,[quote]
Faith like a child?! Just kidding
Questions are what life is about and God isn't afraid of them. He gave us his word so that WE would know him and his will-- not so some GB could tell us what God wants or is
It's not discourageing-- actually it's quite encouraging! You are asking importantquestions and seem to really care about the answers. That is encourageing. I don't know what you think of my breif answers but please email me to talk further if you'd like. I was a JW that left it for the true Yahweh and can honestly say I am a follower and christian now. I left because of reading the Bible for myself. It just does not say what JWs say it does. Still looking for answers is not a bad place to be as long as you want to know them.
I understand from where you are comming from on this and would love to chat further but I do need to go for now,,,,,
God bless,
Angie
edited to change a color

21

Did You Ever Read ????????

by YYHWH in

jw
friends

did you ever read any of the following completley cover to cover ?.

watchtower.

awake.

Adonai438

Most After I left JWs.

I have read the Bible through a couple of times, some of the particular books in it many times.
I have read many of the modern JW publications through for research purposes.

132

Can any Witness possibly anwser this question?

by jerome in

hello all... i came across this line of questioning many months on the inet so i decided that i would submit just this once to peer pressure and make a usefull contribution to the board.. here is the question... is jesus just "a god?".

many of the regular inet surfers would have come across this line of questioning before so if you have you could just sit back and relax and read the replys.. <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>.

me: so is he a 'lesser true god' or a 'lesser false god?'.

Adonai438

So, correct me if I'm wrong, you are saying YK, that the Bible says There is only one true God but Jesus is a different,lesser a god, that is created by Jehovah the Father? Jesus is also a true god in the sense that he isn't a false god but not in the sense that he's actually god?
OK, that doesn't work. The idea of saying 'yes the Bible says....' but then adding 'but it really means...'.
The 'but it really means' part isn't scripture, its added explanation so if it is contradicted by scripture then it (not the scripture) is wrong. I know you think you agree with that last statement but do you really when you can always 'trump' scripture with extra-biblical explanations?
What do you think of the following scripture:
Isaiah 43:10-11 emphasis on the second half:
"You are my witnesses," declares Yahweh,"and my servant whom I have chosen, So that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor will there be one after me. I, even I, am Yahweh and apart from me there is no savior."
God here is clearly saying that there are NO created 'gods' period-none before nor after. Since you 'think' Jesus is created (which is contrary to scripture also) and you 'think' he is only 'a god' then exactly when was he created? Before the Father, after the Father? Neither of those two options are right according to Isaiah and what does that leave?

16

I'M FREAKING OUT!

by SPAZnik in

today my best friend from the borg called me!

ok.. i've been officially out for almost a year now.. no contact with former "friends" & "family".. (just my mom checks up on me now and then,.

fishing for info on my "activities".

Adonai438

I agree
She's a true friend and who knows-- maybe she's looking for some answers you might be able to help her with. At any rate you owe it to the both of ya to at least see her. Be discreet if she wants it to be-- it's not being covert or sneaky- just private

13

Went to church...for the first time.

by Preston in

today, i went to church!

it is the first time in my life i ever set foot inside a place of worship for service, other than that of my former kingdom hall.

today i got up around 7:30 aware of the strange familiarity that i once had of getting up early to go to the kingdom hall ever sunday.

Adonai438

Actually, Focus on the Family is dedicated to families, strengthening marraiges, pre-marital counseling, child-rearing, counseling etc...
Counseling people that had chosen to be gay and now choose to be straight is only one facet of the organization. I also sort of take offense to the term 'anti-gay'. I don't know what your impression or meaning to it is but To not agree with)] but The Bible does not condone that lifestyle and that life style is not to be 'anti' the people. God and christians(most) love all people no matter their choices. Whether their choices are right or not is not up to the people but up to the standard set forth by God in his word.
It's not up to me/us to judge anyone.
Stepping into hot water here but the Bible speaks specifically about that life style and I urge you to examine what it says. God loves and accepts everyone who puts their faith in him but if you love God then please be open to his teaching and will in that area of your life. Not passing judgement-- just some food for thought

8

Who Else Preaches???

by Mister Biggs in

not that i am advocating one church over another.

rather, i'm just trying to make the point that other religions (such as the two cited below) have an organized preaching work.

jehovah's witnesses use the reasonings of, "who else carries out the commission to preach?

Adonai438

JWs are the only ones ministering huh ? Then how did Christianity spread through out the whole world from Israel this last 1800+ years or so without them? They may not like or believe in Christianity but it has spread through the witness of it's people. JWs are barely over 100 years old.
I believe most Christians 'preach' and all bear some kind of witness.
There are diferent biblical ways to share ones faith and none is better than the other--- ie:door to door is not the only kind that is right or should be done.
Most Christian churches although they were the first ones to go door to door do not any longer because of the mistaken association. Instead we have opted for less intrusive ways like street ministry, flyers, movies, music, free concerts, free food-- We share our faith in action and love-- not out of a need to log in hours! Not only that but we also care about the physical needs of the world and have missions, shelters, counseling centers, food shelves, and third world country work. JWs don't share their 'faith' in action and don't truly love their fellow man enough to help them even if they don't agree. Loving is a far more powerful witness for God than a magazine!
And then there is the most important witness of living to follow Christ. Every person that calls themselves a christian is witnesing-- it's just what kind of witness are you showing? Are you showing a love for others and love for God or are you showing your sinful side more often than not. The world sees that and draws conclusions about God based on that. One should really draw there conclusions about God from the Bible and it's evidence but observation is powerful and does weigh in most of the time.

56

Do you Remember the Moment you Stopped Being a JW?

by Smoldering Wick in

jw
friends

"it only takes a moment.

a moment of sanity.

clarity.

Adonai438

You are very talented at expressing your feelings and story! I was very moved by it and thank you for sharing it

I remember my epiphany very well.
I had been reading and studying the Bible on my own for a few weeks and had hit my rock bottom-- the crisis of conscience thing where I knew I was wrong and hated it. I hated being fooled and lied too and I hated myself for not checking the facts BEFORE jumping into it.

I was on my knees deep in prayer for the very first time in my life. I truly felt God's presence and his love---- I had never felt anything like that before. My prayer evolved from a shy,awkward, almost guilty for taking up God's time kind of prayer to pouring my heart out to a best friend. And somehow he was working to answer all my fears and questions and needs and by the time I was 'finished' praying everything was right and clear. I knew who I was, what I believed, who God was and felt tottally at peace even though I knew the inevitable of me getting kicked out of my home at 15 was going to happen very soon now.

I knew I was not a JW and I knew who I was/am.
I am a child of the true God. A unique person that God created very specificly and specially and lovingly- like he creates all of us-- that is strong, smart, and capable. He created me with a mind to use and choose and I stood by my decision to be a Christian and not a JW because I knew/know that while I'm not infallible I am not stupid and can understand the scriptures just fine on my own.
It's a great moment when one finds themselves.
<>< Angie

28

'Give me one reason I shouldn't be a JW.'

by Ephanyminitas in

what would you say if a close friend was to come to you and say: "i've secretly been studying with jehovah's witnesses and i plan to join their organization.

i know how you feel about the witnesses, but i truly feel that they are god's chosen organization.

i don't really want to hear anything negative about the society, but out of respect for our friendship, i'll let you briefly mention one reason why i shouldn't.

Adonai438

Because they are wrong.
Sorta simple as that!
If one truly loves and cares about Jehovah/Yahweh then they need to follow him and not a society or organization. The society disallows personal Bible study so a JWs faith isn't really their own. I want a faith that has proof and isn't blind. I want a God that isn't afraid of his own book! The true Yahweh is not afraid of each person searching for themself the truth. Each person personally is accountable for their own choices and can't rely on the hope that If they are (and they are) wrong then it's the Governing Body that'll take all the blame. They are making a choice what to follow and if they are wrong then they personally will pay the eternal consequences.
It's not about me personally being 'right', it's about an honest care for God and his word. If you read the Bible an honest person will see the JWs are misled and wrong.

8

REPENT! The End is (more or less) NEAR!

by Smoldering Wick in

jw
friends

the armageddon watch - repent!

there is so much hype on the internet actually everywhere about the end of the world and the new world order.

there are.... books printed on the subject: .

Adonai438

I do believe in the 'end' so to speak. Not like the JWs but like the Bible speaks of. The Bible says not to try and predict it and to not fear it so I am not pre-occupied with it. I know I am right with God and can't wait to be with him but it will come when it comes .

An interesting book series for fiction junkies out there is the Left Behind series. While the people and inner story lines are fictional the events/timeline are accurate to Revelations and other Bible passages on the topic. The Left Behind movie wasn't very good though.
Oh, and Omega Code II did suck and Omega Code I was only mildly OK but nothing special either.

13

Jews for Jesus

by nativenyr23 in

i've done a little research since leaving the wts and am having difficulting sorting out what i really believe in.

after some studying of different faiths and their doctrines, i find i can relate to the jewish faith....but i do believe in jesus.

so i found out about this faith called jews for jesus.

Adonai438

Hi Nativener, again :

I understand about wanting to teach your children

I humbly suggest teaching them basic truths from the Bible that they can use to judge religious beliefs by. These types of truth are easy to teach because there is mostly no dispute among faiths about them so you don't have to feel you are commiting to something to soon.
Principles that are important like the Bible is the standard and test for beliefs so whenever they come across an idea from your ex or otherwise they have the tools to evaluate it themselves. I don't know how old your kids are but there are things for all ages. Just reading the Bible together to see what it says and drawing lessons from that can be an easy way to teach them truth. As an adult that had a very poor upbringing I strongly believe in teaching kids the principles and truth to make decisions for themselves with.

I do not underestimate, however, the neccessity for you to study and pray and discover the truth in God's Word for yourself and to not put it off. This doesn't mean you have to pick a church right away, just that one shouldn't take for granted that they'll have time later to figure it out. Nothing is certain in this world. Life knowing God is wonderful and I highly recomend it . write if you have questions or want to talk,
<>< Angie