Great minds' meeting, as we usually say in French!
Narkissos
JoinedPosts by Narkissos
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23
Hilarious 'Christian' Kids Site...
by cypher50 inif you thought growing up as a witness was bad,
at least you didn't put up with self-righteous cartoon characters.
i particularly like how they portray eastern religions with that elephant named hadu?in case this has been posted before, my bad....
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Hilarious 'Christian' Kids Site...
by cypher50 inif you thought growing up as a witness was bad,
at least you didn't put up with self-righteous cartoon characters.
i particularly like how they portray eastern religions with that elephant named hadu?in case this has been posted before, my bad....
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Narkissos
Good fishing Cypher!
I "loved" this one too:
If you find an Atheist in your neighborhood,
TELL A PARENT OR PASTOR RIGHT AWAY!You may be moved to try and witness to
these poor lost souls yourself, however
AVOID TALKING TO THEM!Atheists are often very grumpy and bitter and will lash out at children or they may even try to trick you into neglecting God's Word.
Very advanced witnessing techniques are needed for these grouches. Let the adults handle them.
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Anarchism and Christianity
by Narkissos in.
nietzsche wrote anarchists and christians were of the same kind, because of their rejection of reality (as he saw it).
he hated both and was at the same time fascinated by both.. french author andre malraux wrote that jesus was the only successful anarchist.. french essayist jacques ellul, who was a protestant and is still very influential in the "alternative movement", wrote an essay entitled "anarchy and christianity", where he tried to show the convergence and difference between the two ideologies.. what do you think?
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Narkissos
Thanks for your posts. I just read the last two now (thought the thread was dead before).
I wouldn't have thought of William Blake as a "Christian" anarchist. I felt his mysticism was more "pagan"-oriented. I have to read more of him and about him.
About the origins of the "libertarian Jesus" in the NT, I feels it owes much to Hellenistic Christianity and its controversies about the law and the temple, which were put into Jesus' mouth in the Synoptic Gospels. The historical Jesus probably challenged the temple authorities from a very different point of view (very likely akin to the Essenes, that is: ritualistic and nationalistic). Paul's "justification by faith, not works of the law" could also be interpreted in a libertarian way, but his constant repression of "desire" stands in the way of such an interpretation.
Summing up, a fruitful misunderstanding?
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Narkissos
When I was in the French Bethel (20 years ago), health expenses were NOT covered by the Society. You had to pay for a doctor's consultation, medicine and so forth. There were local arrangements, such as organized visits to a JW dentist or ophtalmologist who treated Bethelites free of charge (perhaps with an indemnity from the Society, I don?t know). But we still had to pay for dentures or glasses. As dentures were pretty expensive, it often ended with simple extractions (you could have told an old and poor Bethelite from his smile, had he felt like smiling). In case of major surgery, most of us had an insurance (with a private JW insurance company) for which we had to pay with our monthly allowance or annual ?Personal expense account?. I suppose conditions were different in Brooklyn, with a partly internal health care system (?). However, I still feel the economic situation was definitely better for the average Bethelite than for special pioneers which had to pay for everything (food, clothing, shelter and health care) with their only allowance (ca. $ 100 a month in the late 70?s, $ 300 in the mid 80?s).
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Did Jeremiah deny the Torah as inspired?
by peacefulpete in"thus says yahweh of hosts, the god of israel: "add your burnt offerings to your sacrifices, and eat the flesh yourselves.
for in the day that i brought them out of the land of egypt, i did not speak to your ancestors or command them concerning burnt offerings and sacrifices ... how can you say, ?we are wise, for we have the law of yahweh, when, actually, the lying pen of the scribes has worked falsely?
" (jeremiah 7:21, 8:8)
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Narkissos
I have no documentation at hand so I won't be of much help. However, chapters 30--31 (including the New covenant) are usually referred to the time of the Exile because of parallels with 2nd Isaiah (40--55). Of course the same kind of "restoration prophecies" also occur much later (Zechariah 10 is a good example).
About the prophetic pattern "morals vs. ritual", it runs from Amos or Hoshea's time down to the synoptic Jesus, so it is very difficult to date such a text as Jr 7 on internal grounds. A postexilic (i.e. Persian) context is very likely though. The 3rd century seems rather low, but not impossible. I'll check that someday if I can.
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A serious question about the angels that materialized pre-flood
by TweetieBird inaccording to the bible, the angels saw the daughters of men, materialized into human bodies and married the women, had children.
here's my question...did they create for themselves a human body or did they transform themselves into a human body that already existed?
i know this may seem silly, but i was just wondering where the sperm came from to impregnate the women?
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Narkissos
Aside from the "Son of Man", the warlike Lamb (arnion) of Revelation (distinct from the amnos of GJohn) is a direct and striking influence of the Book of Henoch (89--90).
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A serious question about the angels that materialized pre-flood
by TweetieBird inaccording to the bible, the angels saw the daughters of men, materialized into human bodies and married the women, had children.
here's my question...did they create for themselves a human body or did they transform themselves into a human body that already existed?
i know this may seem silly, but i was just wondering where the sperm came from to impregnate the women?
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Narkissos
To AlanB and Heathen: The Book of Henoch (which is only complete in its Ethiopian version, although several older fragments in Greek and Aramaic have been found) was probably written from the 2nd century BC to the 1st century CE. Although it is certainly not "historical" in any sense, it had a big influence on the NT: as Leolaia said, it is quoted as Scripture in Jude 14f. The Gospels' formula "Son of Man", for instance, would not be understandable without it.
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Did Jeremiah deny the Torah as inspired?
by peacefulpete in"thus says yahweh of hosts, the god of israel: "add your burnt offerings to your sacrifices, and eat the flesh yourselves.
for in the day that i brought them out of the land of egypt, i did not speak to your ancestors or command them concerning burnt offerings and sacrifices ... how can you say, ?we are wise, for we have the law of yahweh, when, actually, the lying pen of the scribes has worked falsely?
" (jeremiah 7:21, 8:8)
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Narkissos
Just a remark: Jeremiah 7 (and 34:8-22) are evidently among the latest (post-deuteronomist) additions to the book, so they are hardly an evidence to the Exodus tradition in the time of the prophet Jeremiah. That being said, it is all the more noteworthy that the special prophetic emphasis (morals over ritual) is maintained against the mainstream priestly tradition.
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Debunking the Skeptics
by Tashawaa inhttp://www.abc.net.au/centralvic/stories/s1006138.htm
i thought the above link provides a good argument for those who doubt "his" existance.
sometimes we get so caught up in the "science" - we forget that with him "...anything is possible".. imo, i'd still believe due to my faith and evidence - there are the writings, personal experiences, songs, miracles, plus he has touched my heart..
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Narkissos
Wonderful thread (just sorry the misunderstanding didn't last any longer!). Merry Christmas everybody!
A fellow believer, ready for His impending return (everything shows this time we ARE in the very last days)...
Narkissos
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The article 'ho' in Jn 1:1c
by grzesiek32 inone of the most inconvenient verses for non-trinitaries is this:.
jn 1:1.
1. in the beginning was the word, and the word was with god, and the word was god.. .
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Narkissos
Gregor,
Your shortcut was too short IMO: the WT argument (as I remember it) was never that the anarthrous theos cannot mean "God", or that the article always implies the meaning "God". It was only based on a syntaxical phenomenon in koine Greek, that the noun as a predicate (or attribute) is usually anarthrous. This only leaves (grammatically) the meaning open. It's absolutely possible to translate "The Word was God" or "The Word was divine". "The Word was a god" is grammatically possible though logically impossible (just because it would imply polytheism, which doesn't fit in the Johannine perspective).
Incidentally, in the first French NWT (1974), the translator argued that in French a predicate usually doesn't have any article, and translated "La Parole était dieu" (the Word was god), with Brooklyn's blessing. In a new revision, however, the French NWT added the indefinite article in order to stick to the English NWT ("La Parole était un dieu" = the Word was a god).