Narkissos

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Posts by Narkissos

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  6

  Headline: "Jesus returneth, stumbles"

  by SixofNine in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  june 25, 2004 .

  fellow christians, .

  the second-coming of jesus christ was a magnificent and joyous day for all.

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  Narkissos

  !!!
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  36

  Jesus gave no signs

  by peacefulpete in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  according to mark 8:11-13 jesus was grieved even indignant at the request for some "sign".

  had he not done many before and would he not do miraculous signs yet?

  i propose (not original to me) that some early form of mark (urmark) or q contained no miracles.

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  Narkissos

  PP: in chapter 2 the controversy about forgiveness is "sandwiched" into the paralytic's healing, which stands without it; chapter 6 it is the flashback on the death of John the Baptist (a little different I confess). The others are pretty obvious.

  I personally don't wish to lose sight of this fact: our only material object for study is the text as it stands in its diverse manuscript tradition. On this ground we can build both diachronic (X- or Y-geschichte) and synchronic (structural, narrative) analyses: one does not rule out another, even when they are in logical tension. Of course I'm obviously speaking of "redaction". Btw, when it comes to the Gospels, I really wonder whether there is such thing as an "author" and where he/she hides...
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  36

  Jesus and the Samaritan Woman

  by Leolaia in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  twice (john 4:29, 39), the samaritan woman is said to have reported to her townspeople that a man had told her ?everything?

  one may surmise that those whom she told knew rather well precisely what the things were that she had done, for they followed her urging to see this remarkably perceptive stranger.

  precisely what did jesus tell her that so moved her and others, and how did he go about it?

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  Narkissos

  About the third day, besides the symbolical meaning which is pretty obvious, there is a reckoning problem in the actual state of the text: 1:29 the next day, 35 the next day, 43 the next day, 2:1 On the third day...
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  36

  Jesus and the Samaritan Woman

  by Leolaia in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  twice (john 4:29, 39), the samaritan woman is said to have reported to her townspeople that a man had told her ?everything?

  one may surmise that those whom she told knew rather well precisely what the things were that she had done, for they followed her urging to see this remarkably perceptive stranger.

  precisely what did jesus tell her that so moved her and others, and how did he go about it?

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  Narkissos

  A "prostitute" or "sinful woman" in the modern sense would bring us back to Giblin's solution (she has had five men -- six in fact -- not five husbands). However, in the semitic sense (à la Ezekiel or Hosea) an adulterous wife (lit.) "prostitutes herself from under (sic) her husband" and may consequently be repudiated... In the first-century society as it could be seen from pious Jewish eyes (such as the Herodian family as seen by John the Baptist in the Gospel) it was probably a fairly frequent expression (cf. Mk 10:11f which mentions "repudiation" both ways, as a Jewish view on Roman divorce).

  Btw, I just checked my 1998 French Jerusalem Bible and notice it still holds to the old allegorical explanation about the "five husbands" being the "five gods" of the slanderous story on the origins of the Samaritans (2 Kings 17.24)...
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  36

  Jesus and the Samaritan Woman

  by Leolaia in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  twice (john 4:29, 39), the samaritan woman is said to have reported to her townspeople that a man had told her ?everything?

  one may surmise that those whom she told knew rather well precisely what the things were that she had done, for they followed her urging to see this remarkably perceptive stranger.

  precisely what did jesus tell her that so moved her and others, and how did he go about it?

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  Narkissos

  Just because I love grammatical discussions

  Hos is formally a relative, but it is very often used as a demonstrative without any antecedent (or with implicit antecedent, which comes to the same). The nearest example is v. 14, hos d'an piè... Numerous examples with the accusative, 1:26,33... So I still think the simplest translation of v. 18 is "you have had five husbands, and the guy you're with now is not your husband": only one meaning of anèr in the sentence. The two meanings of anèr actually occur in v. 16-17, but the context is explicit. (Btw, why not imagine a divorced woman instead of a widow?)
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  41

  Zdravstvuite

  by Sneaky Russian in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hello my american friends, and those from other places

  i was a witness for almost 20 years, and have been through a lot to offer my story today.

  my mother was conned by the jehovah's witnesses when she was just forteen years old after sitting in with a schoolfriend on a bible study back in england.

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  Narkissos

  Welcome Sneaky Russian!
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  36

  Jesus gave no signs

  by peacefulpete in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  according to mark 8:11-13 jesus was grieved even indignant at the request for some "sign".

  had he not done many before and would he not do miraculous signs yet?

  i propose (not original to me) that some early form of mark (urmark) or q contained no miracles.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
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  Narkissos

  PP: The use of semeion in the pseudo-markan long finale seems to be closer from Acts' use of the term (2:19,22,43; 4:16,22,30; 5:12; 6:8; 7:36; 8:6,13; 14:3; 15:12), as it lacks the characteristic symbolical dimension it has in GJohn.

  The splitting of one story bracketing another, in a "sandwich" pattern, is a typically Markan literary device (cf. 2:1-12; 3:20-35; 6:14-29; 11:12-25; 14:54-72). The Jairus/hemorroissa stories are tied together by a number of words or ideas ("faith", or the "12 years" for instance). Your suggestion is very interesting however.
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  6

  Behaving like a prophet.................

  by Sunnygal41 in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  remember that term that the wts used in it's pubs?

  can anyone (like blondie) .

  terri

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  Narkissos

  Actually the NWT formula translates two forms of one Hebrew verb (nb'), related to the noun "prophet" (nabi'). This verb could be translated "to prophesy" but originally didn't especially involve talking, lest predicting the future -- rather ecstatic trance-like behaviour: cf. 1 Samuel 10:10ff; 19:20f; interestingly this weird original sense is smoothened into "prophesy in talk or in song" in 1Chronicles 25:1ff; 2 Chron. 20:37.

  Also, in the OT there are no "demons", and the "behaving as prophets" is directly related to the divinity (e.g. Baal in Jeremiah 2:8) or his/her "spirit" or "breath" (cf. Joel 3:1). The concept of "false prophet", strictly speaking, is absent too. In 1 Kings 22 Yhwh is viewed as causing genuine prophets to utter a misleading oracle through one of his "spirits".
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  36

  Jesus and the Samaritan Woman

  by Leolaia in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  twice (john 4:29, 39), the samaritan woman is said to have reported to her townspeople that a man had told her ?everything?

  one may surmise that those whom she told knew rather well precisely what the things were that she had done, for they followed her urging to see this remarkably perceptive stranger.

  precisely what did jesus tell her that so moved her and others, and how did he go about it?

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  2. 
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  Narkissos

  Well (!), it's not so important to me, but I'm hardly convinced by the explanation. The word anèr would change meanings in the same sentence (v. 18)? That's reading much into the text... As v. 17b shows, echein andra may involve marriage just as sou anèr. Moreover, if the "five men" are "illicit partners", just as "the one you have now", is the latter the fifth or a sixth one? Seems to confuse the narrative a bit more...

  By the way, the "meeting at the well" is clearly an erotic topos, from Jacob/Rachel story on... This even shows in the Johannine narrative, in v. 27: Just then his disciples came. They were astonished that he was speaking with a woman, but no one said, "What do you want?" or, "Why are you speaking with her?" And, whatever one thinks of Peacefulpete's reconstruction, the literary connection with Cana is obvious (v. 46 and the water jar, hudria, only in v. 28 and 2:6-7)
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  22

  Greatest tribulation upon Judaism?

  by peacefulpete in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  for jws and other fundementalists the destruction of jerusalem in 70ce is a unquestionably the fullfillment of the words in mark 13.19. however to see the city's leveling as the " tribulation such as has not occurred since the world's beginning until now" as referring to death numbers we must surmise the death toll to have been horrific indeed!

  josephus is of course oft quoted for the numbers.

  according to him 97,000 were taken prisoner while 1,100,000 were killed.

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  Narkissos

  Immediately AFTER

  Why don't you write "IMMEDIATELY after"?