Horrible isn't it?
Alive!
JoinedPosts by Alive!
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241
Another generation....
by joey jojo init has been 21 years since the 1995 article that pretty much buried the idea of the '1914 generation'.. remember those guys?
the ones born in 1914 that would still be alive when the end of the system arrived.. i'm glad i'm old enough to remember going from door to door, preaching this belief.
the reason i say that is because i have a lot of 'still in' jw friends and family.
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36
Coming to terms with the Watchtower experience
by Lee Elder init is a challenge coming to terms with your experience as a jehovah's witness.
if you were born and raised as a jw, and your parents were true believers, the impact on your life is profound, lasting, and largely negative.
in some cases quite abusive emotionally, spiritually, financially, educationally and yes, even sexually.. i recently watched "trumbo", and was quite moved by dalton trumbo's speech to the screen writers guild in 1970. here is an excerpt that i think is quite relevant to this topic:.
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Alive!
"Some suffered less than others, some grew and some diminished, but in the final tally we were all victims because almost without exception each of us felt compelled to say things he did not want to say, to do things that he did not want to do, to deliver and receive wounds he truly did not want to exchange. That is why none of us - right, left, or centre - emerged from that long nightmare without sin."
I needed to read this - I sometimes feel a complete fraud, because I enjoyed so many benefits, I had some fantastic experinces, whilst knowing many others were left at the side.....I at least backed those who I could back - but when all of the above became so obvious - I was done. And it's not been pretty.
I know, at my rawest gut level - the culture was wrong.....
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Alive!
Fink,
As a convert, from a good, reasonably normal family - I had been raised to have my questions respected and answered - and to offer the same transaction to others.
Initially, the JWs presented as having wonderful, interlocked answers .....I was told, as I bathed in this new wonderful hope, to put questions that can't be answered to the side for now, eventually the pieces will fit....even if it takes years.
I was LOVE bombed until my little heart was so full and I felt saturated.
My life and my connections expanded beyond belief .....
I quietened the disturbing gut feelings when I met yet another brother or sister whose whole mode of conversation in daily life was woodenly WT, complete with gestures, jargon words....you know the sort of thing.
I quietened the disturbing thoughts such as how could just a rejection of a magazine be the rejection of a universal Power....JWs regularly showed their distain when they turned their heel from a polite but rejecting door ('no thanks, I don't to read an article on family happiness, we're all ok here')
And then, the ongoing exposure to seriously disturbing thought patterns revealed by others, violent and dysfunctional families, depression, mental illness was and possibly is rife - too many, it was so thoroughly pervasive in every congregation I stayed at.....once the veil was lifted. This wasn't just imperfect men - something was up - and I 'covered it with love' without let up and then.....my heart lost its desire to bring anyone into this 'cage' - it wasn't safe mentally ....I couldn't ignore it any longer.
And now, after a life time of choosing 'loyalty' and trying to live a principled life - my character is trashed by the leaders.
Leaders who don't understand that I'm an adult and Christuan follower too - they do not have any right to interpret scripture for me and demand I accept it as 'new truth'.
At best, they should offer concepts and free discussion - but that's not how they wish to work. And their followers are diminished to having unauthentic expression and thought....
It is in fact the Watchtower Society who has become a division and sect by setting themselves up as the only 'channel to God'
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21
It's so awkward that people have to touch the emblems
by thedepressedsoul init's just so weird to me.
for a group that is against idolatry so much and yet each person has to "touch" the bread and wine.. one lady was standing and holding a baby.
she called the server over just so she could put her thumb on the bread and wine.. did jesus ever clarify what he wanted them to do in remembrance of him?
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Alive!
One lady was standing and holding a baby. She called the server over just so she could put her thumb on the bread and wine.
Really? You know, when you step outside of the 'magic' - you realise how mad this is.....and that's all we do at memorial night - everyone has to 'touch it' - one by one.
And the story of the old fella getting up from the end of the row, just to pass it on - that made me giggle @petezahut. Actually, this thread has brought some closure - it's a detailed ritual, yet, it really ignores the instruction Jesus gave - outside observers must think, how strange..... -
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Alive!
So true Luna.
I have placed reasonable questions in front of JW friends I have trusted and loved - easy to understand objections to various doctrines, doctrines that intelligent non-witnesses find repellent on good scriptural basis - in each case, I received a blank stare, followed by 'I need to research' followed by either a watchtower article...or 'have you been reading apostate material' or silence...inspite of the urgency of the situation as my 'trust' in the organisation was undermined by obviously massive holes in doctrine, rules etc.
Because I chose to live a life of vocal faith, witnessing, taking a 'stand' etc - when I could not support certain articles, or contrived 'new truths' I experienced angst beyond words....I was gagged. I broke the gag - the ongoing situation is darned hard.
I'm so sorry for your own difficult situation - it's hard to maintain ones sanity when we only want to live honourably.
'I'm ungrateful' to the org and God apparently - and just raising empty reasonings....WRONG.
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Alive!
No hatred as far as I'm concerned - but forgive me if my heart is a little broken that my husband and I put off having children as we will have them after Armageddon - in the 80s and 90s in our area, this was commendable and many, I mean Many made that often 'peer' pressured choice which also echoed in the publications and from the 'platform'.
I have just come back from a walk in the park - I saw many families together...different generations enjoying their family day out.
I bumped into a JW family - grandmother and daughter out with the grandchildren, we stopped and chatted.
So, excuse me while I just tend to my grief, while I put away the gnawing loneliness of not having made a nest.....
Instead I emotionally invested in other people's children, other families - who now go on their merry way.....tight in their own bubble, submitting their faith to men who tell them 'what will happen next' - whose prophetic history is a big fail....uninterested in 'truth' and 'principle' that engages with an observant world.
Decent people don't join anymore - they just breed their own.
But no, no hate. Just a rotten ache sometimes.
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Facing mortality after leaving the witnesses
by truthseeker intell me i'm not overly thinking this.. i'm 39 years old...still youngish...but i worry about getting old.
i look in the mirror and it depresses me.
i suppose i still cling to watchtower utopia when no one would age over 25.. i used to look forward to paradise earth because it meant all the evil in the world, nuclear warfare, terrorist attacks and sickos would be no more, but we are deep in the 21st century with no end in sight.. appreciate your comments.
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Alive!
Hi
I'm a convert, so the thought of growing old and accepting that is how I was raised....but still, after a couple of decades of systematically repeating 'Armageddon' will come before the generation of 1914 dies away, being systematically fed illustrations of youth and paradise - it is difficult for our minds to 'swap' the hope that paradise will get here before long and we won't have to deal with age and death.
Thats how we talked - we laughed and joked about our joy of knowing we'd never get old in this system - and now we have to live with something that is grittier and challenges us to grow in a real way.
I still believe in God and that Christ's coming into our dimension was 'light'.
To me, the Watchtower created a kind of 'spiritual materialism' ( I heard that expression elsewhere and it applies!)
We were always chatting amongst ourselves about 'the new system' - where we would live, how we would look and the improvements we'd like on our physical selves....
And now, the youth of JWs are having babies and families without a blink - whilst many of 'my generation' deliberately chose not to, as we showed our faith putting off the distraction of raising families.
Now, at 60 years old - I have no children with my husband .....I especially feel for him, as his siblings (non JWs) have big extended families of children, grandchildren family friends acquired through a life of 'doing life together' and old age is almost a rich pleasure to his siblings.
This 'spiritual materialism' which the WT created is not, I believe, the spirituality that strengthens in a true sense.....
You are young and you have the opportunity to make a difference to others, every day !!! focus on that, and the wrinkles will become your friend...
Well, that's how I see it - it's working for me :-)
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14
Didn't go to memorial this year
by silent inmy wife and i had business to attend to out of town today and i had thought if we made it back home in time, we'd go to the memorial.
as it turned out, we didn't get home in time and we missed it, but we had a real good talk with each other on the way home.
we are largely successful faders and at the very least, i like to try and make the memorial.
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Alive!
I do understand what you mean regarding that PTSD. For a long time, the meetings were making me ill.
I'd vomit before going....I was so stressed..the stress grew as my husband and I felt the cold distance of being 'socially shunned" - we were not under reproof and certainly not disfellowshipped - we'd been irregular for nearly a year as we sorted out some deeply private and difficult problems....when we went back we needed love, support and good cheer as we were thriving and earnest to just "get on" and do our best, be part of the congregation.
I remember crying on the way home so often - I felt so lonely - and once upon a time, we'd been in such a different situation - guess we dropped the ball meeting wise and we were left on the outside.
The elders knew what we'd been through - and you'd think they would want to be the family nest we needed so badly - as we had no family who were witnesses and who lived locally.
We didn't go to the memorial this year or last year - although we had a couple of texts reminding us in a kind way.
These days, the date isn't really a biggie for me - I can ponder on the meaning anytime, any day.
Take care.
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Is everything that doesnt add ud explained as a vision, a parable or a "poem" ?
by Bolthof inhi.. i meet up with a couple of jw once a week and it seems to me that every time i show them a verse that says something that contradicts their doctrine they say that it is a parable, a vision.. or a poem of some sort.
what are your toughts about this ?.
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Alive!
I was thinking about that scriptural account that Cofty quoted re Paul - how he desperately desired to be with Christ, in another dimension....
A pioneer born in 'sister' was catching up via email a couple of years ago.... She said something like this....
'I met a lovely woman today- I asked what do you think happens when you die - and she said that she hoped and believed she'd 'go home' to be with the Lord Jesus - I showed her from our magazine Feb 20something how our hope is on this earth, in a paradise - and her face lit up '
So, my friend was contriving to take away this woman's desire to be at one with Jesus and replaced it with a material hope in a material paradise without 'seeing' Jesus....
Looking at this from a spiritual point of view - it's a touch wrong....whether you believe or not.
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35
Money....
by The Rebel ini believe all our worst nightmare are believing money will make our life's complete.
i am not talking about money providing life's comforts, but i am mortified that contentment and happiness always requires " more money"..ummm i need a window cleaner, a flashy car and a 50inch t.v screen to be happy.
money...well in my opinion we need money integrity to be happy, but it seems such a waste of life to search for the making of money more than ....well what i mean "hey" most of us have more money than most, and would the making or having more money really make you happier?.
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Alive!
But the next day we did what I wanted to do and visited the " Tate" " The National" and " Portrait" gallery, we watched the street theatre, pickneted in St Jamses Park and marveled at the wild life , we also made a lovely movie as we walked around China Town, and Trafalger Square. This cost very little, and we all preferred the day.
Ahhhh - now that is my idea of a perfect day but I would add an impromptu visit to a midday performance at St Martins in the Fields.....:-)