what the hell ever happened to 'free choice'?
it is the law that we must change - no choice.
yet look at the new disaster this creates!
Sheesh,
I think that you took the initial post that we were trying to discuss out of context, Hillary_Step. I understand why you viewed it as a discussion of "right of government vs anarchy" as opposed to discussion of the law requiring cfl lighting. Reread the opening post.
All of this garbage that has followed is a total turn off to me. Incessant bickering is ultimately worthless.
what the hell ever happened to 'free choice'?
it is the law that we must change - no choice.
yet look at the new disaster this creates!
Government, like the law, works on the reality of approximation, not perfection, but with all respect, this has nothing to do with the point.
The fact is that it is necessary for responsible Government to 'intrude' into peoples personal choices over numerous matters. That it might get some of its mandates wrong some of the time is a given, but this does not undermine the principle of the necessity of government intervention in any way. If CFL bulbs better serve the community, as they do, then it would be irresponsible for them not to mandate their use.
It seems to me that the US is terrified of anything that might even remotely be interpreted as 'socialism' with the same rationality that they might view witches in Salem.
Once again, I agree. But, your statement dosen't address the subject of the discussion here.
We're not talking about the "right" of government to pass legislation. We're discussing if this piece of legislation will ultimately be beneficial or eventually be viewed as a fatally flawed piece of legislation.
I understand your overview. I'm probably closer to a socialist than a capitalist if I were to take the time to sort out my personal views. I'm more a realist than either though. I find that I go for the grey, when I can. Compromise is what makes representation work. Well, in my bloated country anyways.
The "duty of governments to pass beneficial laws" discussion is for another thread though. This thread is about CFL's.
I haven't changed my stance on that topic. Sell me, I'll listen.
what the hell ever happened to 'free choice'?
it is the law that we must change - no choice.
yet look at the new disaster this creates!
You can buy CFLs that are the same size as incandescent.
Where? I've never seen a CFL that isn't medium base. If, the major light manufacturers are making other base configuerations, why aren't they available now? It's possible to make other configuerations of course, but why not ease into this technology rather than demanding it?
And by 2016, there will probably be good LED replacements for both.
When those LED replacements are available I'm with you. That isn't the only option either, but this is like beating the donkey to move faster rather than the old carrot on a stick.
my jw brother in law is one the phone with me right now.
when it rains it pours when it comes to sorrow.
Mountain,
Heh, is this the point when I link Leslie West and Mountain's "Missippi Queen"?
You and your brothers tastes in music were in sync with ours. The Winter brothers were always a blast in concert. What were some of your favourites?
what the hell ever happened to 'free choice'?
it is the law that we must change - no choice.
yet look at the new disaster this creates!
If it can be shown that the banning of conventional bulbs in favor of CFL bulbs produces some good for the COMMUNITY, then NOT to mandate such a change would be the actions of an irresponsible government.
That statement is true of course. What is just as true is that sometimes legislators pass laws that are more flawed than necessary.
One of the responsibilities of citizens in a representative form of government is to vote. Another responsibility is to discuss with your peers the laws that your government enacts. The next step is support those laws, or try to have them rescinded.
This is one of the forums we citizens can use to discuss the laws our elected leaders adopt. I always vote (jw years excluded). I also like to hear opposing views.
I oppose that piece of legislation, not because it isn't well intentioned, but because I think it's impractical with the options available today and very probably available when this will go into effect.
I stated the reasons I was opposed, and one of them was refuted. I'm glad it was refuted. This "Town Hall", as it were, is one of the ways I learn. I haven't read enough here to change my view, but I will...if I can be convinced that this law won't create more problems than it solves.
I would embrace a bill that "taxes" the use of incandescents to fund solar energy research, but I think elimination isn't practical at this time.
my jw brother in law is one the phone with me right now.
when it rains it pours when it comes to sorrow.
This was not too long before Cory was to die in a vehicle accident
I haven't lost a sibling yet. I can't even begin to imagine how hard that was for you.
When my dad passed, my siblings and I were together. We spent the next few days playing his favourite music and telling "Remember when Dad did this?" stories.
I bet if Cory were still with us, he'd want to be with you right now, and my guess is he loved music as much as you do.
You can't share the music and stories with Cory, but you can with us.
what the hell ever happened to 'free choice'?
it is the law that we must change - no choice.
yet look at the new disaster this creates!
They do this by using a high-frequency... in the kilohertz range... if not approaching the megahertz range. Way out of the 'headache causing' 60-Hz range of yesteryear.
Makes sense to me. I wasn't aware that they were able to overcome the 60 cycle strobe effect with the electronic ballasts.
what the hell ever happened to 'free choice'?
it is the law that we must change - no choice.
yet look at the new disaster this creates!
I do not like the light for one thing
As Jim_Tx pointed out, by changing the mix of phosphors, the color temperature of flourescent lighting can be matched pretty well with incandescent lighting, but it's more expensive than the standard bluish flourescent light.
I will be stocking up on a lifetime supply of incandescents before they stop making them.
That was my decision when I first heard this. I have a mix of flourescent/incandescent lighting in my home and incandescent can't be replaced by the flourescents in some applications.
can cause migraines
That's called the 60 cycle strobe effect and can be allieviated by good lighting design in a commercial building that has access to 3 phase power. Residences use single phase power so are pretty well screwed.
Flourescents also are more susceptible to temperature than incandescents.
I've also found the life expectance of the CFL's to be dicey. That could just be a result of poor quality control on the assembly line though.
In fact, I think the switch from the old core and coil ballasts to the electronic ballasts resulted in a more energy efficient product but one that was not as durable as the old technology. Again though, that could be just a trend towards less stringent quality control.
The change from core and coil style transformers to electronic helped improve fluorescent lighting, but it's not yet ready (and probably never will be) to replace incandescents completely.
I think this law is a bad idea, we need more viable options before we can say goodbye to incandescents.
over the decades musicians rise and fall like a spring wind.
some stay where they should never be, some never are where they should be; such is the roulette of time.
this thread is dedicated to singer songwriters who influence the rest of the best, but are seldom known - 'gamblers in the neon, clinging to guitars...' .
What a plesant surprise, this thread has returned.
With more great names as well.
Here's two more, more popular than the most recent entries but still both should be household names.
Peter Green was to electric guitar as Bert Jansch was to acoustic.
When he joined John Mayall it was obvious John had picked another winner. His creation of Fleetwood Mac made Peter more accessible. Sadly he withdrew from the music scene for years, Fred Neil style.
Here's Peter a few years ago (although he's back playing again and more recent clips of him are available)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxux5LdmjQU
Next is Dino Valenti who goes back to the Fred Neil coffeehouses. Dino gives a glimpse of what Fred might have sounded like if he had continued to perform. Dino also penned coincidently enough, "Get Together" which was made a hit by Jesse Colin Young and the Youngbloods.
Dino helped to found Quicksilver Messenger Service, but a marijuana bust landed him in Folsom Prison for a few years, so he missed some of the early days of QMS.
This is off of a solo Dino album from the late '60's.
but,,,,i dont come in contact with any men, lol.
my business (work) is female only and i dont go out,,,prob due to a lot of issues re dfing, etc.
any advice.
I'm not sure about the Yoga classes. I've seen mostly women at Hatha Yoga classes, which worked fine for me...
If you like outdoor activities how about the local Sierra Club (or it's BC equilavent)?
