Posts by beebee

3

Kids in handcuffs

by Tigerman in

.

what's the story on those two kids in florida who were arrested for drawing ' violent pictures' ?

anybody know ?

I lost the news report. Do you have a link? I saw the headline this am and immediately thought of this twisted little website - stickdeath.com. My kids think it's hilarious (and I watch what they do, but saw they lost interest quickly). It's basically stick people doing things that cause blood, like ripping another stick figure's head off. Twisted for sure, but something to arrest a child for imitating? No way.

Besides drawing is an expression, not an act. I would want to find out why they drew what they did. These kids were old enough to be skillful past the stick figure level so it was no accident that was the form they used, hence I really think it might have been a copy of the above website. However, asking questions to determine if their are upsetting issues in their lives is important. Kids do sometimes use art as an expression of what they are feeling.

However, boys will be boys. I don't allow guns in the house yet my son used to make them out of legos. I hope it truly pans out to be nothing, but would love to see the reason they felt a need to arrest children for drawing.

19

marriage outside of JW

by paradox213 in

can a jw marry outside of their religon?

beebee

Paradox, if I remember pregnancy and early motherhood (my oldest is nearing 18 so it has been a while), I found that even while pregnant I became very protective of my child and changed in many ways to reflect that. For example, I became obsessive about wearing a seat belt in the car (years before it became law to). I also called the IRS to tell them I wanted to settle and old debt (big mistake..don't ever do this).

I am not, nor have ever been a JW, but from what I am learning from my partner and these boards, is that the JWs believe that you must be a member in good standing in order to be resurrected after Armageddon, and that if you don't believe and act accordingly, you are doomed to Hell. As a mother, it makes sense to protect your children, and for a JW mom, that includes protecting their soul and their eternity. Hence her need to get back into the fold, even if it means excluding you, makes sense if you consider this belief.

She may well still love you, but her overriding need to protect her baby is winning. Also, depending upon her relationship with her family, she may feel the need to be closer to them, and to do that, she may have to be in the church.

At least that is what I suspect may be going on. Perhaps you can ask her. Getting her to assess her feelings honestly is a good start. IF this is the case, then you can figure out what your next path is. As to getting her to see the light and not go back, I can't offer any advice there as I haven't a clue. As an outsider it seems so illogical to me, but you're in a good place to ask those questions for many here have been through it.

However none of it looks optimistic. I will say though, if her goal in going back is to protect her child, it may prove to be the foundation by which the two of you can reach some agreements to keep you in YOUR child's life as that is in the baby's best interest, even if the church doesn't see it that way. Kids need both parents and many couples on these boards where one partner is in and one is out, have reached a compromise so they can coparent effectively.

31

Children still traumatized one year after viewing exposed breast on TV

by IronGland in

jw
friends

washington, dc?as the nation approaches the one-year anniversary of the super bowl xxxviii tragedy, an fcc study shows that millions of u.s. children were severely traumatized by the exposure to a partially nude female breast during the feb. 1, 2004 halftime show.. .

"no one who lived through that day is likely to forget the horror," said noted child therapist dr. eli wasserbaum.

""but it was especially hard on the children.".

beebee

Man...I'm glad I read the whole thing. At first I thought he was a serious idiot! I was sitting here wondering "what is wrong with my children that they think nothing, except humor, over the naked JJ boobie fiasco?" I thought I might be failing as a parent!

Now I realize it was just plain funny! Where'd you find it?

8

The Aftermath - Relationships After JW Life

by wanderlustguy in

jw
friends

i have a significant other now...she was raised babtist and is very strong in her beleifs.

one of the difficult parts is that very subject, since i have no need to be "saved", and can very handily offer an abundance of reasoning as to why i could never trust a "preacher" to help me learn how to live.

ironically though, it is because of her i have started looking futher into what i beleive, basically looking into everything to determine what is true and what is fiction.

beebee

I hate to say it, but at best she sounds like incredibly insecure (she should be enough association for me), most likely she's a control freak (is this true in other areas of her life) and at worst it may be the beginning of an abusive relationship. How long have you been together?

Dr. Phil's website has a questionnaire on it for determining if you are with someone who has the potential to be an abusive partner. Abusers typically must control all aspects of their partner's lives. It's almost always "my way or the highway." They start by being critical of everything and usually work very hard to cut you off from everyone else in your life that matters. (yeah..seems cults do the same thing). Once your life completely centers around them, you are a lot less likely to leave and more likely to put up with whatever they deliver. Abuse isn't always physical, but even physically abusive partners rarely start out that way, it begins with gentle psychological methods of control, then escalates to emotional abuse and so on.

When I found that questionnaire, I emailed it to my daughters but the interesting thing was that one of them found the same article BEFORE realizing I had read it and sent it to her. Her comment "gee sounds like Dad." I divorced their dad 16 years ago because he was abusive (rarely physical).

The religion gives her a "reason" to be in the right, but the key issue here is that she NEEDS to be right and you are wrong to oppose her (her point of view). I can see on these boards where many a controlling and abusive person uses the religion as an excuse for bad behavior. Bad behavior is what it is and there is no acceptable excuse.

You may want to step back a bit and take a closer look at your entire relationship and then decide if religion is the only problem, or just the tip of an ugly iceberg.

ps...you should not have to give up your other friendships and associations to be in a rewarding relationship. In fact if you do, you will be a lot less interesting person and sometimes that's what it takes for them to leave YOU. Stay active, stay interesting. A partner should ADD to your life, not diminish it. Perhaps if you assure her how you feel, and that she adds an important piece you need, but that you still need other people and your own life, she will understand. It isn't a shortcoming on her part at all, it's just a human need.

33

The continuing saga of being in love with a Witness

by starcrossedpimp in

i don't know how many read my prior post "problems with jw girlfriend and her family", but i feel the need to continue the story as it is very current and is taking quite a toll on both of us.

she and i also work together at a grocery store, so even if she does/did decide to break things off (because of her parents and the religion) we would still see each other (i'll get to this in a minute).

we both know that we still love each other and that we deserve to be together, but can this religion be stronger than true love?????

beebee

If they are leaving bruises on her, it is SHE who can call the police. That's domestic violence and her parents could be arrested and punished. As to getting you into trouble, dating someone under 18 isn't a crime, having actual intercourse might be. I say "might" because the age of consent varies from state to state and in many 17 isn't a crime. They would also have to prove it.

Also they have NO power to take away your child from you. They can report you to CPS, and that can mean a lot of aggravation and trouble, but there is still the burden of proof that you are a danger to your child. Even a crime conviction doesn't prove you are an unfit parent. Think - OJ Simpson didn't lose his kids (though he was not convicted in criminal court, enough evidence existed to prove his guilt in civil court). That's because while he had been proven dangerous to his ex-wife, there was no evidence his kids were at risk. It's a bit twisted, but true! The public systems are overloaded and they don't want to take children away from parents. Don't let them intimidate you.

Now onto your relationship. Love isn't rational and when we feel it, letting go feels like it isn't possible. However, when it comes to making a long term relationship or marriage work, you DO NEED to be rational. Incompatibility on any significant issue IS a problem that usually doesn't go away. Incompatibility can be something that seems surmountable - like one of you wanting kids and the other not, to what you are incurring now - parents who will do anything they can to keep you apart.

Anyway you look at it, you are looking at nearly impossible odds of success. IMHO, you should let her go and begin to move on. She is legally an adult and has a job too. If she REALLY wants to leave her religion and family, and if she is mature enough to do so, she will and then she will come to you. If she isn't ready to do either, you have your answer, because if she doesn't or isn't, your relationship is not only doomed but likely to continue to inflict the horrendous pain it is causing both of you now.

So you have to choose - bite the bullet now and let her go, or drag it out and make it hurt more.

You do have to think about self-prservation here, you cannot begin to compromise who you are (remember she loves you as you are and this is what you want, not as you maybe could be (a dub)). You have to think about your child too. If you choose to masquerade as a dub to win the girl, you are also choosing a very restrictive life for your child. You may want to talk to parents and see if this is a course you would find acceptable, but given the way your girl's parents are treating her, do you want that kind of life for your child???

It may actually boil down to that - what MIGHT be best for your girl and possibly you, or what might be best for your child.

39

Hi -I'm Jewish

by moshe in

jw
friends

i'm an ex-jw - i converted to judaism .

i just wondered if any ex-jw's like me are now jewish or have questions about judaism.. shalom,.

moshe

beebee

Dansk, Observant Jews neither say the formal name of "God" nor write it unless it is in prayer. When teaching prayers in Hebrew, we say "adoshem" instead of "adonai" for the same reason (yes I typed it this time for the purposes of explanation). I could type "Jehovah" but then...well heck...I don't have to! :)

39

Hi -I'm Jewish

by moshe in

jw
friends

i'm an ex-jw - i converted to judaism .

i just wondered if any ex-jw's like me are now jewish or have questions about judaism.. shalom,.

moshe

beebee

Yeah, it's tough to get in, but once in, you can do anything you want and still be Jewish. My mom always said it is important to always remember who you are because Hitler killed many a Jew that didn't claim to be Jewish, and in some cases didn't even know as the Jewish relative was distant.

One difference I told my kids years ago between Judiasm and Christianity (their dads are Christians) was that our religion teaches a love of G-d, not a fear. I have never doubted that love or feared judgement. (At least not judgement by G-d, judgement by my mother..oy..that's another subject!)

However, lest anyone think it's more honest, think again. Dating an ex-jw is like dating a biblical expert. My guy really knows both testaments inside and out. One night when we were talking about something I had heard on TV - the statement by a Jewish scholar that EVERY religion has had blood shed in its name - I told him that didn't make sense; when had the Jews shed blood? He then talked about how the Jews had been ordered "to slay every living thing." Jews typically only cover the first 5 books and an occasional story (like Esther, King David), as extensive as my education was, I really know nothing about the supplementary texts.

So I went to Jewish.com and wrote to the "Ask the Rabbi" column. I asked why these other books were ignored and how come I had never heard the bad things? His answer was very disappointing but went something like (paraphrased) "we want our youth to be excited about being Jewish so we don't tell them the bad things..." I prefer honesty myself. Doesn't change who I am or what I believe, except that now I have no faith in ANY organized religion. My relationship with G-d is personal....

Anyone else reach the same conclusion????

(why do I have such an impossible time getting paragraph spacing to show????

39

Hi -I'm Jewish

by moshe in

jw
friends

i'm an ex-jw - i converted to judaism .

i just wondered if any ex-jw's like me are now jewish or have questions about judaism.. shalom,.

moshe

beebee

Conversion isn't easy nor could that decision have been for you. I am Jewish and was raised in a conservative family and have a very extensive Jewish education. I'm here because it helped explain so much of what has gone on, and what is going on still, in my apostate lover's life and head. The two of us no longer think any "organized" religion is "right," but rather all are created by men, and were originally created because the religious leaders were the political leaders too. Way back into the beginning of time when humans were tribal, someone ran the group and dictated the rules. Clearly there was a need.

Now things are different. We have a secular goverment (that is way too far into our business as it is), and religion fills many other needs, among them social and moral guidelines. Those may be well and needed by the masses, however as long as the leaders of any "church" need to maintain their positions of control (a man-made need...not G-d given), we'll steer clear of all of them.

My children are being raised as Jews, though their education in that area has been spotty and more cultural than religious. We still talk about the meanings and reasons for things.

Do you have children and if so, where do they stand on this? Are you able to have a relationship with them if they are adults? And your parents? Have you lost everyone in the process of converting?

52

Slow to help....Quick to punish!

by FreedomFrog in

jw
friends

ok...thought this was interesting.. mom called this morning practically begging me to go to the jc meeting that's coming up this weekend.

i explained that i had asked 6 different elders to get a study started with me within a span of 4 years because i was "feeling weak".

each time i asked for a study i would say "i need help because i'm losing faith".

beebee

Question from another outside (please don't slap me... ) :) Could you get the people you asked to help you study in trouble for NOT coming to your call? Could you use some of the quotes other people gave? Seems to me their sin of "allowing you to weaken" to the point where you "gasp" put up Xmas lights is worse than the lights themselves. Kind of like the grownup who gets busted for buying cigarrettes for the kid down the street???? Oh yeah, that's logical. Seems to me from what little I know logic rarely plays into anything... :(

74

Jehovah Hates Foreskins!!!!!!!!!

by gumby in

moses is preparing his "make my brother do it " speech to jehovah cuz he's ascard to have to talk to pharoah about lettin his people go from eygpt.

the lord butts in and goes bi-polor on moses ass and tells him he's gonna kill his sorry arse cuz moses kids dinger still looks like an anteater and the lord wants then damn thing snipped off pronto or he's gonna kill em!

4:24 and it came to pass by the way in the inn, that the lord met him, [ moses ]and sought to kill him.

beebee

My son had a "bris" (the Hebrew word for the ceremonial circumsicion ritual) and nobody sucked his winker nor did they do anything other than pat it with a little gauze. It's quite an ordeal if you haven't been to one. The men all look on while holding themselves and looking squeamish and the women look away. My six-year old daughter expressed the best sentiment though, "Why are they cutting some of it off when it's so small as it is?"