Posts by Athanasius

79

The really cool feeling of community within JWs

by Phaedra in

i remember going out with other jws after the memorial.. small gatherings.. picnics at some local landmark.. the feeling of closeness, camaraderie, friendship with like minded people you could trust.. haven't experienced it since i left.. really miss that..

Athanasius

I take it that you meant "more secular state" rather than "atheistic state," DJS.

The People's Republic of North Korea is an atheistic state, but I wouldn't want to live there and doubt that you would.

19

"Freeness of speech"

by Wonderment in

this was posted on another thread (http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6040010839031808/christmas-tree-word-appreciation), but wondered about how others here would see this with one experience i had as an elder now as ex-jws.. when we were jw's we had to be extremely careful with what we said around the brotherhood.

if someone said anything out of the ordinary, relationships among the involved were halted immediately, or were never the same afterwards.

in this place, one can say almost anything without the fear of having a truck run over us.

Athanasius

Hi Wonderment,

I resigned as an elder and faded in 1984, so I don't know how they handle the public talks these days. But in the 1970s and until I resigned, I used a number of different Bible Translations in my talks, even though the NWT was supposed to be used. as I hated using the NWT. I also quoted ancient Christian sources, Josephus, and modern secular historians during the talks.

Surprisingly the elders in the different congregations I visited, never counseled me, nor was I eliminated as a traveling speaker. In fact the rank and file JWs gave me lots of compliments. But things have obviously changed since then.

14

Kingdom Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses Closing & Sale in Boonville, MO

by Brokeback Watchtower in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydbkxynecic

Athanasius

It's a surprise to hear that the GB is selling the Boonville KH. Back in 02 and 03 when I was doing research on Joe Rutherford I visited this congregation several times. The local JWs were very friendly and helpful. I didn't tell them that I'd left the JWs in 1984, so they thought I was just another worldly writer.

Anyway there was this elderly JW lady who told me where Rutherford's house was located, his legal office, and other interesting items. Yes, Rutherford's house and law office are still there. This lady's daughter-in-law gave me some leads as to the academy that Rutherford attended after graduating from High School.

Since this was Rutherford's old congregation, and he was the founder of the JWs, one would think that his religious heirs would keep this KH, even if it was justfor the historical and sentimental value.

12

Prediction: jw.org sign up with monthly subscription fee

by bohm in

jw
friends

the wtbs is changing media from print to online.

if we look at other companies doing the same the obvious buissness model is subscription with a monthly fee people can choose themselves.

the wtbs can continue to offer everything for free, however subscribers might earn a button for social media or somesuch ("wtbs donor").

Athanasius

Hi Jeff,

For 25 years I was the controller of a California corporation that owned a chain of bookstores. Every month I had to fill out the State sales tax report and pay California the sales tax due. The report called for total gross sales plus a breakout of the types of sales (Taxable, and non-taxable), location of sales, etc.

The Watchtower likes to keep it's financial data secret. But if they were required to pay sales taxes, they would have to report their book and magazine sales to the different States, provinces, and localities. There would be a public record of that Watchtower was making money off the sale of their publications, something the JW leaders don't want the public or the membership to know.

You are right that the Watchtower would have been wiser to have kept the fixed price for their publications and paid the sales tax like any legitimate business. Something the Watchtower is not. So to keep their financials a secret they bit the bullet and lost money.

I should mention that the prices the Watchtower was charging the JWs for their books and magazines prior to 1990, was what a for-profit printer that used union labor, would charge a secular book publisher for similar items. Plus the Watchtower had a captive audience for their publications. A secular publisher takes a risk with publishing a book. Not all books published become best sellers and many lose money.

50

WT claims to have completed "Peak Construction Phase of New World Headquarters"

by wifibandit in

https://web.archive.org/web/20151210004420/http://www.jw.org/en/news/releases/by-region/united-states/jw-headquarters-peak-construction/.

http://imgur.com/a/dbsqt.

are they just moving the goal posts now that 2016 is almost upon us?.

Athanasius

The Watchtower only benefits itself. Other corporations and religions would hire local workers to build their project and help reduce unemployment. Watchtower brings in their slaves who work for free and pay their own transportation costs. The Watchtower doesn't even pay taxes for the services they use, taking much and contributing nothing to the local economy.

13

Wilmington Delaware Media report in another Topic

by truthlover in

sexual abuse by a female member of a 14 year old in the congregation and elders being sued by the county --- now that co's are liable for the elders only - does that mean the elders will lose everything if fines are levelled against them, since the society has washed their hands and separated themselves by setting the co in place??

.

Athanasius

Hi Simon Templar (The Saint)

I don't think the Watchtower is completely off the hook because the elders are no longer appointed by the Branch. The COs are still appointed by the Org., and elders aren't appointed without the CO's approval. So there's still a direct link from the congregation to the Org. should the elders engage in illegal activity.

If the COs were appointed by the circuit they served and the Org. wasn't involved in the selection, then it could be argued the the link was broken. But to do that the Org. would lose control, something they would only do if it meant their survival.

16

It's OK to be an Apostate ... but only if you're on the Governing Body

by Simon in

look at the governing body.

none of them believe now what the wts believed back when they were born and later baptized.. so why aren't they disfellowshipped for apostasy?.

simple - because the true beliefs are always taken to mean whatever they currently consider them to be.. think about it - they can never be apostates because whatever they decide to believe becomes "the truth" and anyone not believing it is then guilty of apostasy, even if they believe things the wts has taught them all their lives.. if you do believe in the bible and jesus story, do you think this is what he intended?

Athanasius

As the membership of the JW Governing Body changes, so does the "truth."

16

It's OK to be an Apostate ... but only if you're on the Governing Body

by Simon in

look at the governing body.

none of them believe now what the wts believed back when they were born and later baptized.. so why aren't they disfellowshipped for apostasy?.

simple - because the true beliefs are always taken to mean whatever they currently consider them to be.. think about it - they can never be apostates because whatever they decide to believe becomes "the truth" and anyone not believing it is then guilty of apostasy, even if they believe things the wts has taught them all their lives.. if you do believe in the bible and jesus story, do you think this is what he intended?

Athanasius

10

Any thought on Business Territory

by Sabin in

i was working one day, had a couple of male customers to serve when this lady walks in & offers me a track on her religion, my answer without thinking " i already know what the bible say's, i'm one of jw's".

she just threw me a dirty look & the two guy's just looked down & said nothing.

i just carried on, served them as nothing had happened.

Athanasius

Don't know how the JWs approach business territory these days, but back in the 1970s we would ask to see the owner or the manager of the business first. We'd explain our reason for calling and if he or she had an objection to us talking with the employees. If they weren't interested and objected to us talking to their employees, we'd leave and go on the the next establishment.

We placed a lot of magazines in business territory.

59

$1.2 billion coming, still 12 properties to go

by the girl next door in

but still, they ask for more at every opportunity.

send in that ice cream money kids!.

http://www.brooklyneagle.com/articles/2015/12/4/sales-watchtower-headquarters-and-two-other-jehovah%e2%80%99s-witnesses-properties-could.

Athanasius

Since the Watchtower corporation refuses to make their financial records public, it's impossible to know where they stand financially.

I'd love to see their Balance Sheet. This is more valuable in determining a corporation's financial status than their Profit and Loss statement.

Until some Bethel insider defects with the Watchtower's financial records, we can only guess at what is happening inside the Watchtower Vatican.

However, something to keep in mind about the Watchtower, is that it has always had a captive audience for its products. Watchtower prints 8 million copies of a book or Bible and they know that most will be sold. Of course things worked better for them when they could set a fixed contribution price. That way they always made a profit on each sale. Maybe this income source is drying up. After the fixed price for Watchtower literature was dropped, maybe the JWs are donating less for the literature or not at all.

Regarding the $12,000 or more per day for use of Assembly Halls, are they really able to squeeze the JWs for the full amount?