barry

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Posts by barry

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  22

  salvation seekers

  by DIM in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  all jw's care about are their own salvation or everlasting life.

  yoyomama has verified this in the following post:.

  "i love the elders in my congregation and i appreciate their effort to help me through my illness.

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  barry

  I beleive the gospel is like this, Adam sinned and that brought death to the whole human race but was that my fault or your fault? Of course it wasnt. But Jesus paid the price for the sin of the whole world and you or I also had nothing to do with that. The only think we can do is to accept his salvation. This gives us the verdict of not guilty in the last judgement. Good works such as witnessing or anything else are done because we are allready saved not because we are trying to impress God with our works. In fact our best works are like filthy rags as it says in the old testament. Any attempt to save ourselves by our own works are effected by our own selfishness and are an insult to God.

  Good works are however important to the christian not because we want to be saved but because we are allready saved and many could learn from the work the witnesses do in their dedication to the time and effort they put into witnessing but they will never be saved by anything they do it has allready been done.

  lll
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  13

  Holy S*** visit tomorrow from the PO

  by freeman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  if you folks recall, a while back i went ballistic when my boys told me they were going to now shun both their newly dis-fellowshipped friends because that is what the society said is the loving thing to do.

  sick!

  anyway, i informed the father of the two boys, an elder, that my younger unbaptized son (12) will no longer be studying or going to the meetings because i dont want him to participate in or have his young mind twisted by such unscriptural teachings.

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  barry

  Dear Freaman,
  With my limited experiance of debating it is best to take charge and establish what you want to talk about . Youve mentioned two subjects shunning and the UN thing. Dont let the conversation be sidetracked onto other subjects as much asyou may be tempted. Remember Martin Luther who put the 95 thesis on the church door, most Protestants wouldnt know what they are but all know about the doctrine that changed the world 'the just shall live by faith.' The doctrine of righteousness by faith.
  make every punch count
  Barry
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  15

  Halloween!! What do I dooooooooo!!!!!!

  by expatbrit in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ok this will be my first year participating in halloween.

  i grew up a jw, so have never enjoyed it as a kid or as an adult.. so, i need some guidance!.

  what do i do when the little bastards come to the door?.

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  barry

  I dont know mate we dont have that pagon festival here in Australia
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  8

  Interfaith at the Kingdom Hall

  by barry in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  some of you know me now and i just thought you might like to know how i got to know jehovahs witnesses and whats an sda bloke doing on a jw board.

  well it all started in the mid 80s when i got to be friends with a jw bloke who was working bricklaying for my dad invited me to the memorial.

  i said i would go but i felt i would be happier going with someone else that i knew better to go with me there as i didnt quite know what to expect there.

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  barry

  Just to clear up the history, the SDAs started from the teachings of William
  Miller who predicted the second comming of Christ in 1844 from various scriptures the primary one being Daniel 8.14 and using the year day principle for the caculation. When this prophecy failed the date was retained but different doctrine was used to explain it [ sounds like 1914 doesnt it]. Russell picked up on this idea I beleive knowing he had an exit strategy if it was required. And yes there similarities in doctrine a small number of SDAs are Arian [the belief that Jesus is a created being and the holy spirit is a force same as the witness belief], the Historicist system of prophetic interpretation. I think Russell was involved with second Adventists who set a date in 1874 while the SDAs only retain the 1844 date and that is finding less favour because of its unscriptural base.
  Has interfaith helped the SDA communion?
  In regard to scolarly output i would have to say undoughtedly yes. In the 50s Evangelicals Barnhouse and Martin met with SDA scolars and after 100s of hours of research resulted in greater understanding of biblical truth and from these meetings the book Questions on Doctrine was produced. These meetings have produced better understanding but also more agreement on biblical truth regardless of denominational affiliation. In the 80s an Anglican wrote a book 'The Shaking of Adventism' just to name a few. This book was written by him as a friend of Adventism.
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  8

  Interfaith at the Kingdom Hall

  by barry in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  some of you know me now and i just thought you might like to know how i got to know jehovahs witnesses and whats an sda bloke doing on a jw board.

  well it all started in the mid 80s when i got to be friends with a jw bloke who was working bricklaying for my dad invited me to the memorial.

  i said i would go but i felt i would be happier going with someone else that i knew better to go with me there as i didnt quite know what to expect there.

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  barry

  Dont get me wrong Thirdson Ross is an extremely nice bloke most SDA ministers probably wouldnt go and some are the same as the witnessesI think hes in New Zealand now the last I heard.
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  8

  Interfaith at the Kingdom Hall

  by barry in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  some of you know me now and i just thought you might like to know how i got to know jehovahs witnesses and whats an sda bloke doing on a jw board.

  well it all started in the mid 80s when i got to be friends with a jw bloke who was working bricklaying for my dad invited me to the memorial.

  i said i would go but i felt i would be happier going with someone else that i knew better to go with me there as i didnt quite know what to expect there.

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  barry

  Some of you know me now and I just thought you might like to know how I got to know Jehovahs Witnesses and whats an SDA bloke doing on a JW board.
  Well it all started in the mid 80s when I got to be friends with a JW bloke who was working bricklaying for my Dad invited me to the memorial. I said I would go but i felt i would be happier going with someone else that I knew better to go with me there as I didnt quite know what to expect there.
  I asked some friends to accompany me to the meeting with no success so I assked my minister to come along not really expecting a positive response and whenever i saw him over the next week or so he was undecided, I didnt let up on him not really expecting any think positive on his part but just to pressure him in a joking sort of way. Anyway Ross finally decided to come with me to the meeting. We arrived at the meeting together and met up with my bricklayer friend, he seemed a bit reserved toward me and when he got a chance to talk to me privately said, 'Why did you bring him'. Right then I started to feel pretty small and I wondered why he thought that way. Anyway we were there no good backing out now and the meeting was about to start. The sermon was very thorough, lots of scriptures reffered to and the 144000 and great crowd distinguished as having a heavenly and an earthly hope. Also it was made very clear the elements of bread and wine were only for the annointed class of 144,000. You all know the drill. Well I didnt see anyone touch the bread and wine but it was passed around. After the meeting Im still wondering if Ive done the right thing but my anxiety was soon put to rest when the leading elder came over shook our hand. It turned out Ross and the leading Elder knew each other and they both got on famously, and we didnt get away until everyone else had long gone. My bricklaying friend didnt talk to me again about spiritual things and it was quite a few years later when I moved from Tumut to Canberra and studied with the Witnesses.
  Is interfaith the way to increase friendship and understanding between denominations?
  Most SDAs are trinitarian some are Arian there is a group 100 miles from Canberra the Witnesses would find a common belief with that particular group.
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  21

  Reasons why its so hard to break from the WTS

  by Leander in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm still sitting on the fence trying to figure out which direction to go in.

  i think one of the reasons i have'nt left yet is because of the fact that i'm not entirely sure that the wts is really not god's organization.. some of the reasons why i feel that way is because of their insight on the scripture.

  i've never heard of any other religion attempt to decipher the prophecies in the book of daniel and revelations.

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  barry

  Dear leander,
  Just a couple of things I forgot to mention even If you do look at other opinions you have now a picture in your mind of how everything fits together with the witness theology. So for things to register in regard to other interpretations it would take some time.
  Also the main approach with the Witnesses and the Adventist Church with regard to the interpretations of Daniel and Revelation has been what is referred to as the 'Historicist' approach to bible prophecy. this approach has in the past been used other Churches but is losing credibility even in the Adventist communion.
  Weaknesses of Historicism.
  One primary weakness of historicism is that it forgets the prophecies had immediate meaning for the people who first received them. Christians of the first century had a fairly good idea of what John the Revelator was saying. They understood him to be addressing events in their era, not nineteen centuries beyond.
  Secondly , historicism ignores the fact that prophetic symbols are deliberately impressionistic so they have recurring application to similar situations elsewhere in history.
  Thirdly, historicism fails to see that apocalyptic literature [like Daniel and Revelation] does not claim to set forth a detailed blueprint for 2,000 years of history. On the contrary, everything fortold could have been speedily fulfilled to the generation which first read its pages. It explicitly states that the things revealed are soon to pass [Rev.1;1,3.]
  Finally and most important of all-historicists all too often have failed to recognize that all prophecy is a testimony of Jesus and his gospel. The prophetic word is not intended as a minute history written in advance. It is a symbolic portrayal of what Christ has already done and its revelance for the future. Jesus Christ is the centre of the Christian apocalyptic. Even the future events to overtake the church are seen through the spectrum of the cross.
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  26

  Cross or Torture Stake?

  by suprashy in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  hi folks!.

  do we have any non-biblical evidence that would show how criminals were executed during jesus' day?

  i beleive the cross was used for our saviour.

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  barry

  I had a copy of the blue aid book, I dont have it now but this book leaves the answer to this question open and lists the options cross, x shaped cross and of course a stake. it is not dogmatic about the exact form of the item.
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  21

  Reasons why its so hard to break from the WTS

  by Leander in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm still sitting on the fence trying to figure out which direction to go in.

  i think one of the reasons i have'nt left yet is because of the fact that i'm not entirely sure that the wts is really not god's organization.. some of the reasons why i feel that way is because of their insight on the scripture.

  i've never heard of any other religion attempt to decipher the prophecies in the book of daniel and revelations.

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  barry

  Gday Leander,
  Other religions do have good interpretions on The beast,views on Daniel and Revelation but the two clases in revelation being two groups of christians is a distinctive wittness doctrine. As Ive said before the witnesses have recycled many Adventist beleifs and in turn the Adventists recycled beleifs from the Protestant Reformation it would take study to find out these things for yourself but it is there.
  May God bless you in your decisions , Barry
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  34

  Public Reproof will be made as scheduled.

  by badwillie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i want to let all of you know that we have decided not to contest the elders decision to publicly reprove us tonight.

  after a lot of thought, we feel in the long run that by letting this go ahead it will only make the elders and the organization look guilty, not us.. the elders have basically ordered us not to talk about what our "crime" is with anyone.

  so we have decided that we will tell others what our crime was not, i.e.

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  barry

  And no action was taken against anyone