AlanF - I love the fact that you feel confident enough to feel that I need enlightening. That's the same dogmatic approach that relions use. As for crop circles I'm fairly certain that's a couple of old bloakes at night but then again....
All I'm trying to say is not one of us has the complete monopoly on truth and in our own world view we are right - we all filter the information we get through our own spectacles and that becomes our reality. I have a couple of friends who regularly dismiss anything outside their worldview with words such as b**llocks and cr*p - part of the human condition I suppose - non acceptance of the fact that you might be wrong.
In my worldview God lives, Jesus lives, we didn't go to the moon, evolution describes many observable processes but still has many unanswered questions, stilton is the most disgusting cheese and Sunderland FC are my favourite football team.
I won't insult your worldview by suggesting you should support Sunderland because really they are a bit pants..
Posts by Qcmbr
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109Evidence for evolution, Installment 5: Lake Tanganyika, etc
by seattleniceguy inhey gang!
i apologize for my absence of a few weeks.
i have been very busy with work lately, and i hate to write something that i haven't been able to research properly, so i haven't posted anything in this series for three weeks now.
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Qcmbr
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Jehovah's Witnesses and Born-Again Christians are too much alike its scary
by booker-t inever since i left the jw's i visited a few born-again christian churches and i felt like i was sitting in a kingdom hall of jw's.
because born-agains are more like jw's then they want to admit.
both jw's and ba's think they know everything.
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Qcmbr
As a missionary my comp. and I went into a BA meeting to sit through it (can't remember why now..)but the preacher / teacher saw us come in and sit at the back and then I sat in awe while he changed his whole talk to attack us - it was incredible. I had to give him kudos for being so quick on his feet but the gist of what he said was -
All you need is grace, the gospel is not works or performance of tasks its is purely belief anf faith, the gospel is contained in the new testament and doesn't need any additional scriptures, true christians don't wear badges and travel half way round the world to knock on doors.
Serves us right for being cheeky enough to walk in on his meeting!
Another time we met a pastor who invited us over for 'bible study' so like grinning idiots we said yep - we turned up to find we'd been set up, several hard core brothers with anti-mormon literature ready to rumble.
My experience of christian religions is that they all have a fairly similar outlook (and their own phrases to describe and label people) - at the core of christianity is the idea of being saved so there is no mileage from the pulpit in saying that non-christian churches can get you to heaven. All christian churches have their unsaved, heathen, goats, gentile, unbeliever labels and then there is the investigator, student, padowan and once they actually join they become saints, publishers, anointed, chosen, Israel, disciples, believers and finally when they fall off the other end of the conveyor belt backsliders, apostates, less-actives, inactives, weak, Sith etc... I think that most christian religions are fundamentally the same but it is the application of principles that causes the problems - shunning is an example of a principle out of place (IMHO) but there are plenty of extreme examples throughout christianity and all backed up by scripture. -
109
Evidence for evolution, Installment 5: Lake Tanganyika, etc
by seattleniceguy inhey gang!
i apologize for my absence of a few weeks.
i have been very busy with work lately, and i hate to write something that i haven't been able to research properly, so i haven't posted anything in this series for three weeks now.
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Qcmbr
Actually - I don't believe we've been to the moon, there is strong evidence that the plays of Shakespeare were written by Mr Bacon though I will stand 100 % in my conviction that the holocaust was a real event though of all three scenarios I find it the hardest to understand.
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109
Evidence for evolution, Installment 5: Lake Tanganyika, etc
by seattleniceguy inhey gang!
i apologize for my absence of a few weeks.
i have been very busy with work lately, and i hate to write something that i haven't been able to research properly, so i haven't posted anything in this series for three weeks now.
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Qcmbr
At the end of the day we really don't have many facts at our fingertips - we have lots of evidences for things but still no absolute knowledge.
Things to consider:
Time and space isn't constant - it is a product of where we are and what we are observing and what is observing us and our relationship to the observer.
Events are not cause and effect on the quantum level - heck events even seem to occur followed by the cause.
The universe appears to be made of mainly invisible matter but no one can see it.
No one knows how life started - no one has been able to recreat life. No one has ever seen life spontaneously emerging.
No one knows what gravity actually is (maye the watchtower was right !! JK)
No one acually knows what consciousness is.
There are plenty of good solid ideas about the above, there are plenty of evidences for the theories etc.. but at the end of the day evolutionists are in the same boat ..why?
1/ We have only been studying data for a few years in relation to the process we are trying to explain (we have tiny fragments of the whole picture - I read once that all the fossils ever found would only cover a few hundred square feet)
2/ We can never go back in time to say with any finality what actually happened so even with evidence we are still making a judgment based upon current evidence.
3/ Creationists and anti creationists are pushing a religious agenda - for or against God and evolutionary processes somehow become a proof for or against God - if God exists he never said what process He used and so the creation / anti creation arguement is actually a bit of a daft sideshow (IMHO).
4/ Evolution cannot be proved because we cannot recreate the exact conditions on earth and then start another experiment for several billion years to see the outcome. This is a one shot wonder and we are inside the experiment. -
109
Evidence for evolution, Installment 5: Lake Tanganyika, etc
by seattleniceguy inhey gang!
i apologize for my absence of a few weeks.
i have been very busy with work lately, and i hate to write something that i haven't been able to research properly, so i haven't posted anything in this series for three weeks now.
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Qcmbr
Just because we have a good explanation for a natural process does not make it correct (an xample of this is Newtonian physics)
If there was a creation it is possible that each 'kind' was biologically perfect, without dna flaws or mutation. Living in a perfect world without reproduction (potentially) and potentially very few species. Once the 'fall' occurred death was introduced to all creation (and the partner to death is birth) and the earth was moved out of the presence of God - the perfect DNA began to degrade and we see an increasing diversity of species thereafter with mutations creating increased mutations etc.. In other words the perfect computer code is getting more and more corrupt with every copy - species therefore evolve not to best use an environment but into niches of increasing fragility (ie those fish in a single lake - drain it off and they are gone) That would partially account for man's increasing fragile nature (we generally have to eat and drink sanitised food, there are more genetic problems in humans than in most animal species (can't remember where I read it) - in comparison to apes we are really rather pathetic at surviving without our superior brains.
There might be a lot of truth in the idea that the pre flood ages of man where very long. There is potential that after the fall of Adam the earth was actually moved from God's presence (wouldn't be too hard to remove Adam and some animals) - maybe slingshot from sun to sun hence ice ages and mass extinctions - each time earth was in place - final move (end of the last ice age) Adam was put back with the animals and the 6000 years of the earth's temporal existence began. Now I'm not saying this happened!!!!! Just that macro evolution isn't the only solution and the moment we close the books and say it is is the moment we create evolution as our new God and stop searching for truth. -
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If you could create a new canon - what books/ writings would you include?
by Qcmbr inok so the bible is a work of the early roman church - if you could add any books to a new canon of 'scripture' what would you add - would you take anything out?
my starter for ten: .
i think i'd take out song of soloman.
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Qcmbr
OK so the bible is a work of the early Roman church - If you could add any books to a new canon of 'scripture' what would you add - would you take anything out?
My starter for ten:
I think I'd take out Song of Soloman.
I'd like to see Narnian chronicles in. -
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Points of exit..what is the age when most leave
by Qcmbr ini've just been to a big conference where we discussed retention of members and statistically lds lose most members (in the uk anyway) as follows: .
1/ 14 -18 (largest group) - i think it was 30% .
2/ new converts (next largest) - in the front door and straight out the back.
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Qcmbr
I've just been to a big conference where we discussed retention of members and statistically lds lose most members (in the UK anyway) as follows:
1/ 14 -18 (largest group) - I think it was 30%
2/ New converts (next largest) - In the front door and straight out the back.
3/ Mature adults (normally offended or burnt out)
Is this similar to the JWs? -
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Stop being so annoying !!
by vitty init doesnt happen here so much but on other forums some have really annoying attachments.
why do you need to put a really stupid saying or comment after every post or (picture).
i find it really cringworthy and i get sick of trying to dicipher where the message ends and the inane comment start.
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Qcmbr
is
'Yes I am grumpy'
yours?
Just kidding
(Fridge Pickers Wear Bigger Knickers) -
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Do Jehovah's Witnesses Have The Reputation THEY Think They Have?
by minimus inwitnesses believe they are special.
the publications give many examples of how wonderful a witness was viewed upon by a "worldly" person.
kms tell of how so many praise the witnesses for being so "different".....what would you say is the real way people view jws??
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Qcmbr
The rep JWs have to me as a non-jw is based on many door to door battles:
1/ Liked their zeal and dedication to spreading the word. Hated the fact that the only word they seemed to spread was doom and gloom and please come and help us tell more people about doom and gloom.
2/ Disliked the inability to argue intelligently (yea I know I'm a biased twit) because they seemed so drilled that they couldn't see any other side to that viewpoint. As a missionary I felt I wasn't there to squish other's beliefs but to first of all understand their worldview ie everyone is right through their own spectacles and teaching is as much about understanding as it is about replacing ideas with new ones.
3/ But the thing I hated most about JWs...None of them wanted to go to heaven - every single one I talked to wanted to live here on earth with that lion and the beach ball. I wanted to shake them up and say - why don't you aspire to anything more - have you lost even that hope.
4/ I thought their women were really cute but really scary and clever.
5/ I admired the stand they took on silly issues like christmas and assemblies because they took the stand - I like ppl with balls - even when they are fighting a lost cause(IMHO) - kinda heroic. -
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Meek Shall Inherit the earth
by golden age in.
i was talking to a witness the other day and i was explaining from revelation how there is only one calling to heaven and there is not an earthly calling.
and the jw asked me to explain the verse from pslam which states teh meek shall inherit the earth and reside in it forever, any one have any scripture to refute his argument.
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Qcmbr
Honesty - sorry what do you mean by transcendence?