I'll trade your respectful exchanges ( read zero progress IMO ) for more fact based exchanges. If believers would bring more substance to the debates we'd all have much more progress and real change.
Posts by Qcmbr
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239The Great Debate: "Has Science Refuted Religion?
by dark angle injust want to share this amazing debate!
caltech cosmologist and physicist sean carroll teams up with skeptic magazine publisher and science historian michael shermer in this epic debate with noted conservative author and king's college president dinesh d'souza and mit physicist ian hutchinson as they go head-to-head over one of the most controversial issues of our age.
as science pushes deeper into territory once the province of religion, with questions such as why there is something rather than nothing?, where did the universe come from?, how did life arise?, what was the origin of morality?, and others, inevitable conflicts arise over the best approach to answer them.
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57
Love of video games = love of violence? August 2012 Awake!
by sd-7 inpage 4-5:.
"video games: 'the uncomfortable fact is, videogames have an unhealthy obsession with bloodshed,' stated a british magazine for video-game enthusiasts.
it added: 'to some degree, a love of videogames demands a love of violence.
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Qcmbr
Wow I'm glad that the WT pointed this out. Ever since I've taken to secretly killing zombies I have become ultra violent. After I've eviscerated the commons and used headshots on the specials I feel unfulfilled and yearn for more action. While out in the supermarket i find myself mentally checking out where the exits are ,the best defensive points (delicatessen and fish counter ) and constantly evaluating the offensive capabilities of products on the shelves. The satanic influence of game playing has left me with an incredible urge to survive the apocalypse so I can run between safe rooms with the chosen ones killing all who stand in my way. I need help. I need a good peaceful book or something that doesn't focus on brutal murder and corruption of the flesh.
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41
Quake reveals day of Jesus' crucifixion
by Vidqun inhttp://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/47555983/ns/technology_and_science-science/.
"when data about the jewish calendar and astronomical calculations are factored in, a handful of possible dates result, with friday, april 3, 33, being the best match, according to the researchers.
".
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Qcmbr
No it doesn't
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251
Evidence for God...
by tec inlife come from the living, and this is a universe of life.
his teachings are truth.
which is why i weight it against the truth of the teachings (and one other thing that i will get to).
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Qcmbr
As a former xian I can happily say that all the evidences I used and accepted for God from subjective experiences with bliss and demon attacks through to practical expressions of love and community within the Mormon faith are , once observed from without the bounds of faith , not evidences at all, not even close. It is not the quality or lack of evidence that is the problem it is faith itself that is the crack whore wrecking peoples' ability to discern fact from fiction. Once you confront the problem of faith ( which is that it is a circular dependency, faith needs faith to make it work) then you have the key to examining and ultimately rejecting foolish or misunderstood memes.
Demon attacks become sleep paralysis or symptoms of brain stress, intuitive morality is discovered to no longer be rooted in an external book or entity and ultimately a reliance on invisible beings is replaced by self determination and ego maturity.
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251
Evidence for God...
by tec inlife come from the living, and this is a universe of life.
his teachings are truth.
which is why i weight it against the truth of the teachings (and one other thing that i will get to).
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Qcmbr
tec - of all the religibods here you make me saddest. There are plenty who are riled up in prophetic ire and type faster than their ability to reject facts, I laugh at the blindness of their zeal. There are posters who are likely to have been ill or socially restricted who have written their delusions as battered paragraphs dripping need and cries for help, they make me realise my own helplessness in truly helping another; but you seem balanced, unencumbered by pills, pub or past and yet you stand pretty naked in defense of something (I have no concrete idea of that which you defend!) No matter what logic, facts, criticism or argument comes your way you just bend out of the way and pop back up having changed nothing.
And this is why you make me feel sad. I don't get the feeling that you know how/want to be anything different. Your style of defending your beliefs robs you of any tools with which to examine your own worldview. Like a silken prison ten times stronger than steel and impossible to shatter you have become adept at simply identifying anything that you feel is good as 'Christ' and everything else as either Satan or at least 'not Christ.' This approach is a strength in defense (it allows infinite sidestepping) but also means you have no strength of argument with which to persuade another. I have yet to be able to say what you believe in (you frequently bookend your comments with references to Christ though why there is a causual or evidential link you never say; this is of less defined meaning than saying that a car is the taoist uncarved block given form.)imo.
While I would love you to one day post that you are doubting and have begun to approach the world revealed by reason and fact I get the impression you will never be able to change. Having perfected your ability to avoid a faith crisis you never need to make a fact v myth choice. You have become theologically unaccountable to yourself. How can you ever know if you are wrong if you are unable to define what being wrong would look like?
I had hoped you'd some actual proof when you started this thread, something that would be modern scripture (apparently biblegod persuaded people almost exclusively by evidence) but as usual its 98% subjective experience and 2% unrelated logic. I totally get the whole personal relationship with god. It just isn't proof. :(
Dang I feel sh*t writing this. Sorry. I'm going to post it anyway even though it sounds arrogant. I'm not the best at getting across intent. I hope your comprehension skills are better than the clarity of my written thought.
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Qcmbr
Context required:
I would happily lie to preserve life and would not even blink before prostrating myself in front of a religious nutters idol as long as he/she held the knife.
If my death would in some way be meaningful and would advance the cause of human freedom and enlightenment , especially that of my family, I may well, reluctantly, put my head on the block.
If I was in a war that threatened to send us back into a theocracy or extreme political situation like Stalinism I would fight knowing that I had a high chance of dying or getting injured.
Those sorts of extremes aside - no way. 5 year old me believed in different things to 20 year old me. It would have been crazy to sacrifice 20 year old me for 5 year old beliefs.
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251
Evidence for God...
by tec inlife come from the living, and this is a universe of life.
his teachings are truth.
which is why i weight it against the truth of the teachings (and one other thing that i will get to).
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Qcmbr
Tec - inevitable questions -
- what is your boundary for life? For example is a virus life? Is a single cell life or must it be in concert with other cells before it gains that status (i.e. a body)?
- How do you feel about the concept that the human body is made up of many different lives without which we would cease to be able to function (bacteria digesting food in your gut for you) - in fact while there are roughly 10 trillion human cells in your body you are carrying 100 trillion microbial cells along for the ride, in other words you are 'legion'?
- Why do you suggest that a plank of your life argument is that life doesn't come from nothing? This is pretty much a given on both sides of the debate. Rather it is the bible that suggests that dirt was the foundation of life which odly enough may well be the closest that science ever gets to agreeing with the bible 'facts'.
- What do you mean Jesus' statements are true? I can see several that aren't open to the dichotomy of true or false but must be contextualised( render unto ceaser for example - sometimes you have to rebel against a tyrant). I can also see several that are false (All things you ask in prayer , believing, you will receive). There are even some statements that are simply dangerous (turn the other cheek - not a valid instruction in most cases.)
- Jesus didn't speak on several critical issues (slavery, homosexuality, women's rights etc.) How do you know what he feels about those topics?
I used to think that the Spirit told me things as well and could point to several times when I received promptings and scriptures etc. My ability to generate thoughts and then ascribing those to an external entity was a simple skill I learnt early on at the prompting of my mother. Realising that I wasn't receiving one to one communication was a big step in exiting faith.
Thanks for the effort though - always helps to explian ones motivations.
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Qcmbr
I feel pretty crap about this. She crossed the line and maybe we'll never know why she posted as she did, sometimes she made sense but generally I didn't understand most of what she posted, it was pretty random at times. I honestly thought it was a language barrier type thing. I hate to see someone get kicked though, kinda feels like we failed as a board to help someone in genuine need. As already stated we aren't equipped to help much beyond information and shared experiences, we aren't a hospital.
All the best NDrew, I hope you find what you are looking for and a forum somewhere for your wibble and words.
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267
The true, unsung hero of the Bible....
by Unlearn inmy undisputed hero of the bible is known by several names, depending on who you talk to...devil, satan, lucifer, etc.. read it, and you'll find that he was the only one who really stood up for you.. he asserted that you could make decisions for yourself...and told you the very real truth that, just because the piece of meat in your chest stops thumping, you positively do not 'die'.. he was your hero.
he stood up to a daddy-maniac and said, 'just because you made us doesnt mean you have the right to tell us what to do.
i thought we were free?'.
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Qcmbr
Thomas - founder of the scientific method: "What happens if I stick my finger in it"
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267
The true, unsung hero of the Bible....
by Unlearn inmy undisputed hero of the bible is known by several names, depending on who you talk to...devil, satan, lucifer, etc.. read it, and you'll find that he was the only one who really stood up for you.. he asserted that you could make decisions for yourself...and told you the very real truth that, just because the piece of meat in your chest stops thumping, you positively do not 'die'.. he was your hero.
he stood up to a daddy-maniac and said, 'just because you made us doesnt mean you have the right to tell us what to do.
i thought we were free?'.
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Qcmbr
My favourite was always Thomas. No matter how many miracles he saw he still needed to check it out and get the evidence for himself. Of all the apostles I'd trust his word over everyone else's.