Posts by Qcmbr

699

A truce between Atheists and Non-Atheists?

by palmtree67 in

jw
friends

ricky gervais tweeted this 11/14/12 and i totally agree with it:.

"there are good atheists and bad atheists.

there are good believers and bad believers.. no god has ever changed that.".

Qcmbr

So AG - you prove that this is all about personalities. You don't really want to be understood. What you want is to win. I get it and I'm happy with that status quo. Can you see why the following is an example of damned if I do and damned if I don't:

Uh, wait... why are you reading extensively on MY forum, Q?? Especially since you say I'm saying the same things here? Man, I have asked you before, many times, and I'll ask you again: what are you LOOKING for? He isn't ON an Internet forum, luv! I mean, c'mon... you must KNOW this!

And why are you reading incognito? No one cares if you come visit... except maybe you. And now that you repeated that you DO that... why all the hide-and-go-seek? What are YOU afraid of? Your friends seeing you the other forum? Everyone knows you're an atheist, Q. At least, you say you are...

One reason I read your forum because I wanted to see how believers would respond when given no rebuttals. You didnt dissapoint. The 'why are atheists angry ' thread was typical. The same question was asked and fully answered here and was given a great deal of time and thought. In your forum the same wrong preconceptions that were tried and rejected here were agreed on there - you diagnosed without the patient. The weakest one was of course the canard about actually being angry at god - though I was glad that one poster did mention that that was obviously oxymoronic.

The other reason I read your forum is because its a good way to see what motivates people. Certain posters post the same question on both forums and reveal additional details (like motivations) on yours. This helps to see where they are coming from. It also is a good guage as to whether they are understanding answers they are receiving - normally not because the return and report mode normally contains some reference to an imagined or over egged slight and no sign of additional comprehension, information or wisdom.

Another reason I read that forum is because it gives me a chance to watch a religious experience unfolding , much as I find it fascinating to watch the same type experiences on pro LDS or BA xian discussion forums, they are a very powerful study in group think, shared language, the increased definition of a 'them and us' mentality and the way in which supernatural stories are propgated and nurtered in the confines of no dissent. What I find fascinating in your forum is how much of it is simply a vehicle for worship of you. You set it up. You post the most (of the most last 50 active posts you've had the last word on 27 of them) and you get your ego stroked all the time. You say/reveal anything you want and you have a core of people venerating it as the words of JHat. You are so far out of the xian canon its amazing and yet you've managed to carry them ! You've created a new language replacing Jesus and God of the bible with two new entities and angels with gargolyle looking creatures:

JAHESHUA, the Chosen One of JAH (MischaJah).

... the only thing I can use to describe them that comes close... are gargoyles.

you have started blessing your forum members:

So, again, thank you... and may the undeserved kindness and mercy of MY God and Father, the MOST Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies... and the love and peace of HIS Son and Christ, my Lord, the HOLY One of Israel and Holy Spirit... JAHESHUA, the Chosen One of JAH (MischaJah)... be upon you ALL... you and your entire households... to time indefinite.

you see yourself as a divinely appointed teacher passing on revelations:

So as the pattern has been shown and set by our Lord and master, I only hope that I can show a fraction of a mustard seed of that to others.

... and ALL that That One has told me, tells me yet, has shown me and will show me yet...

you are instructing like an Elder:

Let your light shine, my sister. Don't hide it under a basket. Just remember to keep love in the front. Don't let anger overtake you: be wrathful, yet do not sin.

you are justifying anything you post here (they are using "bad conduct" so I can too):

I have just learned to give them back their medicine, but with the "bitterness" (to their "tastebuds") of truth

you recognise that you have a group working on your behalf:

I know it's not always easy for you to put yourself out there on my behalf, so please know that I absolutely DO appreciate it

you are love bombing and flattering:

I see you... all... and I love you all.

'cause Lord knows, I can NOT keep up with your "deep" brain

I could go on but I hope you see why I find it fascinating how you are manoeuvering within your faith group and how they are being manipulated (my opinion!). Its a fascinating story unfolding. It helps me to see where I went wrong and why I found it so easy to spread the unctuous and 'loving' mormon message so easily and why people fall for it.

I also sometimes find it entertaining :O

699

A truce between Atheists and Non-Atheists?

by palmtree67 in

jw
friends

ricky gervais tweeted this 11/14/12 and i totally agree with it:.

"there are good atheists and bad atheists.

there are good believers and bad believers.. no god has ever changed that.".

Qcmbr

yeah but my wife is in bed and huffing at the noise of my typing :S hehe

699

A truce between Atheists and Non-Atheists?

by palmtree67 in

jw
friends

ricky gervais tweeted this 11/14/12 and i totally agree with it:.

"there are good atheists and bad atheists.

there are good believers and bad believers.. no god has ever changed that.".

Qcmbr

AG - I've heard you out by reading extensively on your own forum. Its not all that much to be honest - you say the same stuff as here and my reading skills are fine. You aren't special. You aren't a new unanswerable force. Your a bunch of devout individuals having a bit of shared bliss and all power to you. Its been done for thousands of years and it will be done in the future. You're a Joseph Smith, a Bhudda, a Thiota , the local street preacher , a Paul etc. I understand that its painful to be contradicted and to be told you could be causing harm. I see the pain in the LDS missionaries eyes as I disabuse them of false ideas and premises and point out the cost of being wrong in wasted hope, faith and behavioural changes.

Anyhow - night all:)

452

Faith... and Trust: The Same Things?

by AGuest in

in a discussion with some other dear ones, the question was asked as to what such ones put their faith in.

in response to one comment that"one can't function without faith," another disagreed, stating ones can, that "many do so every day... the ones who have trust" (in things like the sun rising in the east versus the west).

that trust extended to "faith" based "on nature and the natural order of things.

Qcmbr

tec - I own every word I say, every mistake , every thought and every bit of scrummy awesomness. AG and you don't. You both play a dual role, speaking sometimes authentically sometimes by proxy. AG has posted many times about having a message for an elect group, a special chosen set of people and uses this forum as a free advertising booth for it. I suspect you'd be a bit pee'd if someone decided to use the local park where you walk your dog for a recruitment rally for <select some group> working purely on the assumption that they could use the shared space for their political gain and you should just suck it up and respect it.

699

A truce between Atheists and Non-Atheists?

by palmtree67 in

jw
friends

ricky gervais tweeted this 11/14/12 and i totally agree with it:.

"there are good atheists and bad atheists.

there are good believers and bad believers.. no god has ever changed that.".

Qcmbr

The point tec is that you have formed an emotional bond with someone such that you now accept them as a conduit for supernatural messages. That's what religion is.

61

C...

by AGuest in

peace to you (forgive me if that offends/insults, but i felt wrong not offering it in opening this new thread).

to continue where we left off on the "truce" thread:.

there is no such thing as relative truth - it is not open to subjective feelings.

Qcmbr

If Dawkins ever claimed his knowledge was whispered to him by the supernatural I'd kick him into touch in a moment. Until that time I find his explanations of why , how, where and when based upon objective facts, devoid of religious faith, amenable to correction, open about missing information and above all - useful in my life in a way that leprous JHat and his revelations regarding bones just isn't. Dawkins knowledge is rooted in information used by medical practitioners, food scientists, blood donors and biologists who between them have saved billions of lives. Dragons just aren't quite on the same scale for me and that about sums up all faith based religion to me. Pretty inadequate. Stories about magical transfusions of blood just isn't worth a jot - knowing why certain blood types can't mix and why blood works the way it does - that's awesome.

452

Faith... and Trust: The Same Things?

by AGuest in

in a discussion with some other dear ones, the question was asked as to what such ones put their faith in.

in response to one comment that"one can't function without faith," another disagreed, stating ones can, that "many do so every day... the ones who have trust" (in things like the sun rising in the east versus the west).

that trust extended to "faith" based "on nature and the natural order of things.

Qcmbr

You see them as your supporters no?

699

A truce between Atheists and Non-Atheists?

by palmtree67 in

jw
friends

ricky gervais tweeted this 11/14/12 and i totally agree with it:.

"there are good atheists and bad atheists.

there are good believers and bad believers.. no god has ever changed that.".

Qcmbr

What on earth was that AG?

699

A truce between Atheists and Non-Atheists?

by palmtree67 in

jw
friends

ricky gervais tweeted this 11/14/12 and i totally agree with it:.

"there are good atheists and bad atheists.

there are good believers and bad believers.. no god has ever changed that.".

Qcmbr

Char - this was my absolute fav:

I think you've misunderstood what I "clarified."

I don't think that there is as much of the ridicule or bullying or is as intense as some make out. Yes there have been some pretty nasty ones where it just turned into handbags at dawn but the real issue is still the ideas.

As an atheist I could constantly whine about believers mocking my lack of belief, belittling my experiences, downgrading my every word because it doesn't come with a divine seal of approval like theirs does. I could be bitter about being told I'm not chosen , I'm spiritually disabled (hard of hearing and seeing) or constantly being invalidated as not of the House of JarHat MyHairShirtsOnFire or some such religious order. I could but I don't . The vast majority of the time I , and others, go straight to the logical conclusion of a statement and ask a searching question (e.g. if prayers are answered why aren't everyone's) and we wait for an answer. Sometimes answers have got some merit (they attempt to answer the question rather than restate the belief in another way) but very rarely do searching theological questions arrive at any meat beyond - some stonewall about it being a personal revelation so get over it. The inevitable questions follow regarding what is the point, is there any evidence beyond some supernatural experience (that is almost always explainable by simple biology , psychology and neurology) and a refutation.

This is a standard, open discourse ways of approaching truth. There has to be more than a simple testimony for an idea to have wider application and weight amongst accepted society. That which many seem to describe as bullying is either strident questioning or rejection of an unsupported idea. When it gets personal it's normally in response to something personal stated by the argument proposer (why are atheists angry/ you need to understand/ your exprience isn't as valid as mine etc.) The less belief someone has the more they have to own their words and the less they have to rely on devices such as - 'I'm sharing what <divine proxy> wants me to tell you.'

Don't mistake lack of reverence for your idols as a personal attack. Until you make it so.

699

A truce between Atheists and Non-Atheists?

by palmtree67 in

jw
friends

ricky gervais tweeted this 11/14/12 and i totally agree with it:.

"there are good atheists and bad atheists.

there are good believers and bad believers.. no god has ever changed that.".

Qcmbr

AG - I've told you this before - quote marks are normally used to either reverse meaning or quote. When you say "peace" - since you aren't quoting - you are saying the opposite. Its beautifully ironic.

Tin hat on for the huge riposte.