Posts by borgfree

52

WANTING to Believe in God

by dobby in

jw
friends

has anyone had this experience?.

after letting go of my beliefs as a jw, i felt the only alternative was to be atheist.

or maybe it is just logical to there is no god when i am only listening to my mind and not my heart.

borgfree

Hi QCA1,

So do I, I stole it from Ziggy

Borgfree

52

WANTING to Believe in God

by dobby in

jw
friends

has anyone had this experience?.

after letting go of my beliefs as a jw, i felt the only alternative was to be atheist.

or maybe it is just logical to there is no god when i am only listening to my mind and not my heart.

I think after you have been here a while you will realize that it is not a one sided attack. I do not attack people personally, calling them ignorant, stupid, pea brains, etc. etc. and I do not practice intolerance.

Borgfree

52

WANTING to Believe in God

by dobby in

jw
friends

has anyone had this experience?.

after letting go of my beliefs as a jw, i felt the only alternative was to be atheist.

or maybe it is just logical to there is no god when i am only listening to my mind and not my heart.

borgfree

gsx1138, You said:

You have not been around here very long.

Borgfree

52

WANTING to Believe in God

by dobby in

jw
friends

has anyone had this experience?.

after letting go of my beliefs as a jw, i felt the only alternative was to be atheist.

or maybe it is just logical to there is no god when i am only listening to my mind and not my heart.

borgfree

Hi Dobby,

I have had the discussion before on this forum about God vs no God, I cannot win the discussion, and I haven’t seen anyone who can. There just does not seem to be any way to prove one way or the other. I have a couple of facts I use, for my own evidence, of God. Nothing I have to say is new to anyone here.

I “see” creation, or if you prefer, I see what exists, it is here, and we cannot deny that. To me, evolution just does not do it. Personally, I find evolution almost ridiculous. The argument has been, well if God exists, then where did HE come from; HE had to come from nothing.

I think we can all agree that “something” has always existed, that there was never a time when there was “nothing”. So, that being the case, why is it such a stretch for that something, that has always existed, to be God?

I also believe, (some here will definitely disagree) that Jesus, the Christ, did exist. Jesus showed us the perfect way to live. Humans have not, and cannot, be perfect at this time, but believers “try” to put into practice the teachings of Jesus, sometimes we fail, sometimes miserably.

I started a practice a few years ago, to read the bible all the way through, using the Daily Bread. I have some serious difficulties in what I read. I am being completely honest here. I will use the example of David for an illustration. David is said to be “a man after God’s own heart” David killed people seemingly without mercy. He had a man put to death so he could take that mans wife, he broke the rules repeatedly, but still God continued to show “him” mercy, sometimes punishing other people for the sins of David.

I read the songs, etc. of David where he continually pleads with God to save “him” and to punish, put to death, “his” enemies. I wonder, what kind of man was this? I know for certain, I am glad I did not live under his rule.

That is just one example of something in the bible I have trouble with. Still, I believe in the God of the bible. I believe the bible is the written word of God.

After I left the WT org., I did, accept Jesus into my life and heart, I have definitely seen a change in my own life, in my own attitudes, and have a real desire to be the kind of person that my Lord Jesus was. I don’t think that has ever really been my nature. I fail at times, but inside I have the “feeling” that I have done something wrong, and I need to learn from it, and not do the wrong again.

I guess I see the evidence of God in creation, and, working within me. I do believe in Him. As I said before, there is no way I can explain some of the things in the bible that just do not seem to be right, but, I also know, that if the God of the bible is real, then of course I cannot understand Him fully and no one ever will.

This argument is sometimes used, if the bible is false, then how am I hurt? If I live a good life, as Jesus Christ told us to do, then it will be better for myself and for others as well. But, if the bible is true, and we do not do what it tells us to do, then we are in deep …..trouble.

With or without that argument, I feel that God is working in me, to make me into the “vessel” that He wants me to be. I want that.

Borgfree

53

In 1968 WTower they said -

by mouthy in

jw
friends

i have just finished reading watchtower of aug 15th 1968.

( i was still there then) i couldnt believe what i'm reading & i qoute.

"are we to assume from this study that the battle of armageddon will be over by the autumn of 1975 & the longed looked for thousand year reign of christ will begin by then?

borgfree

Grace,

Some of us “older” ones, like me, grew up reading this @#%^@ our whole lives. We were disappointed over and over as the WT changed teachings. Once an elder told me that everlasting life did not mean life would last forever, it was really “life indefinite”

Some of us remember the big disappointment at Yankee Stadium when they had the BIG buildup in a speech to make us believe the “faithful ones of old” had been resurrected, only to learn they were referring to the overseers for the WT.

THEN, Jehovah’s Witnesses cannot understand why some, like me, have intense hatred for the Watchtower, Bible and Tract Society.

Borgfree

56

A big "thank you" to everyone here

by Simon in

jw
friends

in the past i have sometimes felt like i have to be the 'bad guy', so to speak, because i need to lock or delete topics, deactivate people, try and stop fights and such like - basically, telling people off and not being 'nice'.. well, apart from the odd heated debate and harsh word (and disruptive 'visit') i have not really had a great deal to do for the past month or two and it has been very nice - a pleasure to serve.. so ... i thought i should say a 'thank you' instead of a "stop it!

" for once

borgfree

My thanks too, Simon and Angharad!!

Borgfree

8

Church of Nativity Burns, No Christian Outcry?

by Valis in

jw
friends

well, now that yasser has left, there's fires burning around the church of the nativity.

one question i have is, where is the outcry from all those that believe jesus was born there and it is indeed a holy site?

i would think they would be up in arms...some literally.

borgfree

I can only speak for myself of course, but I view the building as just a building. "God does not dwell in man made temples"

Borgfree

74

I'm thinking of applying for reinstatement

by Cygnus in

jw
friends

ok, here's how it is.. i just finished reading the "dead" thread.

now, listen.

i do not believe in life after death.

borgfree

LoneWolf, You asked:

There are quite a few now in different cities, states, and countries.
The biggest one I know of is in New Ringgold, Pennsylvania about the third week of October. I have never heard an actual count, but I am told there are about 300-400 in attendance.

I am going to one in Pinecrest, California June 14-16. Dan Hall has that one. Last year was his first, and again there was no count given. I would estimate about 100-150 was there. It promises to be larger this year.

The conventions, that I know about, are Christian centered, but, I have met ex-jws at the different conventions with many different beliefs and opinions. The first one I ever attended had an ex-jw who now believes in reincarnation, another was in the Dawnists, and many other beliefs.

I have always observed, that all are welcome, and treated well, no matter what they believe. I will say again, for the benefit of some here, that they are Christian centered. Most there, will be Christian believers.

Borgfree

23

Is life really better out of the org?

by sleepy in

jw
friends

it strikes me that as witnesses most can find many faults with the world and reasons why they want to be no part of it.. things are often exagerated or demonised in the witneses eyes.. does the same thing happen in reverse when you leave the org?.

do we blow things up out of proportion to how they really are?.

are we really that much happier as people than we were in the org?.

borgfree

It also depends on what you believe the future holds and your spiritual beliefs. If you believe that Jesus Christ is the ONLY way, then the JWs are headed for eternal separation from God, whatever that may be.

If however you do not have any belief in God, then if the JWs enjoy their life in a lying organization, then let them enjoy what they want.

Borgfree

74

I'm thinking of applying for reinstatement

by Cygnus in

jw
friends

ok, here's how it is.. i just finished reading the "dead" thread.

now, listen.

i do not believe in life after death.

borgfree

Hi Cygnus,

I will add maybe 1/2 cent if you do not mind. I have become a born again believer, so I have a different outlook about all this, but I am not sure you are interested in that point of view, so I would like to just cover a couple of points.

My relationship with God does not depend on any church or group, it is between my Lord and Savior and me. Churches are for gathering together with other believers to "build one another up" show "love and fine works" etc. I think that is good, but has nothing to do with my salvation. I could gain just as much, maybe more, by going to another believers home with maybe a few others. Wouldn't that actually be a church? That is, especially, if the others were also believers.

My best enjoyment is going to ex-jw conventions. Of course I have a lot in common with the people there.

My thinking about your going back to the organization is this. I think if you have any hopes of your family leaving the WT, going back would be the worse thing you might do. I think you would reinforce their belief that they are right, the organization is the only way, and that you have proven it, by returning.

Borgfree