Posts by rebel8

48

Can it be proven that the WTS is NOT God's personal organization?

by M.J. in

imagine trying to prove to someone that firmly believes in leprechauns that they simply don't exist.

where do you start?

an excellent saying i have heard is "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

rebel8

Unless you have God Himself standing in front of you telling you who is and is not his special people, then you will never be able to prove it. What you can do is challenge the underlying logic and contradictions in those who claim to be the special ones. For example:

IF God=all-good, all-knowing, and all-powerful, and

JWs=God's people, being directed by God Himself, then

there is no explanation for child molestation and other crimes occurring in congregations, people being DFd even though they haven't broken any JW rules, and many other things an all-good, all-knowing, all-powerful God would not allow.

3

Supreme Court confronts abuse by priests: Law shift on clergy abuse?

by Dogpatch in

jw
friends

supreme court confronts abuse by priests: law shift on clergy abuse?.

high court to hear oral arguments

by pat schneider.

rebel8

You may want to post this in the Child Abuse folder.

20

short introduction

by expendable_mia in

jw
friends

i noticed that everytime i did a search for jw info (various topics) this site has always come up.

so after lurking and reading for 6+ months, i've decided to actually sign up and maybe even post from time to time.

i'm mia, stubborn study of a very patient jw girl, wife of an anti-jw man and mother of 2 young children.

rebel8

Hi Mia,

Take a look at this site for some stories about JW experiences. Interesting reading.

http://www.network54.com/Forum/217065

PS-You are right about the JW doctrines changing over time. That occurs in other religions, too, as they are part of changing cultures. The reason JW doctrines changing is problematic is because they have always claimed to be God's one and only true religion, being directed directly from God Himself. They also claim that God's view of time is different than humans--decades in human terms is but a blink of an eye for God. Why would God Himself change doctrines and goals in the blink of an eye? He wouldn't.

61

"I can't stop thinking about Jehovah's Witnesses!"

by logansrun in

jw
friends

i've heard this said by a few ex-witnesses in my three years away from the organization, and have sometimes said it myself.

sometimes it is said in the context of, "i'd like to move on, but i just can't stop thinking about them.

could it not be that one of the reasons ex-jws "can't stop thinking about" the organization -- and their past involvement with it -- is that they daily log onto this site, read about the society and talk about them?

rebel8

My $.02:

I noticed a similar phenomenon when I was a mental health professional and brought many of my patients to AA. (Please no AA members get your feathers in a ruffle; I'm about to say something nice. Just stick with me and you'll see.)

I observed many people going to AA regularly for years and years. I wondered why a person who hasn't had a drop of alcohol for 20+ years would need to go to an AA meeting 2x per week. It appeared to be some sort of desire to cling to a self help group they no longer needed. I listened to what they had to say and thought about it a lot.

I came to the conclusion that it was none of my business or concern. The reason is that they are doing something for themselves that they feel is helpful in staying away from a harmful thing they once succumbed to. This continued affiliation with the self help group is not harmful to them in any way. If they needed and/or wanted to continue to talk to people who went through a similar thing, who cares? Live and let live.

This forum is a self help group to assist members in healing from their past experience and in staying away from the thing that harmed them in the first place. Like AA, it also becomes an opportunity to socialize with people with whom you have something major in common with. While you are right that rehashing past harms may not be helpful, it is not necessary to do so to participate in this forum.

PS-Even during my early healing days, I never felt like I "couldn't stop thinking about JWs". I thought about them as little as possible--less than once a day. It's the screwed up perceptions of everything I was left with by the cult that I had to focus on and change so I could be normal again. Thinking about JWs was not a component of that process. (I think we agree on that point. :))

47

JW work situation

by pratt1 in

jw
friends

i work for a rather large financial institution in nyc.

i run a large profit center and manage over 100 people.

on of my best workers is a dub doing a slow but progressive fade.

rebel8

While that sounds gratifying it would also constitute workplace harassment.

TY adelmaal, that's exactly what I was thinking. Professional boundaries!

47

JW work situation

by pratt1 in

jw
friends

i work for a rather large financial institution in nyc.

i run a large profit center and manage over 100 people.

on of my best workers is a dub doing a slow but progressive fade.

rebel8

I seriously would not mention religion at all. It is not any of your business as a supervisor. Just put your (valid) biases aside and address the inappropriate behavior as it is, outside of religious issues. If the issue is the employee is not responding to work-related issues, then that's what you deal with. She may very well try to defend herself by bringing up her religious beliefs, but just interrrupt the religion talk and focus on the fact that she is failing to meet objective, pre-established performance standards and reiterate what she needs to do to correct this performance issue.

In the meantime, consider writing a policy against gossiping in the workplace. Whether it's done in the work space/on company time or not, it is still destructive and unprofessional.

18

Are Kingdom Halls ever used for AA Meetings?

by TresHappy in

jw
friends

i found this article online and thought it quite interesting.

i always thought kh's were used for kh business only.... the weekend shooting death of harvey county sheriff's deputy kurt ford could lead to murder charges today against a newton man.. several of those who know greg moore said his life began deteriorating several years ago after he stopped attending alcoholics anonymous meetings in the jehovah's witnesses kingdom hall just up the street from his house.. "he drank a lot -- i know that," said doug foulk, who lives in the neighborhood and worked with moore at excel industries in hesston for several years in the 1990s.

"he'd been in trouble with the cops quite a bit.".

rebel8

The other posters are right--that article is probably erroneous. Though anything is possible, it's just not likely that the cong would allow a KH to be used for an AA meeting.

My local group, back when I belonged, was against AA. Alcoholics who were trying to recover were discouraged from accepting any help outside the b0rg. I remember one guy who was court-ordered to attend AA and he was not allowed to have privileges in the cong long after his "wayward" behavior had ended....because he was attending AA, which was a "bad example" to others....it was considered bad because his attendance made it seem as though it was ok to need help outside the b0rg, and ya know, some AA groups say the Lord's Prayer after their meetings (oh, the horror).

What AA provides that the KH/elders do not:

...here's a few more!

*a philosophy based on facts, honesty, and science

*people who are supportive even if you "fall"

36

Papal ceremony fairly ludicrous for Christians?

by Qcmbr in

for anyone who is a catholic stop reading now - i'm about to mini vent.

i don't doubt that the recently departed pope had many redeeming qualities and this post has nowt to do with him as a person.

i cannot get away from the fact that the pomp and ceremony of the catholic church (including the regalia) is so far away from the humble woodcarvers son and his example.

rebel8

I find no scriptural evidence for papal props and pageantry.

Uhhh, I find that logic flawed. JWs believe there is no scriptural evidence for celebrating birthdays, and they say it's not ok to do because of that. You are saying because the Bible doesn't say there should be props, then it is wrong?

Choice for how to celebrate someone's funeral/death rites varies widely from culture to culture, religion to religion, family to family. These are matters of personal taste, not Biblical adherence.

25

I'll bet you thought JWs would be a hardliner on gambling...

by ezekiel3 in

...then you thought wrong.

richard wolf, an elder in the north salt lake congregation of the jehovah's witnesses, enjoys an occasional visit to the strip.. wolf joins other salt lake valley religious leaders in saying it's possible to stay true to one's principles in sin city ?

and be prepared to be vigilant.. "i think they need to protect their spiritual life," said the rev.

rebel8

Am I the only person who realizes a visit to the strip does not require gambling? I don't see in the article where the JW interviewed is admitting to gambling or saying it is ok to gamble.

18

The Pope and JW Urban Legend

by xjw_b12 in

does anyone remember pope john paul i ?

he was elected in 1978, and died 33 days later, leading the way for pope john paul ii.

(now maybe that was a conspiracy)

rebel8

I remember hearing that a few months of Pope John Paul II was selected, that there was a Catholic conference concerning the "sects" in trying to convert Catholics.

From Google:

1978 Apr. 4 Fourth Plenary Meeting of the College of Cardinals on the theme: "The Church facing the threat against human life and the challenge of the sects." http://www.scmo.org/_holy_father/1978-2003.asp?Circa=1988-1998

I wasn?t able to find any more detail on what was discussed at this meeting, other than that sects who speak in tongues are spreading in South America.

My guess: The Pope did have a meeting that discussed sects. The rest is JW fluff--their special brand of superiority complex and persecution complex. They need to be "persecuted" in order to support their claim the Devil is setting them apart due to their status as God's one and only true religion.