Maybee they are going to play national Bingo, the cards are only £1 , and the money goes to a good cause.
londoner
JoinedPosts by londoner
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45
Special meeting March 7
by Samuel Thorsen inmy mother told me today that its going to be held a special meeting in all congregations worldwide at march 7.. .
some new information is going to be released, and its very very secret indeed.
we are not supposed to tell anyone what we heard at this meeting to the ones who have the meeting later the same week.
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So I saw an old JW friend last night at ........the bar???
by Dustin inso i got home from a long day of work yesterday, and decided i was gonna go to the bar and chill out for a little while.
so i'm sitting around talking to some other people i knew, when all of a sudden i see an ex-jw friend walk in.
now he was never great association, but my parents just told me how he was doing so well spiritually in our monthly "why don't you come back to the hall" conversation.
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londoner
Next to the Assembly Hall for my ex circuit is a real big pub ( bar for you forigners, lol ), during the lunch interval you cant get to the counter for elders.
Also visiting a cong in Spain while on holidays there a while back they took a break while on the ministry and all stopped for a beer to cool off , it was hilarious, there was two 16 yr old's sittin drinking beer from a bottle with there mom and dad.
And while on a quick build in Germany they brought trays round to us all with shots of scnapps, drinking is a real big social thing for the JW's in Europe. They'r not to keen on lap dancing bars though, wonder why
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disfellowshipping
by mamas ini was recently disfellowshipped for being in a same sex relationship with a female.
i understand that it is against bible standards but i do not agree with disfellowshipping in that everyone including my family has nothing to do with me.
i am 18 years old.
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londoner
Hi mamas,
unfortunatly ther's no quick fix solution, but, if you continue to show your family how much you love them they are giong to feel the same pain of missing you, and in time things may get better. In the meantime you will find more love here than in any Kingdom Hall. No one here will ever shun you, judge you or critise you for who you love.
Love and kisses from all
XXX
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Disabilities
by mactoph inthis is my first post- i am actually looking for any information that anyone might have on jehovahs witness resources on disability.
i am putting together a directory of links and resources dealing with the topic of disability from different religious organizations and haven't yet come up with anything- .
if someone could point me in the right direction or give me any ideas it would be grealy appreciated.
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londoner
Hi,
I have always noticed when visiting different congregations in the past, and at assemblies, that there are quite a lot of witnesses who are in wheel chairs, I wonder if they would still be witnesses ir they were not disabled, or are they going along because they have been told that one day God will cure all sickness. A sad thought. I really feal for them if that is the case.
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Is there a difference between a "wrong expectation" and a "false prophecy"?
by booker-t inas many of you posters know by now that my mom has been a devout jw for 40 years and just cannot accept the fact that i am no longer a jw and feel that i am being deceived by apostates and will be destroyed at armaggeddon.
well the other day we had another knock down debate about "false prophecies" and the wts.
my mom insist that the wts are not false prophets but merely had many "wrong expectations" the same as other bible writers and disciples of christ.
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londoner
Hi booker,
The main problem you have is not finding evidence to refute what she says, that?s the easy bit; the hard bit is getting her to accept that evidence. For example, if the WT prints an article stating that the Moon is made of green cheese then all JW's will accept it as fact because the article came from the faithful and discreet slave, who are guided by Holy Spirit. Even is you take them to NASA headquarters and show them moon dust and a piece of moon rock they will use that same old argument, " that moon dust was created by Satan to deceive mankind", an argument often used by the org when archaeological discoveries have been made that prove one of there teachings wrong.
The only way you will win the argument with your mom is to get her to prove herself wrong or get her to contradict herself on this point, use there own arguments against them ( the benefits of pioneer training school ), Use the argument that they use against Mormons.
Also start off with a leading question. Ask her. Are all the beliefs of the Society based on what is printed in the Bible or are any of their beliefs based on an opinion or a man made assumption ? You already know what she's going to say, but get her to say it, it's important for your argument later.
When faced with a Mormon, the witnesses argue that Joseph Smith could not have been a Prophet of God; the argument they use is that the Bible, in Deuteronomy chapters 13 and 18, provides two tests for anyone claiming to be a prophet and speak for God. If the person fails either test given by God, then we can know for sure they are a false prophet and we are to reject their teaching.
The first test is in Deut, 13:1-2, their argument against Joseph Smith is that where it states that if a prophet gives a portent and it comes true but then tells you to follow him he is a false prophet.
Now the second test is the cruncher you can use.
It's in the same verse that your mom quoted Deut 18:20-22, their argument against Joseph Smith being a prophet is that in this scripture the God of Israel tells his people how they can keep from being deceived by someone claiming to be a prophet and that is if even one of the prophet?s sayings do not come true he is a false prophet, first part of verse: 22, When the prophet speaks in the name of Jehovah and the word does not occur or come true, that is the word that Jehovah did not speak, ( in other words what he said was made up )
They say Joseph Smith is false because what he said would happen did not occur, ( there are 7 documented events he predicted that did not occur at all or within the time he said they would ) .
The Society has stated events that would occur that have not, and made predictions that didn't come true. What?s the difference ?
Your mom argues that so did Peter but he said, "thus saith the lord" in his error. Ask you mom to show you where it says in the Scriptures that Peter must have said "thus saith the lord" in his error, or are they assuming he said it in error, and remind her of the question you asked earlier, Are all the beliefs of the Society based on what is printed in the Bible or are any of there beliefs based on an opinion or a man made assumption ?
Ask her to tell you which of the following is true. Either Peter was a false prophet, there is a contradiction in the Scripture here as to how you know when a prophet is false, or the society is using Deut 18:22 one way when arguing against the Mormons and another way when applying it to themselves.
It's just one example of how the org twist scriptures different ways to suit the occasion.
You can try, but I fear 40 yrs of programming will prevent her from questioning the org, the only way to find fault with the org is to look for it , an she's not looking, she's defending them.
Keep us informed.
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Was Johnny Carson pro JW?
by HappyDad indoes anyone remember one of his shows from the late 1970's when john denver was on the show?
i never saw the show but heard about it in the jw circle (urban legend??).
it was known that john denver hated jw's and during their bantering, carson asked denver about his asking jw's to leave during his concerts.
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londoner
I was at a John Denver concert in the UK many years ago, he asked all Catholics to stand up, after he got them seated he did the same with Church of England, then the same with a couple of other religions, after he asked all JW's to stand up he announced that the concert would not go on untill they had all left and he then left the stage. The next day it hit the headlines in the press. As an ex witness I'm not in love with them myself but that was disgusting. Not only was he a fanatical born again Christian he was a wanker.
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FreedomFrog's Judicial Committee was today (Not DF'd!)
by AlmostAtheist inhey guys,.
ff had her jc today.
i was all ready with quotes from the "pay attention" book and reasoning to show they should let me sit in on it, but they didn't even object.
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londoner
Now I got a tear in my eye,
Did you read my posting, why I left after 50 jrs a jw
Love you both XXX
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FreedomFrog's Judicial Committee was today (Not DF'd!)
by AlmostAtheist inhey guys,.
ff had her jc today.
i was all ready with quotes from the "pay attention" book and reasoning to show they should let me sit in on it, but they didn't even object.
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londoner
Hi Dave,
I'm glad for both of you, the next few weeks will be tough, hang in there.
If they DF you be carefull that it doesn't strain your relationship with FF, let her see that you are happy in your life and not afraid of the stand you have made, she is going to be nervous about goin to the K H and facing people after the announcement, give her a big hug before she goes to the meeting, EVERY TIME.
The little pats on the back, and the "never mind " , "if ther's anything I can do" that she gets at the K H will soon stop, so you keep giving her a hug just before she goes out the door and her sub-concience will start to make her feel she would rather be at home with you than in a room full of robots playing follow the leader. Don't discourage her from going, she will make that decision herself in time, be patient.
I'm thinging of you, your not alone.
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Why did I leave after 50 yrs a JW
by londoner ini am not posting this to justify my actions, i am doing so for the benifit of any witnesses who are unsure about there feelings toward the "truth".
i was a reguler pioneer for about 8 yrs, back when it was 100 hours a month, befor thet i did a couple of yrs as a vacation pioneer, they later changed the name to auxilery pioneer, and during the following 20 yrs i had a few intermitant spells as an auxilery when i had time to.
during my pioneer years i have given talks at circuit assemblies and had assignments at district assemblies .
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londoner
Hi to all,
I am not posting this to justify my actions, I am doing so for the benifit of any witnesses who are unsure about there feelings toward the "Truth". YOU ARE NOT ALONE
I was a reguler pioneer for about 8 yrs, back when it was 100 hours a month, befor thet I did a couple of yrs as a vacation pioneer, they later changed the name to auxilery pioneer, and during the following 20 yrs I had a few intermitant spells as an auxilery when I had time to. During my pioneer years I have given talks at Circuit assemblies and had assignments at District assemblies
As to why I left, no one reason, I suppose a build up of things that just didn't seem right, some of which I will bring up in time and some that are too personal to air in public.
Almost anything in life you do is good at first but the longer you do something the greater the chance that you will come across an aspect of that thing that you don't like, and thats the same with the organisation. As the years passed my knowledge grew, not only of the scriptures but of how the congregations are run, and even more so the people that are running them.
In every congregation thers always elders that become more dominant than others and strive for leadership, the problems start when you get these dominant elders palling up together, you know the routeen, always round each others houses for meals, wives always pairing up with each other on the ministry. before you know it the elders with the weaker personality are working behind the book counter instead of taking the watchtower study and the dominant elders are slowly getting a tighter grip on the congregation. And of course they have a large influence on who gets appointed and thus ther grip gets even stronger because they can appoint others like minded to themselves, ( ever wonder why certain ones in the cong always seemed to get overlooked ).
Power corrupts, total power corrupts totally.
This sort of thing doesn't happen over night it's a slow process, so if your in the org for anything less than 10 yrs you probably don't notice it so easily.
I was raised as a witness, am now in my early 50's and only realised less than 12 months ago I have to get out.
I feel my life has been wasted, taken from me, yes I am bitter, I still lose sleep over it often, but I am slowly starting to feel a heavy weight has been lifted from my back.I aim to do something usefull with the rest of my days. I am lucky that I have an amazing wife to help me.
PS: I have now moved to another part of London where no one knows me
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Where can I see a copy of the elder's manual? ("Pay Attention To...")
by AlmostAtheist inhey guys, .
i need to see a copy of the elder's manual so i have confirmation that i as the family head can attend my wife's "judicial committee".
i believe that i can, but i want to make sure it's in print somewhere.
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londoner
Hi,
I am assuming that your wife is happy in the truth and wants to continue as part of the congregation.
Firstly, don't get angry with them, they are used to that all the time from people in the ministry, they are trained to deal with that and it will only work against you. Smile pleasantly when you speak to them, talk slightly quiter than you would normally, speak to them as you would if you were asking someone directions or a favour, tell them you want to be there to support your wife and that you respect her beliefs and that you want do what you can to support her efforts in the truth because you know how much it means to her. This will throw them off balance a bit and they may at that point decide it would be a good thing for you to be there, especially if they think they might be encouraging you along in the process.
But you don't really need to show them anything, turn the table on the elders, all you have to do is go with her and tell them to show you where it is stated in scripture that you are not allowed to be present, but don't be agressive about it, according to their own words in the marriage vows you and your wife are one as stated in Ephesians 5:31, weather you are a believer or not does not alter the order of subjection, the wife is in subjection to the husband, the husband is in subjection to the Jesus Christ and Christ is in subjection to Jehovah God, oops, did I leave the elders out, although it states that the congregation is subject to Christ this is refering to the fact that the congregation is answerable to Christ, it does not mean the elders can jump in between the wife and husband in the order of subjection.
If it is a matter that could involve being disfellowshipped bear this in mind, they can not disfellowship anyone as a form of punnishment no matter what anyone does, if someone states that they are truly repentant the elders have to believe them, if however the person in question repeatedly commits the same sin, (for example if someone says i'm sorry I genuinly regret my actions in robbing that bank, but then they go and rob another one a week later) then it will result in being disfelloshipped. According to the organisation disfellowshiping should be the last resort that they take to keep the congregation clean if, and only if, the person is unrepentant.
One last bit of advice for both of you, elders are very good at the way they ask questions, they will try and trap your wife, stay calm and cool, keep the answers as short and to the point as possible, pause before you answer them, if they look as though they are trying to trip your wife up by asking leading questions calmly say to them, I thought that your purpose was to help my wife spiritually to gain a good standing in the congregation and with Jehovah, not to push her away. Play to there ego, they love having there ass kissed, tell them your both there because you want their help, their guidance not to fight against them.
I was in the "truth" for 50 yrs but enough is enough, personally I'd tell them to go forth and multiply, but if ther's anything I can do to help your situation I will try and give what advice I can.