Posts by BugEye

29

A Message of Hope

by 7robert7 in

jw
friends

it's been a long time since i've visited this site.

the last time that i was here i was not allowed to participate in this forums discussions for as it was explained to me, "you dont share in our beliefs, therefore your comments, ideas, and expressions would cause conflict, and disunity among those of us who do share in the truth.

" the day i recieved the denial, i broke down in tears and prayed that jesus christ would bring down the walls of hatred and mistrust among those here and that he would allow me the blessed opportunity to some day share the joy that i have found in him.

BugEye

People commonly treat money and power as though they are interchangable.

This however is an error, for although they are mostly found together,
they are not interchangable.

Ghandi was one of the most powerful men yet he had little wealth.

Bill Gates has the most money in the world, yet although he has power
his power is nowhere near comparable to his wealth.

There is no doubt that the men in Bethel are control "freaks" and
are pharisees by nature, but this does not in any way infer that
money is their motivation. Using this argument simply weakens the
case against them.

Use strong argument and points that are not only verifiable but
pertinent.

Using this argument also introduces complexity where none is
nessesary.

Better still, use the NWT to show that they are not only wrong, but
also ungodly in behaviour.

Sorry for being so adament, but as a scientist, I know all too well
weak and unsubstantiated argument promotes conflict. Where the WTBTS
is concerned, it also allows believers to have loopholes to escape
through.

Although it is wrong, people use the theory that if one bit is right
then it is all right. And if one bit is wrong then it is all wrong.
Giving a weak argument, even in only a small part allows someone who
is doubting but wants to believe to say "oh they are wrong in that, so
I wont read anymore"

Help your fellowman and woman to be set free by thinking carefully
and using strong points.

Dave

29

A Message of Hope

by 7robert7 in

jw
friends

it's been a long time since i've visited this site.

the last time that i was here i was not allowed to participate in this forums discussions for as it was explained to me, "you dont share in our beliefs, therefore your comments, ideas, and expressions would cause conflict, and disunity among those of us who do share in the truth.

" the day i recieved the denial, i broke down in tears and prayed that jesus christ would bring down the walls of hatred and mistrust among those here and that he would allow me the blessed opportunity to some day share the joy that i have found in him.

BugEye

Hi there

Thanks for your message of joy.

I dissagree on one point. That is although the WTBTS is a billion
dollar affair and it is sustained by the literature placement in
particular, you cannot make the statement that money is its motivation
unless you can show some individuals that get wealthy from it.

Watters makes a big hype about this, but there is still no evidence
that any one person or group has become wealthy due to the WTBTS.

I suggest, that initially it started as it said as a bible truth
seeking group, and trapped itself along a path and has had to keep
modifying and manipulating hoping that it will work out somehow.

The concept of "where are we to go" applies in a big way to the
organisers of the WTBTS. If they admit to themselves that they had
it all wrong, then their world will collapse.

Only relatively few are as brave and courageous as Ray Franz. And
the courage is in how to admit to yourself that you were wrong in
teaching something that controlled negatively the lives of millions.

a penny's worth

Dave

106

new, nowhere to turn, ashamed & afraid

by azzazel in

jw
friends

hullo everybody i'm new here, even though i've been lurking now for several months.. i have to say how afraid i am to post, afraid and ashamed but i feel if i dont tell my story, i honestly dont know what may happen to me or my children if they lose me, right now i feel like i've got nowhere left to turn and have my doubts about this place as well.. i know my story will shock you but i cant keep it in any longer.

i am recently disfellowshipped for immorality, the subject of a kingdom hall witch -hunt and subsequent congregational humiliation, .

during the process of the judicial committee meetings and proceedings no consideration was given to my real human circumstances nor to the spirit of survival nor human nature nor that of a mother seeking to protect her children from lack of basic fundamentals such as food, shelter and clothing.

BugEye

Azzazel

Just be careful with your life and take only your own advice
seriously. Its midnight here, so I go to bed now.

Good luck

Dave

9

Sign of the times?

by BugEye in

here is one for you.. in matt 24:9 it says **then** you will be persecuted .

in luke 21:12 it says **before** this you will be persecuted.

i have my own explaination, but it is quite radical and so.

BugEye

Hi Aaron, thanks for that. I understand that, but that does not explain the contradiction then.

dave

14

What I Observed Last Night At The Kingdom Hall

by stevieb1 in

jw
friends

i am still one of jehovah's witnesses and i still attend meetings at the kingdom hall though i am quite disgruntled over many of the society's teachings and the practices that go on in the congregation.

i have read everything about jw's both pro and con, (i have one of the largest collections of material related to jw's in europe) and i have contributed scholarly articles to the society on many occasions.

i could talk about many things but i'll just talk about what i observed last night.

BugEye

That was a genuine question, not a derogatory statement.

Dave

14

What I Observed Last Night At The Kingdom Hall

by stevieb1 in

jw
friends

i am still one of jehovah's witnesses and i still attend meetings at the kingdom hall though i am quite disgruntled over many of the society's teachings and the practices that go on in the congregation.

i have read everything about jw's both pro and con, (i have one of the largest collections of material related to jw's in europe) and i have contributed scholarly articles to the society on many occasions.

i could talk about many things but i'll just talk about what i observed last night.

BugEye

So why are you still there?

Matt 23:15

Dave

166

BRITS v YANKS

by nicolaou in

jw
friends

brits v yanks.

this is just for laughs, but let's be honest us brits are most definately ahead of our 'cousins' across the water in the credibility stakes.. i'll kick us off and see where we go;.

[1] the beautiful game.. it's called football.

BugEye

A yanks idea of international news is the NY stock exchange report.
No joke, thats what they said on NBC today before crossing to the
finance report.

Its called arrogance and they lose all points for that.

Yanks dont think that they have the best country, they think its the
only one.

Like all world powers of history, they overrate their importance and
think that they are invincible

Dave

106

new, nowhere to turn, ashamed & afraid

by azzazel in

jw
friends

hullo everybody i'm new here, even though i've been lurking now for several months.. i have to say how afraid i am to post, afraid and ashamed but i feel if i dont tell my story, i honestly dont know what may happen to me or my children if they lose me, right now i feel like i've got nowhere left to turn and have my doubts about this place as well.. i know my story will shock you but i cant keep it in any longer.

i am recently disfellowshipped for immorality, the subject of a kingdom hall witch -hunt and subsequent congregational humiliation, .

during the process of the judicial committee meetings and proceedings no consideration was given to my real human circumstances nor to the spirit of survival nor human nature nor that of a mother seeking to protect her children from lack of basic fundamentals such as food, shelter and clothing.

BugEye

Azzazel

Prostitution is not my idea of a good career move, but at least it
has a long history and will always be in demand

Dave

106

new, nowhere to turn, ashamed & afraid

by azzazel in

jw
friends

hullo everybody i'm new here, even though i've been lurking now for several months.. i have to say how afraid i am to post, afraid and ashamed but i feel if i dont tell my story, i honestly dont know what may happen to me or my children if they lose me, right now i feel like i've got nowhere left to turn and have my doubts about this place as well.. i know my story will shock you but i cant keep it in any longer.

i am recently disfellowshipped for immorality, the subject of a kingdom hall witch -hunt and subsequent congregational humiliation, .

during the process of the judicial committee meetings and proceedings no consideration was given to my real human circumstances nor to the spirit of survival nor human nature nor that of a mother seeking to protect her children from lack of basic fundamentals such as food, shelter and clothing.

BugEye

G'Day Azzazel

I am a newbie also, so I dont really count, but I have recently
decided that the WTBTS is nowhere near the truth although I knew
they were wrong in many areas for several years.

I feel for you and your situation, and unfortunately, it is simply
proof that it is not Jehovahs org as they claim. Because love is the
key proof.

My question to you, is what do you intend to do now and how can I
help?

I suggest you dont go on a rampage of rebelion as many do, but
thing of your personal growth from here on in. Your children need
you most of all now, so they are obviously a high priority.

Dave

9

Sign of the times?

by BugEye in

here is one for you.. in matt 24:9 it says **then** you will be persecuted .

in luke 21:12 it says **before** this you will be persecuted.

i have my own explaination, but it is quite radical and so.

BugEye

G'Day Six of Nine of unimatrix ...

Personally I think Seven is cuter, but anywho

I have no hard evidence that Julius ceasar existed except for a
couple of written words.

I think that Nero was the emporer when Rome was destroyed by fire,
but the evidence is shakey.

According to Quantum mechanics theory, the atom at the end of my
finger could at this moment be in Cygnus X-1.

But somewhere along the line, I tend to accept things that make
at least a semblence of sense.

Did Jesus exist or say these things? I never spoke to him personally,
neither did anyone that I know, so anything before about 200 years ago
is by its very nature conjecture based upon supposition.

Personally, I find the Schrodinger wave equation to be innacurate, and
while Quantum theory seems to work in many situations, since one
wavefunction cannot be applied to another atom or molecule other than
the one it was derived from, I would not be disturbed to hear that it
was all a load of hoohah.

The general evidence seems to show that there did exist a charismatic
leader of a new religion stemming from Judaism around 30 A.D.

That less than 80 years later, not only were the versions of his life
generally agreed upon, but quite an immense following was ensuing,
seems to indicate that there was something to the story.

As a start, I suggest you read some of the translated volumes of the
anti-nicene fathers which are freely available on the net.

As for accuracy of the bible in general, translate the passages that
interest you yourself, it is not as difficult as it may appear.
Generally Greek is much easier to start with. Also, once you have
done that, compare the text with different manuscripts.

I do not claim to have the answers, but I investigate much of
what I believe myself. I find that evidence is often based upon
belief and so very little "truth" is available.

Just some thoughts

Dave