When I was a teenager in a very active KH someone brought an "interested" woman with two little kids to the Watchtower study and part way through, to our shocked amazement, the woman began to yell and rave and rock back and forth. Her little ones began to cry and the older one was begging her mother: "Please mom...please mom, don't do this again, don't talk like that here." It was awful. Here's all the dubs sitting around in slack-jawed horror until a couple of elders got their wits together and tried to gently lead her out. She nearly threw those guys around like they were dishmops before they got her out into the street where she was forced into a car and taken home never to be seen at the hall again.
In contrast, I attended a church supper with a work colleague where during the slide show of their missionary's travels two old, grimy homeless people crept into the back room where the food had been set out. Two ladies got up and just as gracious as can be filled plates for these guys like they were guests of honour, sat them at a nicely prepared table and sat with them quietly chatting away. Choked me up! Don't think that would ever happen at a KH
function!
zulukai
JoinedPosts by zulukai
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Did you ever witness someone being escorted out of the KH?
by JH indid it ever happen in your congregation that a person was asked to leave?.
i remember about 10 years ago, an elder was giving the sunday talk, and a woman that i never saw before was seated in the front.
she was all alone, and right in the middle of the brothers talk, she raised her hand and started asking questions to the brother about what he just said.
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zulukai
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THIS is a DANGEROUS PLACE
by peggy inbecause you all inform with logic.
i have been reading for several months now.
not even sure how i found this site.
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zulukai
Please bear with me, not to hijack the thread at all...but HOT DAMN Terry........I want what you wrote in your marvellous post on my wall !!!! Poster size! That was awesome...thank you!
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THIS is a DANGEROUS PLACE
by peggy inbecause you all inform with logic.
i have been reading for several months now.
not even sure how i found this site.
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zulukai
Peggy, one of the things I found that fed my starved intellect was going to college. Four months after I left I was enrolled in nursing school. I can wholeheartidly recommend the challenge of an interesting course or two to revive your mind and jump start your latent potential. I once had the same doubts and fears you do...some that left tried to tell me things I didn't want to hear either. Then my whole life began to unravel.
I still clung for a long time to the hope that someone would believe me about the corrupt congregation I was in and the abusive JW man I was married to. It didn't seem possible that such things could exist in a religion that insisted it was the one true clean religion. I had been told the stories of others who left, but it always seemed to me that they had somehow "misunderstood" or failed to be forgiving or had been too easily stumbled. Or, Satan had got hold of them.
It was unthinkable to me that the stories were true..UNTIL it happened to me.
Now I know it was much worse than I ever would have believed. The WTBTS KNOWS full well that the KH I attended was a cesspool of corruption They only sent a Bethel rep out to hunt people like me down and mark them for being a whistle-blower, not to investigate the problems. The person at the center of it all was sending Bethel untold thousands of dollars and they were not about to let a woman in the know, so to speak, bring down their golden goose.
Most of us here have similar stories, some worse. I had a near breakdown when I realized the whole thing was an elaborate, albeit cheesy hoax. Having the goal of getting an education so I could provide a decent life for my children forestalled that crash and burn scenario. I had a goal, I was coming to life and actually enjoying life for the first time ever. You sound alot like me, the way you think and the way you raised your children. I think you are on the road to really thinking for the first time ever about the JW religion and what's behind it. Don't stop!
Both of my kids are critical thinkers and both were raised in the religion. But they both know it was and is a scam. They have careers, are responsible and have done far better than they ever would have as stepford-like witness women.. When they heard that I was on an ex-jw site they cracked up laughing.
I hope you keep reading and weighing the evidence. There is plenty of it all over the place. Will look forward to seeing your posts in the future. -
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The Country of Niger... A Call To Reason
by Doubtfully Yours ini see the pictures of this starving country and it's a appalling and saddening to see the sea of children in this tragedy.. having said that, what the heck are these people thinking bringing into the world all these children to starve to death???!!!.
along with food, why not also send enough health professionals to educate them about reproduction and its consequences in the midst of their horrible situation???!!!
dy
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zulukai
I agree with being empathetic and as Chrissy says the issue is complex, complex beyond belief. There are even UN teams of doctors and nurses who have gone to these desperate countries and come out wringing their hands in despair over the fact that most of the people they try to help reject birth control information and/or the practice of same. In fact these teams have faced angry village elders converging on them for trying to educate the women.
I have worked closely with islamic people from Africa and I can tell you that a woman is EXPECTED to have child after child (and they better be boys) even with no regard to her own health or she faces being abandoned for another wife. Her husband will have other wives anyway, but the birth of boys assures her economic well being inas much as she will be seen as valuable and have a roof over her head.
How are you going to deal with THIS cultural imperative? A muslim man I worked with had a wife of about 35 years old who had already borne him 15 children and was told the next pregnancy would kill her. So he went to the Sudan to his village and married a 15 year old girl and stood around joking about the great sex he was having with this girl. More babies will soon be on the way. He was about 55 years old. He earned minimum wage and could barely keep his huge family fed as it was. He was always begging people for money for this and that.
A lot of sympathetic people have NO idea that these countries where appalling numbers of people starve to death resent, yes resent Western nations and peoples interference in what they see as their problems. Sometimes these famines are created by the ruling junta to get rid of tribes they consider beneath the tribe in power. How are you going to deal with THIS cultural imperative?
I used to make myself sick over the plight of African children and all the hideous wars and genocides. I watched part of a news report on TV when all the horror went down in Rawanda with my hand clamped over my mouth crying in disbelief. Where was the UN? Steadfastly looking away.
What can you do with tribes of people who believe that other tribes of people are animals marked for extermination?
This is the reality of most of the problems in Africa and it's ancient and will endure. Education, fair play and food for all and health care and clean water...these are all WESTERN values, and dare I say Christian values too. And yes I do know there are educated Muslims and for everything I have said here there is a contradiction and Muslim countries who have law and order. But Africa? Does anybody know what to do when the people in power don't want it anyway? -
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THIS is a DANGEROUS PLACE
by peggy inbecause you all inform with logic.
i have been reading for several months now.
not even sure how i found this site.
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zulukai
Welcome Peggy. Glad to see you are able to listen at the meetings and get what's REALLY going on. Once that happens there's really no going back. Some posters here have done incredible amounts of research on the WTBTS, some were in the org. for decades and offer much by way of stories and life experience of the dirty little secrets this false religion has swept under the carpet.
Others,ie a couple of JWs opposed to the purpose of this site offer little but a tiresome litany of shopworn WTBTS phrases, catchwords, knee-jerk responses, pathetically impotent knuckle-rapping and/or pronouncements of divine judgement......... AND comic relief!
Glad you found us. Let's hear from you often! -
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Have You Seen My Mother.... The word is out!
by Bryan inmore news tomorrow!
bryan
have you seen my mother
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zulukai
Bryan, your story sounds so heartbreaking! I remember you telling us that you had been abducted by your father in a post a while back, and everytime I saw your signature quote:"Have you seen my mother?" I'd look at it and wonder about the whole thing...it bothered me so much.
Looking forward to obtaining a copy of your book! Hope you have found a measure of peace and closure at last. -
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Im Sad! My Mom is slowly dying from a rare disease!
by ButtLight inshe has something called, corticobasildegeneration.
yeah i know what a name!
its a disease that shrinks the brain, and there is no cure for it!
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zulukai
SO sorry for the pain and desperation you are going through right now! And your mom"s condition sounds so sad. I agree with Sunspot's assessment of nursing homes. They can be a blessing for people such as your mom. and not the horrible places some believe them to be. You would have to check them out of course and see what's avaiable in your state.
Even though you can't stand the thought of her being in managed care it's only a matter of time before you will have to consider it for her well being and safety. This is the only recourse because the the alternative of a fire or a fall in the bathtub and not being found for hours or a day is frightening.
Life is such that the day we all fear to see looming on the horizon where our parents are concerned does come and we have to step in and become our parent's parent. Sounds as if you have come to this place and I feel for you from the bottom of my heart! -
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CONGRATULATIONS ELLIE!
by diamondblue1974 in.
just to let you know that at last... ellie gave birth to baby girl over the weekend; georgia weighed 8lb 10oz and both baby and mother are fine....i thought you might like to send your congratulations to her and her partner.. .
db74
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zulukai
Congratulations, ELLIE !!!!!!!! I named my oldest daughter Georgia also! Love that name....when she was small we called her Georgie. Always loved that Ray Charles song too. Best wishes to all of you. Zu
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opinions please
by Ellie inwould you all please give me your honest opinions.. if you were in a relationship with someone who through alcohol had let you down badly in the past, how would you feel about them going out a lot?.
how much freedom would you give them?.
would you think it reasonable for them to either go out without you once a week, sometimes staying out all night but certainly till very late?.
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zulukai
I'm going to pass on some info I gained as a detox nurse who worked with addicts, alcoholics and the cross-addicted (alcohol and drugs) for five solid years.
1. The relationship that means the most to an addict is the one he or she has with their substance of choice. End of story.
2. Addicts are clever, manipulative and will lie, cheat, steal and tell you whatever it is that you need to hear in order for the above mentioned relationship to continue.
3. You have NO control over the addict's behaviour.
4. You are not to blame for the addict's behaviour.
5. If you choose to stay you need to find out how to live with your decision.
6. Ditto if you decide to leave.
Andi made a great suggestion...she said you should find an Al-anon group where you can meet other people who are in your situation. I highly recommend it. I have seen the spouses of my alchoholic patients do a 180 in their sense of worth and empowerment. If you choose to stay those meeting can teach you how not to be an "enabler". You will also learn the huge difference between "ACTION" and "REACTION"....a lesson a great many women in your situation need to learn. One makes you crazy, the other gives you your power back.
My heart goes out to you...anybody living with an alcoholic is already stronger than any woman should have to be, especially someone about to deliver a baby. I hope you have some kind of help at this time. Please take care of yourself, your kids need you. ((((((HUGS)))))) -
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All about appearances, another thing I hate about people...
by wanderlustguy ini went to a concert with a friend of mine last night, and spent a lot of the time amused at his and his friends' behavior.
i loved the music, live music does it for me in so many ways, the show had cracker, danko jones, and carbon leaf, all really reallly good bands, in an outdoor park.
anyway, i'm starting to get irritated form the nudging and hey, take a look over there's, and getting asked to go "trollin" for women.
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zulukai
One of the biggest lessons I learned about the beautiful people and popularity based on looks and affluence was hammered home at my 20th high school reunion.
It was a shock to learn of the drab lives and mediocre circumstances of some of the most "sought after" people I went through high school with. In contrast, the dweebs and nerds and girls considered too plain to bother with were living the good life...travelling the world having adventures in their chosen careers, full of stories of working in foreign countries, making bags of money and were still nice, understated people.
I've known people who at first glance seemed less than good looking who at the end of the day were the most scintillating. interesting AND sexy people in the crowd. You never know who you"ll meet that has that certain special quality either and they very often won't be the most flashy looking.
A lot of women go for the surface rather than the substance too, but in the end it really does come down to the old saying: "handsome is as handsome does!" :-)