It’s not good that anyone is oppressed for their beliefs, however unfounded they are. But the fact that there are only about 150 people out of 8 million JWs incarcerated for their beliefs is not compatible with their narrative that the main aim of ‘Satan’s system’ is to persecute JWs. As is the fact that ‘worldly’ agencies are speaking out about such abuses.
Posts by Jeffro
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7I was scrolling on my Google news feed and this came up
by nowwhat? inhttps://www.jw.org/en/news/jw/region/global/multiple-nations-issue-joint-statement-calling-for-an-end-to-the-persecution-of-jehovahs-witnesses/.
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25
Annual service report - yet another analysis - big trouble for the WTS
by FFGhost inthere's already been a couple of threads on the 2021 report with insightful comments, but i'm vain enough to want to start my own topic with some additional thoughts..... as others on the other thread noted, it's useful to compare the 2021 numbers not only to 2020 but also 2019 (the last non-pandemic report).. there are some really troubling (if you're a wt headquarters guy) news in the latest report.. 1) baptisms plummet.
2021 - 171,393. baptisms dropped 20% in 2020, and 30% more in 2021. the total drop from 2019 to 2021 is an amazing 44%.. one could argue that without in-person assemblies and conventions you'd expect baptisms to drop.
but....if someone really wants to get baptized, jws will find a way.
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Jeffro
solomon:
Im surprised they actually released these numbers.
They seem to be rather proud of their record keeping and reporting. They can always spin decreases (even when there isn’t a pandemic) as ‘the love of the greater number cooling off’ and ‘pressure from Satan’, while increases are touted as ‘proof of God’s blessing’.
At the ‘publisher’ level, there is frequently dishonest reporting of ‘preaching activity’, and even ‘honest’ reports can include hours of driving, walking or just standing without any actual ‘preaching’. And the reporting of growth of ‘publisher’ numbers rather than adherents or baptisms does serve to misrepresent the denomination’s actual growth rate. But aside from such anomalies, the Society does seem to honestly report the numbers based on the reports it receives.
(Of course, it would be futile to say the reported statistics look bad and at the same time say the reported statistics can’t be trusted.)
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New World Translation is not much different other translations
by Abraham1 inkey scripture 2 timothy 3:16 should have been translated as “every scripture inspired of god is also profitable for teaching” like many other serious translations (such as american standard version ; douay-rheims bible etc) as it is what the greek text says.. this is in harmony with the contents of bible and also with the writer paul himself who knew after his departure ‘even from his own number men will arise and distort the truth.’ (acts 20:29-30) for example, verses such as romans 7:19 is such distortion.
such verses cannot originate from real paul who was “holy, righteous and blameless.” (1 thessalonians 2:10) hence paul had the freeness of speech to tell others to be “blameless” like him (1 thessalonians 5:19-23; ephesians 5:24) there are many things in the scriptures which are not inspired such as words of satan, words of job’s wife and his false friends, words of judas, lot’s daughters …etc.
apostle peter never disowned jesus because if he had done so, his contemporaries would have interrupted him when he rebuked jews, saying: “you disowned the holy and righteous one and asked that a murderer be released to you.“ (acts 3:14) his listeners would have asked him “what right do you have to reprove us for ‘disowning jesus” when you yourself have done it first?” all such verses or accounts were later adoptions.
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Jeffro
Abraham1:
What Paul taught was the fulfillment of what Jesus foretold
Not at all. Paul’s writings came first, in which he knows very little about Jesus at all - not much beyond saying he was ‘sacrificed’ (instituted the ‘memorial’ and then killed). All of the more specific stories about Jesus, including almost all statements attributed to Jesus - including the 4 ‘gospels’ - were written later. Acts, including its ‘account’ of Paul’s ‘conversion’ that contradicts Paul’s version in Galatians, was also written later.
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Trampling of the nation's, persecution of holy ones.
by Sardis inmatthew 24:15.
15 “therefore, when you catch sight of the disgusting thing that causes desolation, as spoken about by daniel the prophet, standing in a holy place (let the reader use discernment),.
luke 21:24 *(this scripture is incorrectly referenced to daniel 4:25. correct would be to revelation 11:2 nwt).
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Jeffro
Sardis:
The GB has done good work. They really push the preaching and make Jehovah's name known.
Haha. No. If you’re comparing to other minor Adventist groups (except SDA), then yes, JWs have had relative success. And that is because the group inherited a publishing company, not because of any magical support. But more generally, JWs is just another minor Christian denomination that most people don’t even think about.
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Trampling of the nation's, persecution of holy ones.
by Sardis inmatthew 24:15.
15 “therefore, when you catch sight of the disgusting thing that causes desolation, as spoken about by daniel the prophet, standing in a holy place (let the reader use discernment),.
luke 21:24 *(this scripture is incorrectly referenced to daniel 4:25. correct would be to revelation 11:2 nwt).
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Jeffro
Sardis:
Keep in mind, the scriptures I quoted were written over roughly a 600 year span of time, and are consistent with their messages.
Entirely wrong. The verses you presented were written about 250 years apart. Daniel refers to the banning of Jewish worship in 168BCE and the subsequent re-dedication of the temple in 165BCE during the reign of Antiochus IV. Matthew, Luke and Revelation borrow some phrasing from Daniel as a metaphor but refer to the Roman occupation of Jerusalem in response to the Jewish revolt in 66CE and culminating in the destruction of Jerusalem in 70CE, to be followed by an imagined hypothetical destruction of Rome and its client kingdoms.
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15
2021 Service Year Report of Jehovah’s Witnesses Worldwide
by Joker5 in2021 grand totals.
branches of jehovah’s witnesses: 87. .
number of lands reporting: 239. .
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Jeffro
It is possible that some who claimed to be ‘anointed’ have died. But it is also quite likely that there are others who claim to be ‘anointed’ in areas that don’t have access to Zoom, particularly in parts of Africa. The Watch Tower Society is quite correct that mental or emotional imbalance may cause ‘some’ to mistakenly think they are ‘anointed’, though the proportion is actually about 100%. -
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2021 Service Year Report of Jehovah’s Witnesses Worldwide
by Joker5 in2021 grand totals.
branches of jehovah’s witnesses: 87. .
number of lands reporting: 239. .
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Jeffro
Yes, somehow there’s no way to confirm that someone is ‘really’ anointed unless it’s the GB members. 😂
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2021 Service Year Report of Jehovah’s Witnesses Worldwide
by Joker5 in2021 grand totals.
branches of jehovah’s witnesses: 87. .
number of lands reporting: 239. .
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Jeffro
Drearyweather:
Its reduced by 500 this year
This is a trivial decrease almost certainly due to some not being able to get on the Zoom memorial. Don’t expect any significant decline in ‘partakers’ any time soon.
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2021 Service Year Report of Jehovah’s Witnesses Worldwide
by Joker5 in2021 grand totals.
branches of jehovah’s witnesses: 87. .
number of lands reporting: 239. .
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Jeffro
Joker5
The report shows a growth spurt in developed lands (eg. +3% in US, +3% Australia, +3% France, +5% in Britain)
The ‘growth’ is in comparison to last year’s decrease and in most cases the figures are actually only slightly higher (and in some cases lower) than the 2019 figures. For example, Britain’s 2021 average publishers figure is actually only 1.8% higher than the 2019 figure. Netherlands reported a 2% increase for average publishers but is actually a 2.1% decrease compared to 2019.
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2021 Service Report
by alanv ini have just realized that the 2021 service report figures have in fact been published.
but they are written in such a way its harder to compare.
so on the jw website, there is a tab called 'about us'.
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Jeffro
Bear in mind that the 0.7% increase follows last year’s 0.6% decrease, so the net increase over 2019 is very small.