Posts by Jeffro

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Jeffro

‘scholar’:

Now for your experiment, I invite the participants to focus on the following texts

Despite the attempt at cherry picking, none of those verses suggest a ‘secondary fulfilment’. Of course, it’s misdirection anyway because the ‘primary fulfilment’ of the story never actually happened, and the whole story is an analogy, but still nothing to do with the JW idiocy.

Now the question to be asked for all of these texts that are well distributed throughout chapter 4 is, What is the common factor for all of these verses?

The common themes of the verses is things that are specifically depicted as affecting Nebuchadnezzar, though it is obviously not historical as it is entirely incompatible with Nebuchadnezzar’s character or religious beliefs.

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Jeffro

‘scholar’:

I would suggest that the vacancy must have occurred SOON after 607 BCE which was Neb's 18th regnal year.

Nope, that’s when Nebuchadnezzar was directing the blockade against Tyre. (And no, not the mainland city as falsely claimed by JWs, which was Ushu.)

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Jeffro

‘scholar’:

Delusional nonsense. Such a person as you describe would lack not only integrity but credibility which is a good description of a fool..

It’s very telling when someone claims that not holding superstitions is delusional. 🤦‍♂️

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Jeffro

'scholar':

Jeremiah specifically describes the 70 years as a period of servitude to Babylon, a period wherein the Land of Judah was made desolate and the fact of a Jewish Exile.

See how the apologist needs to get vague about referring to the exile to try to associate it with the 70 years, because the fact is that the Bible never refers to 70 years of exile. Most of the Jews were exiled (early 597BCE) about 11 years prior to Jerusalem's destruction, and Jeremiah wrote to them (594BCE) about Babylon's 70 years several years before Jerusalem was destroyed (587BCE). It would be entirely meaningless to tell those people that the exile would end 70 years after some unstated future starting point. 'scholar' can't get around that fact, so he will continue to flounder, jeer and misdirect.

Further, the calling to account of Babylon could only have occurred after the fact of the fulfilment of the 70 years which could have been at the Return of the Exiles.

Complete nonsense. Jeremiah 29:10 is very clear that Babylon's 70 years would end, and then attention would be given to the Jews' return from Babylon after that. The authors of 2 Chronicles and of Daniel understood that the 'calling to account' of Babylon's king quite definitely referred to the Persian conquest of Babylon in 539BCE. No 'judgement' befell either Babylon or Cyrus in 537BCE.

You refer to Stern's article but this also supports the view that Judah was desolate for 70 years so you need to be careful with archaeology opinion and read more widely.

Stern's article supports the fact that much of Judea was desolate during the Neo-Babylonian period. Specifically, Stern's article refers to the period from Nebuchadnezzar’s first regnal year (604BCE) until Cyrus’ first regnal year in Babylon (538BCE), which is not 70 years. But even if he had said it matched a period of 70 years exactly, it would hardly matter, because it would remain the fact that Babylon's 70 years was not a period of exile. Additionally, Stern actually says "not a single town destroyed by the Babylonians was resettled", indicating that the towns that were destroyed remained desolate until the Persian period, which is quite different to the JW claim that all the towns of Judea were uninhabited.

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Jeffro

'scholar':

You do not even believe in the Bible anyway and do not offer any alternative to its teachings and doctrines so until you have something to offer your ridicule amounts to nothing.

It is not necessary to hold any particular superstitious belief in order to assess the relevant texts, nor is it necessary to present some alternative superstitious belief in order to demonstrate that yours is unfounded. But I have provided substantial relevant information about the subject.

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Jeffro

'scholar':

Notice how Jeffro avoids the fact that the NB Chronicles omit any mention of Neb's vacancy off the throne for a period of 7 years.

Huh? That doesn't even make sense! Since there was no 7-year vacancy, why would anyone expect it to be shown in Babylonian chronicles? But feel free to suggest where during Nebuchadnezzar's reign the vacancy occurred. 🤦‍♂️

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Jeffro

‘scholar’:

Babylon's 70 years could not have ended in 539 BCE for the conditions of its fulfilment were that Jeremiah's prophecy describing the 70 years was that there be a desolation of the land of Judah, a period of servitude to Babylon along with being an exile in Babylon.

And, obviously he was also wrong again there too. Aside from the fact that Jeremiah explicitly defines the 70 years as a period during which the nations served Babylon rather than a period of Jewish exile, and that exile was only a punishment for refusing to serve Babylon “in their own land” (Jeremiah 27:8-11), and never mentioning ‘70 years of exile’ at all, Daniel and 2 Chronicles both unambiguously indicate when Babylon was ‘called to account’ by the Persians. Jeremiah further explicitly stated in chapter 29 that attention would be given to the Jews’ return only after Babylon’s 70 years had ended. Additionally, Jeremiah (29:10) and Daniel (9:2) both indicate that Jerusalem’s desolation would be complete (Strong’s H4390) at the end of 70 years, not that it was desolate for 70 years. And not to mention the fact that some parts of Judea actually remained populated throughout the whole period anyway (“The Babylonian Gap”, Ephraim Stern, Biblical Archaeology Review, 26:6, November/December 2000).

So much for ‘scholar’s’ ‘superior Bible teaching’. 😂

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Jeffro

‘scholar’:

OK So What was the significance and meaning of the 'seven times' applicable to Neb or is this also fiction or myth?

Notice how the inept so-called ‘scholar’ attempted to divert attention from the fact that there isn’t actually any time during Nebuchadnezzar's reign to place 7 years of inactivity.

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Jeffro

‘scholar’:

Unlike you, JWs at least teach both publicly and privately as superior Bible teachers.

Peddling false hope by making superstitious claims, cherry picking, taking verses out of context, distorting the order of events, and dogmatically asserting things that are not stated in the Bible is not ‘superior Bible teaching’.

362

Just read that Carl Olof Jonsson died yesterday

by slimboyfat in

for newbies, who was carl olof jonsson?

he was a jw in sweden who was challenged by a householder in the 1960s, who pointed out to him that secular history books don’t agree with watchtower that jerusalem was destroyed in 607 bce, but instead place the event 20 years later.

the reason the date is important is because it is the starting date for jw chronology which leads to 1914 as the end of the gentile times, and the beginning of the last days, as jws understand it.

Jeffro

Given the intent and time of writing of Daniel, it is, of course, not necessary at all that the story would actually have any relevance to Nebuchadnezzar. Instead, Nebuchadnezzar is used as a literary device. Rather than being any kind of historical account, the story borrows elements from the Prayer of Nabonidus, but the story adds and changes various details for its own purposes.

In the broader context of Daniel, the significance of the ‘seven times’ actually alludes to the 49 (7 x 7) years from Jerusalem’s destruction (587 BCE) until the Jews were allowed to return to Jerusalem (538 BCE). The same period is referenced in Leviticus 25-26, and also corresponds to the ‘7 weeks’ of the 70 weeks of Daniel chapter 9.

Notably, the ‘jubilee year’ concept described in Leviticus falls not on the 49th year but the subsequent 50th year, corresponding to starting work on the temple foundations in 537BCE. Significantly, other than the oblique reference to the period from 587BCE until 537BCE in Leviticus (which scholars recognise was completed during the Persian period), the Bible never once mentions any year as a jubilee year, and there is no evidence that jubilee years were ever actually practiced.