hi everyone, i'm new here......basically, i found this website a couple of weeks ago when i was in dire need of some like-minded souls who had felt screwed up about the jw's.
from about the age of four/five, my parents and i were involved in the organisation, and all three of us are stil messed up because of it.....we are no longer involved in it, but it took quite a few years before my parents found the strength to leave.
to begin with, i was quite a zealous jw, was baptised at twelve and disfellowshipped at fourteen, because as i got older i began to grow ''weak in the truth'' as people so kindly described me!
Welcome to the real life, GI! - and congrats on leaving the Lie.
Many things prompted me to start thinking, really thinking about the true nature of the organisation,You had such deeps thoughts at such a young age
Ahh, Defd is upset. Everybody`s leaving the Witnoids. Pretty soon, the only place JW-dom will have "prospering" congregations, is in South-American, Africa and some parts of Eastern Europe. You might want to start learning spanish, Defd.
dear lurkers/trolls or whatever you consider yourselves to be,.
how can you read all of the info on this forum regarding un scandal, alleged paedophilia, failed prophecies, u-turn on blood etc.
and not have your conscience affected before jehovah.
I wont argue with people who ask leading ? just for the sake of arguing. I am not stupid.
Sir, did you just call me a Watchtower-magazine?
dear lurkers/trolls or whatever you consider yourselves to be,.
how can you read all of the info on this forum regarding un scandal, alleged paedophilia, failed prophecies, u-turn on blood etc.
and not have your conscience affected before jehovah.
Hey I am a celebrity
Don`t flatter yourself. You suck, simply because you show up, spew some JW-propaganda, and then refuse to respond to logical arguments. You did that in the thread where we discussed Gods violent nature in the OT (you simply refused to answer my arguments and questions), and you have done it elsewhere too. How about responding to Big Tex` post on page 7 in this thread:
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/12/95454/7.ashx
...or are you not able? You can`t? Intellectual impotence?
dear lurkers/trolls or whatever you consider yourselves to be,.
how can you read all of the info on this forum regarding un scandal, alleged paedophilia, failed prophecies, u-turn on blood etc.
and not have your conscience affected before jehovah.
To some of you: Why is it so "horrible" for "lurkers", "trolls" to read on this forum? Yes, of course, some of them are brainwashed beyond hope (like Defd and Scholar), and like to argue with us, but so what? They have actually never won an argument! How could they, there is no logic in their beliefs. As for the other lurkers, they are on the right path! Remember: JW-ism is a disease, an illness! Personally I couldn`t give a rats ass if an adult wants to remain a JW, what consenting adults do, is none of my business. The point here is, that JW-childhood is horrible! - and seriosly damaging to your mental health and your adulthood! So if JW-lurkers/trolls read around on these pages, maybe, just maybe, they start investigating things further, maybe they will leave the cult, restoring hope for a normal life for their children! That in itself is reason enough why you should leave these lurkers/trolls (unless they`re only here to preach, argue, send pms etc) alone!
dear lurkers/trolls or whatever you consider yourselves to be,.
how can you read all of the info on this forum regarding un scandal, alleged paedophilia, failed prophecies, u-turn on blood etc.
and not have your conscience affected before jehovah.
I never fail to laugh and sometimes cry as I read the posts. ; I have never left this forum without something to ;THINK about. ; The one thing I am not delusional about is the recognition of ARROGANCE! ; You fit the bill
I`m with you, Peggy. Look, the original poster was probably outraged over an incident on this board, where a JW sent an instant message to one of the members (Stillaxjwelder), accusing him of apostasy etc etc, for being on this board, etc. The person sending the IM was obviously a "lurker"/"troll". So please relax...JWs, and even the GB at the WTS are quick to point out whenever they are caught doing something bad, like the UN-scandal, covering up for pedophiles, etc etc, that they are only humans, and that humans make mistakes. Well, it`s the same for X-JWs too. So please continue reading the board, it is, as you said, very educational.
running out of ideas.
anyone have some good points against 'new light'?
as you all know, on one hand the wt says to look back at old issues (however i think that issue itself is 'old') but if you do look back at old issues and point out contradictions, then of course it is 'old', out of date, etc... "that is the beauty of the org, things are revealed blah, blah,.....you know the drill.
I have a good (in my view) argument against "new light", but it`s not going to work, partly because it`s based on logical reasoning (and logic has nothing to do with JW-ism), and partly because, as you said it yourself, it`s like "banging your head against a brick wall". Ok:
1) "New light" means that God has lied to his flock in the past, and that is impossible, because God doesn`t lie. New Light means that it has become necessary (for whatever reason, usually a failed prophecy, like the generation-change in -95, or the failed predictions of -75), to change the doctrine. That`s what it actually means, to change the doctrine! And if it has become necessary to change the doctrine, that means that God must have lied in the past, because, after all, not telling the truth is the same as telling a lie. They will respond to this by saying that "people make mistakes" and that "the governing body is not a prophet, and has never claimed to be". Both arguments are weak. If "people make mistakes", then what guarantee do you have that they are not mistaken on other issues, or on the "new light". The second counter-argument is a lie, because there are many WTs, Awakes and books, some aren`t even that old, that proclaim the WTb&ts as "Gods prophet on earth in the last days", or "Gods prophetical organisation". However, this line of thought is to complex for the average JW-mind. Also, and this is where it gets really complex:
The term "New Light" indicates that that is just what it is: A "new light", that is, a term that does not relate to pure reason alone, but to a "new understanding of divine origin". That is, the new "understanding" has been given to the GB by God himself, either thru JC, the holy ghost, or angels (they even claimed that, once upon a time, that angels were in direct communication with the GB). That is really (logically) like saying that Gods words (thru the holy Bible) were not the "final say on the matter" (exemplified by it being necessary for them to come up with their own Bible translation, the NWT), but that God is in direct contact with humans, and that his revelations (ie his BIBLE) is "not finished", that it is a "work in progress". This is really dramatic, and indicates that the GB is not just a group of christians/bible students, studying the bible, but a group of prophets in direct contact with GOD! And this underlines the original argument i started this post with: Why has God chosen to tell lies in the past? Not only telling lies, but telling them directly to his organisation on earth!? Why? The answer will be "eh, oh, eh, there are some things God doesn`t want us to know yet", or whatever. Forget the whole thing, open a bottle of wine instead..
i know what "apostate" means to most of the world.
i am interested in the jw perspective.
i grew up a jw, but was never baptised.
Yeah, I don`t think you have to be baptised to be considered an apostate. A word of digression: In my country, the word "apostate" has no norwegian equivalent. So the word used for "apostates" is "motstander", which means "OPPONENT"! And an "opponent" doesn`t have to have been baptised, it is sufficient that he has known "the Truth" (the Lie), and is actively working against it! That last part is very important. So I am per definition an apostate/opponent.
i know what "apostate" means to most of the world.
i am interested in the jw perspective.
i grew up a jw, but was never baptised.
Oh, I love that picture in your profile, under74. Ha ha, especially that church burning in the background, that`s so funny. "A religion of love" for sure. Is it from a WT or an Awake? JWs are so funny. Pictures like that one (and also pics like the harlot riding the beast with the UN-building in the background) are very revealing of what they think of the the world, how much they hate the world!! Cause that`s actually what it is: Hate! And then they whine about how "they are going to be persecuted" in the endtimes. Every time someone uncovers some scandal, like the UN-thing, or how they cover up for pedophiles on a massive scale, they are the ones being persecuted! Such hypocricy! - and they don`t even see it! That religion sickens me so much, I can`t even describe it.
dear lurkers/trolls or whatever you consider yourselves to be,.
how can you read all of the info on this forum regarding un scandal, alleged paedophilia, failed prophecies, u-turn on blood etc.
and not have your conscience affected before jehovah.
I agree with Peggy, here, actually. Hm, I think some of the people here (myself included, actually), should be a bit more friendly to the JW-visitors (except from Scholar and DefD, they suck!). After all, coming to websites like this is a first step out of insanity.
i have read your posts and am suprised, shocked and disgusted at the fact you still are an active witness who goes to the meetings 70% of the time and at the same time go to apostefests and curse and talk bad about the truth.
dont you know that the bible said people like you would quietly slip in the congregation and subvert the faith of some?
are you not afraid of god and jesus?
Yeah, that was great post big Tex! So, come on, DEFD, WHY DON`T YOU RESPOND?!?!?! There have been a few really god posts here, that last one from big Tex was a good one, why don`t you respond to that?!?! Oh no, I know why you don`t respond! It`s for the same reasons you wouldn`t respond to me, when we were discussing Gods violent nature in the Old Testament. The problem is: YOU CAN`T! You have no idea how to argue with us, because you are brainwashed into a very narrow mindset called "the Truth", in which there are given questions and answers to some issues, but not to all, not the ones that are outside the belief/thought-system of yours. For those questions, you only have one answer: "God moves in mysterious ways" aka "there are some things God doesn`t want us to know". Or can you? Can you answer Big Tex` post?
