Posts by tim3l0rd

26

No shorts or printed T-shirts when making ready the stadium before the RC

by Powermetal4ever in

jw
friends

just heard the stupidest thing ever on this weeks service meeting: it was regarding the volunteers for cleaning the stadium before rc.

they are not allowed to wear shorts or printed t-shirts .but hey its summer!

its gonna be warm!

tim3l0rd

That rule is because they don't trust the r & f to know what would be considered "decent". Someone might show up with shorts that are too short or a logo that is offensive. ::gasp::

I visited Belize once and was told how the JWs there even cleaned their KH in dress clothes and took offense when JW tourists (coming off the cruise ships) would want to come in to the KH in non-dress clothes (even though there was no meeting going on).

I will say that the standard of dress is one thing that I am always impressed with. It's obviously mandated by the org, but, compared to standards of dress among "the world", they stand out. I know it's judgmental now but I was always proud to be dressed up. We would frequently get comments about how well dressed everyone is. I was proud to be "different". Now I see it was all vanity anyway.

18

John 21:23 a new argument for JW's regarding false prophecy promoted being OK

by ILoveTTATT2 in

jw
friends

i want as many minds put into this as possible.. there is a new argument among the extreme jw apologists, saying that even the disciples promoted mistakes.

they base themselves on john 21:23. keep in mind, i am not a believer but i want the answer from a believer's standpoint, please.. .

nwt:.

tim3l0rd

Even if they had a wrong belief, there is no evidence that this was published, announced in talks, or pushed as something that everyone HAD to believe or be ousted from the congregation. Others could obviously hold a different belief. That would be my argument.

I've had this conversation with my wife several times now. How can I teach something as truth that cannot be questioned to my bible student even though I know that "truth" could change in a decade, a year, a few months? How is it fair to enforce this policy of absolute unity of doctrine when the doctrines change regularly? All I get is a shoulder shrug.

67

'Conti' Court decision secures Watchtower's Policy of confidentiality

by telemetry11 in

the court on the rule of confidentiality of penitential communications and evidentiary privilege--.. decision reads:.

"the law generally protects the confidentiality of communications with clergy like those of kendrick to the elders here.".

"if the person has a constitutional right to independence in making religious choices, the recognition of an evidentiary privilege is an apt means of protecting that autonomy.

tim3l0rd

Every lawyer who has ever sued a corporations has stated that money = change. It's one of the most powerful ways to encourage change. You can't put a corporation behind bars. If religion hides behind the first amendment, then attacking their source of power (money) is the best way to pursue change from the outside.

100

Exposing one's identity. When?

by kairos in

jw
friends

i've been toying with the idea of just coming out and posting my name and location as an attempt to be available to locals that secretly browse the forum that have known me for up to 25 years.

( "reaching out", so to speak ).

i'm not da'd or df'd, so this most certainly could end in a dramatic confrontation.

tim3l0rd

I think the reason for the change in the kingdom hall design is just to match the ugly logos. The logo horribly clashes with every kingdom hall that I've seen them on.

7

Turning disassociation around on the org

by tim3l0rd in

recently i was researching the scripture used to justify why da'd ones were to be shunned the same as df'd ones and decided that this could easily be turned around.

they use 2 john 9-11.. 9 everyone who pushes ahead and does not remain in the teaching of the christ does not have god.+ the one who does remain in this teaching is the one who has both the father and the son.

10 if anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your homes or say a greeting to him.

tim3l0rd

Thanks leaving_quietly! That's another scripture I need to add to my list of reasons I'm leaving.

17

Would you warn your neighbors if a child molester lived on your street?

by Stealth in

jw
friends

just found out that someone who lives 4 doors down was convicted of molesting a 4 year old child twice.

the second time was after he was arrested and released on bond from the first arrest.

having two 4 year old children living in my home, i am concerned.

tim3l0rd

If he's on the sex offender registry, you could pass a flyer around with the web address of the registry and strongly suggest that everyone check their neighborhood. This would probably be better than coming right out and stating that so-and-so is a child molester. Plus they get to see it with their own eyes and it's not just Stealth down the streets word.

7

Turning disassociation around on the org

by tim3l0rd in

recently i was researching the scripture used to justify why da'd ones were to be shunned the same as df'd ones and decided that this could easily be turned around.

they use 2 john 9-11.. 9 everyone who pushes ahead and does not remain in the teaching of the christ does not have god.+ the one who does remain in this teaching is the one who has both the father and the son.

10 if anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your homes or say a greeting to him.

tim3l0rd

Recently I was researching the scripture used to justify why DA'd ones were to be shunned the same as DF'd ones and decided that this could easily be turned around. They use 2 John 9-11.

9 Everyone who pushes ahead and does not remain in the teaching of the Christ does not have God.+ The one who does remain in this teaching is the one who has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your homes or say a greeting to him. 11 For the one who says a greeting to him is a sharer in his wicked works.

Reading this, it's very easy to apply this to the org since their own publications have many examples of them pushing ahead of the teaching of the Christ. While the org can argue that they aren't prophets (even though they act like it and have even used the word to describe themselves), they can't argue that they haven't pushed ahead since many of their teachings have subsequently been reversed. The original teaching of 1914, for example, is a clear indication of pushing ahead. Also the types and anti-types teachings that were recently changed, organ transplants, Jesus coming in 1914 vs Jesus presence in 1914 all are easy examples of the org "pushing ahead".

I thought this might be a useful reasoning to use with JWs who say that the GB are not prophets. I shared it with my wife (still-in and I'm still going for now) and she didn't deny that the org could be guilty of pushing ahead.

22

baptism regional Convention

by antes8080 in

jw
friends

hello friends during the weekend i was in the san diego regional convention and the number of baptisim was way down.. there were 51 who got baptise thats the lowest number i ever seen, the attendance was 14,000 plus .

tim3l0rd

7 men and 12 women. At least the ratio of women to men is staying the same.

Growth has been in the foreign language congregations for a long while. Less access to older publications, a less educated group, immigrants working for peanuts, all these things make these people ripe for plucking by the WBT$. I've even heard still-in bethelites admit that growth in the US would be negative if they only counted English congregations or separated the language groups on the annual report.

16

New (non)-Witnessing Model

by berrygerry in

so, one of the kids on reddit posted this video - an evangelist trying to witness to guardians of the cart.

(both sides are fairly respectful imo).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwbc9c4ajly&feature=youtu.be.

tim3l0rd

Bump... Just curious if anyone had a laugh at the inept ASL sister.

16

New (non)-Witnessing Model

by berrygerry in

so, one of the kids on reddit posted this video - an evangelist trying to witness to guardians of the cart.

(both sides are fairly respectful imo).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwbc9c4ajly&feature=youtu.be.

tim3l0rd

In case anyone wanted to know what was being said in the ASL conversation in the background, here is the interpretation. It's somewhat funny especially because the sister does not explain what Eddie was saying.

It's obvious that these 2 were there from an ASL congregation. From experience I know that witnessing to the deaf community is so different than English that these two were completely not prepared. Most of the deaf community know very little about the Bible as English is their 2nd language (ASL being their first) and the grammar and even some of the vocabulary is very different between ASL and English. They rely on the interpreters at church or family to tell them what the Bible says. So preaching to a deaf person is very different. That's not always the case, but it has been my experience many times.

Anyway on to the translation:

Eddie walks up says, "Hi..." Sister starts by interpreting what he is saying.

Sister: Hi, how are you doing?

Eddie: I got a question for you.

Sister: I have a question.

Eddie: Do you have the answer?

Sister: (laughs) Maybe...

Eddie's talking about tie and cool suit

Sister: Cool

Eddie presents hypothetical about being shot and having 2 minutes to live.

Deaf woman: Hey, what's he saying?

Sister: He wants to know. He has a question. He gives an example. Another (she signed any, but I think she meant other) person (signs people) shoots him. He falls and says, "I need help! HELP! HELP!" But he wants know.... (looks as if she's struggling to interpret or doesn't want to)

Deaf woman: Call 9-1-1

Sister: Yes that (laughing)

Deaf woman: Call 9-1-1

Sister: Yes. I (or he - she just signs KNOW THAT - it's just a way to acknowledge) knows that

Sister: He means what?... I hope you know... Do you see those people other there? Hey, the "abortion wrong" (people - not signed but implied)? He's with them.

Deaf woman: Ohhhhh

Sister: I don't know

Deaf woman: hey, if something goes terribly wrong like a fire and you're not sure what happened or to do, call 9-1-1

Sister: Ahhh yes.

Deaf woman: (She gestures that the sister should tell him)

Sister: (seemingly ignoring gesture) Maybe sometimes you do what? (That's literally what she signed, not sure what she meant)

Deaf woman (to Eddie): Call 9-1-1

Eddie: Hang on

Sister: He said wait.

Eddie finishes his death example and asks where the Bible tells us that we get another chance.

Deaf woman: (can't see her signing, but based on the sister's response I'm guessing she asked the time)

Sister: 1:41

Eddie confronts JW about witnessing

Deaf woman: What's up? What's he saying?

Sister doesn't reply and after a while it seems that the deaf woman says, "Nice to meet you, bye." (implied based on sister's response

Sister: It's nice to meet you. See you... (Deaf woman signs at same time)

Deaf woman: (Hands are masked by Eddie's head and the only sign I can make out is) .... come....

Sister: See you tomorrow, bye!

Deaf woman: (Again can't see hands)

Sister: 2 (maybe they made an appt for an RV?)

Deaf woman: (Hands still masked, but looks like she says the following) See you at 2.

Sister: Nice to meet you

Deaf woman: Yes

Sister: See you later

Deaf woman: Yes see you later

Sister: Bye

Deaf woman: Bye

To the best of my ability that is the conversion. Have fun!

timelord