Bridgette,
bttt stands for "back to the top" (of the discussion board).
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14
Exercise--Is It For Christians?
by comment inexcerpted from a future issue of the watchtower:.
in modern times, great emphasis has been laid upon diet and exercise, particularly in western lands.
people are often impressed by the physiques of athletes and movie stars presented in the media.
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Tape record Oct. 7 meeting
by comment incould anyone who is attending the special meeting on october 7 arrange to tape record it?.
it would probably not be that hard to bring in one of those mini-cassette recorders and at least capture part of what is said.. i am sure others who are unable to attend the meeting would be interested in hearing a recording.
and if it turns out to be a "historic occasion," it would be nice for the world to have a document of it.. comment
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Could anyone who is attending the special meeting on October 7 arrange to tape record it?
It would probably not be that hard to bring in one of those mini-cassette recorders and at least capture part of what is said.
I am sure others who are unable to attend the meeting would be interested in hearing a recording. And if it turns out to be a "historic occasion," it would be nice for the world to have a document of it.
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Question on Teaching UN is Beast to recruits?
by hawkaw inquestion to you intelligent jws and exjws.. does the wt, through its knowledge book or whatever, make sure new recruits know who the scarlet coloured wild beast is or disgusting thing is (ie, the un), who is part of the great harlot etc before becoming full blown jws?.
like should new recruits know this off by heart thanks to the rote teaching?.
hawk
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From 1995 onward (and I believe this has just changed recently, in terms of a return to a more extended Bible study program), those studying to become one of Jehovah's Witnesses would optimally go through the book Knowledge That Leads to Everlasting Life (1995) in six months (most took longer, a few less).
That book contains NO references to either the League of Nations or the United Nations, positive or negative.
Interestingly, the book passes up an opportunity to refer explicitly to the UN on page 106 under the subheading "Respond to the Evidence."
It says: "How will this system end? The Bible foretells a 'great tribulation' that will begin with an attack by this world's political element upon 'Babylon the Great,' the world empire of false religion. (Matthew 24:21; Revelation 17:5, 16)"
By contrast, the Revelation Climax (1988) book is much more explicit when it states in chapter 28: "Yes, the nations will use the scarlet-colored wild beast, the United Nations, in destroying Babylon the Great. They do not act on their own initiative, for Jehovah puts it into their hearts 'even to carry out their one thought by giving their kingdom to the wild beast.' When the time comes, the nations will evidently see the need to strengthen the United Nations. They will give it teeth, as it were, lending it whatever authority and power they possess so that it can turn upon false religion and fight successfully against her 'until the words of God will have been accomplished.' Thus, the ancient harlot will come to her complete end. And good riddance to her!"
Having completed a study of the Knowledge book, the prospective baptismal candidate, by now participating in the door-to-door ministry and "living according to Bible standards," would go through the baptismal questions on pages 175-218 of the book Organized to Accomplish Our Ministry (1983), with several elders.
The Organized book contains NO references to either the League of Nations or the United Nations.
If the questions were answered successfully, the person could now get baptized.
Therefore, depending on what materials were discussed at congregation meetings during the period of an interested person's Bible study, I believe it would have been POSSIBLE, at least for a good portion of the 1990's, for a person to become one of Jehovah's Witnesses without knowing whom the Society identifies as the scarlet-colored wild beast or the disgusting thing.
I'd be interested to see what others have to say on this matter.
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WT/UN References-Dan. Creator. Proc. Rev.
by messenger inbelow are the references made to the un from four wt publications.
it is interesting how anyone who had any association with the un were completely condemned to destruction by wt.
this is too funny..... .
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re is Revelation--Its Grand Climax at Hand!, published in 1988. It features the Society's analysis of the book of Revelation.
jv is Jehovah's Witnesses--Proclaimers of God's Kingdom, published in 1993. It is the official history of Jehovah's Witnesses.
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Exercise--Is It For Christians?
by comment inexcerpted from a future issue of the watchtower:.
in modern times, great emphasis has been laid upon diet and exercise, particularly in western lands.
people are often impressed by the physiques of athletes and movie stars presented in the media.
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bttt for the non-weekend crowd...
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14
Exercise--Is It For Christians?
by comment inexcerpted from a future issue of the watchtower:.
in modern times, great emphasis has been laid upon diet and exercise, particularly in western lands.
people are often impressed by the physiques of athletes and movie stars presented in the media.
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I can think of plenty of cases where Witness kids I knew (or saw giving their experiences at an assembly) passed up chances to excel at their favorite sports precisely because of this kind of reasoning. (Of course, my parody blows it up to ludicrous heights, but you really can't say exercise is ENCOURAGED, the occasional article on cross-country skiing notwithstanding. Oh yes, and those faithful Bethelites who take the stairs instead of the elevator.)
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14
Exercise--Is It For Christians?
by comment inexcerpted from a future issue of the watchtower:.
in modern times, great emphasis has been laid upon diet and exercise, particularly in western lands.
people are often impressed by the physiques of athletes and movie stars presented in the media.
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Brother Naeblis, it appears that you are not being responsive to the wisdom of the faithful and discreet slave. ;)
(I could definitely see that happening.)
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14
Exercise--Is It For Christians?
by comment inexcerpted from a future issue of the watchtower:.
in modern times, great emphasis has been laid upon diet and exercise, particularly in western lands.
people are often impressed by the physiques of athletes and movie stars presented in the media.
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Excerpted from a future issue of The Watchtower:
In modern times, great emphasis has been laid upon diet and exercise, particularly in Western lands. People are often impressed by the physiques of athletes and movie stars presented in the media. But should Christians be affected by this prevailing trend, allowing themselves to get involved in exercise?
The Bible provides a reliable guide, for its pages reflect divine wisdom. 1 Timothy 4:8 states that "bodily training is beneficial for a little." Some have taken this to mean that exercise in moderation, such as running, jogging or doing calisthenics, is beneficial.
However, Robinson's New Concordance of Greek Terminology, published in 1886, observes: "The anathartic article, here invoked by Paul, permits a variant reading that wills, yes, urges the Bible student to accede to a minimum. The apostle desired young Timothy to abstain to the degree possible from such God-defiling activity, for bodily training was beneficial FOR LITTLE." [emphasis ours]
So evidently, Christians must abstain from exercise. Otherwise, they could jeopardize their standing before God. How sad it would be to throw away the prospect of perfect health in a Paradise earth simply for yielding to the temptation to exercise!
Today, in the Christian congregations of Jehovah's Witnesses worldwide, thousands heed Paul's wise admonition. A sister in the United States comments: "My heart is filled with joy when I drive past a donut shop and see a group of corpulent pioneers enjoying a coffee break! It is just as Psalm 92 foretold: 'Fat and fresh they will continue to be.'"
What a fine example! Young ones, in particular, do well to take these words to heart. In the "bloom of youth," they may have sudden impulses to dabble in soccer or hockey. (1 Corinthians 7:36)
Daniel, who serves as a Christian elder in Nigeria, relates: "When I was a teenager, I led a double life, performing pushups in my room without the knowledge of my faithful parents. Once, I was exercising in the field behind our house when my father caught me. He was clearly distressed, but he did not beat me. Instead, he reasoned with insight, asking me: 'How would you feel if a new Bible study saw you exercising and ceased associating with the congregation?' I saw the need to adhere more closely to Bible standards in my life. Today, I continue to grow in spiritual and physical maturity."
Satan would love to see us weaken and yield to exercise. How can we combat our Adversary's crafty devices? By sticking to a regular program of meeting attendance, personal study and prayer. If we immerse ourselves in spiritual pursuits, we will soon find that we have no time for exercise. What a joyful prospect!
If you find yourself sorely tried, ask yourself this simple question: Does Jehovah exercise? Of course not! Therefore, neither should his faithful earthly servants. Sedentary in our spirituality, we can happily praise our loving God right down to the conclusion of this wicked system of things!
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Pure Propaganda
by comment ini believe someone else already posted an excerpt from the following document on the board, but i wanted to comment on one specific portion.. it's a 1999 australian senate committee hearing on religious freedom.
for a free society is to allow people to have whatever opinions they want, unless it gets to the stage where they are destroying the public order.".
"now, whether or not it is destroying the public order should be a matter for objective analysis, not a subjective, bigoted type of.
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I believe someone else already posted an excerpt from the following document on the board, but I wanted to comment on one specific portion.
It's a 1999 Australian Senate Committee hearing on religious freedom. The original can be found at:
http://www.aph.gov.au/hansard/joint/commttee/j2444.pdf
The response I've excerpted is from Vincent Toole, a Legal Officer with the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of Australia, addressing the roots of religious discrimination and intolerance.
Mr Toole-I guess so, and I guess it is the same thing-you will disagree but yet you
are the best of friends. That is the view we take. The fact that people do not necessarily
share our particular understanding and they think, `Oh no, that is the not the way I want to
believe it,' is fine. We are really trying to educate people and teach tolerance. That really is
getting at the very root cause of the problem. It is fanaticism that causes some of these
problems, where people have a singular view that their way is right and woe betide anybody
who disagrees with it. It gets to the stage, when you start having that elevated to a level of
government, where you have a very dangerous situation because then you are only one step
away from totalitarianism, where you have people in high places deciding what you can and
cannot believe on a whole host of things.Tying in with your question before about what should governments do, I would have
thought in a free society that people should be able to have whatever beliefs they want
unless they become detrimental or positively disruptive to society at large. The price we pay
for a free society is to allow people to have whatever opinions they want, unless it gets to
the stage where they are destroying the public order. Now, whether or not it is destroying the
public order should be a matter for objective analysis, not a subjective, bigoted type of
imposition of other people's wills.Now, let's rephrase some of what Brother Toole said and see if we can find an interesting parallel.
"Jehovah's Witnesses have a singular view that their way is right and Armageddon betide anybody who disagrees with it."
Or, focusing more on the here and now:
"Jehovah's Witnesses have a singular view that their way is right and disfellowshipping and shunning betide any congregation member who disagrees with it."
Here's another good rephrasing:
"You have a very dangerous situation because then you are only one step away from totalitarianism, where you have the Governing Body deciding what you can and cannot believe on a whole host of things."
Brother Toole graciously points out that "The price we pay
for a free society is to allow people to have whatever opinions they want, unless it gets to the stage where they are destroying the public order."Perhaps he could follow his own logic a little further:
"Now, whether or not it is destroying the public order should be a matter for objective analysis, not a subjective, bigoted type of
imposition of the Governing Body's will."Yes, how about the idea that people should be able to leave the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses without sanction? And should feel free to talk about the reasons why they did so with their Witness family, friends or acquaintances?
Ultimately, these well-spoken arguments boil down to "Give us the freedom we deserve in a free society--so that we can impose a much more draconian way of life on the members of our OWN little society."
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Important point re WT-UN issue
by comment inon the main thread concerning the watchtower society's being a registered non-governmental organization with the united nations, the objection was raised that if the department of public information decides to revoke the society's ngo status, those wishing to expose the society's hypocrisy in this matter would no longer have the option of showing their witness acquaintances the society's name listed among the other ngos on the un web site.. however:.
if the society lost its status and was removed, would there not be an announcement or press release on the web site about the decision?
it would be very odd to just drop an ngo without letting the public know about it.
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On the main thread concerning the Watchtower Society's being a registered Non-Governmental Organization with the United Nations, the objection was raised that if the Department of Public Information decides to revoke the Society's NGO status, those wishing to expose the Society's hypocrisy in this matter would no longer have the option of showing their Witness acquaintances the Society's name listed among the other NGOs on the UN web site.
HOWEVER:
If the Society lost its status and was removed, would there not be an announcement or press release on the web site about the decision? It would be very odd to just drop an NGO without letting the public know about it. Presumably, such an announcement would explain WHY the Society had lost its status (i.e. the Society is fundamentally opposed to the goals and existence of the UN, PR whitewashes notwithstanding). It might mention that the Society had enjoyed NGO status since 1991 and had applied for that status of its own initiative, not due to any outside pressure.
It seems to me that being able to direct Witnesses to read this press release would be JUST AS effective as showing them the current list of NGOs. Provided, of course, that the announcement was clear about what the Society has been up to for the last ten years.
Thoughts?
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