http://www.pressbox.co.uk/detailed/International/RVY_Recalls_the_Death_of_Scientology_Creator_L._Ron_Hubbard_37245.html The above has a pretty revealing article written by an ex-member high in their org. He got booted kind of like the 1980 Franz thing when the new leader David Miscavage took over at the death of L. Ron H. It even has a link showing parts of the autopsy of the prophet - RVY claims he was on antipsychotic drugs at the time! ---Take that Tom Cruise. The weird thing is, if you really piss these nuts off, instead of shunning you - apparantly they will COME AFTER YOU! There is another really good one about a little American Indian town in Oklahoma where they tried to take over and build a Narconone center without telling anyone who they were...the local small town newspaper editor fought a single handed battle with them for years. (and lost, I think) if I can find it again I will put it on this thread. As posted before, I have a good friend who came out of this. I think they may be more scary than WTS and company.
james_woods
JoinedPosts by james_woods
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25
A real Russell conspir? Not Illuminati bull corn.
by IP_SEC ini've got a little fuzz growing right now, and it got me to thinking about the wts inane animosity toward beards.
abram, noah, and moses had beards... within a reasonable doubt.
russell had a bea... holy crap, russell had a beard.. the war on whiskers went so far as to shave jesus for a time.. was this scrimmage against man face an attempt by rutherford and co to remove the influence of russell?
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james_woods
One real old-timer (he was around in the 1930's) remembered when they were actually looking for Daniel and Jeremiah.
He told me that a lot of people would look around at meetings and conventions to see if anyone had a beard and then make jokes - (maybe it was one of the holy men of old). He also said that they "just didn't know how silly that was at the time". Well, that came from the exact same time as the Great Crowd and the annointed remnant division, and you guys kept that part.
Wonder if this got a little embarassing after say 15 years with none of the ancients able to identify as such? Maybe that is part of the anti-beard thing?
Actually, in my opinion it was hatred of free thinking hippies (and that ubiquitous picture of Jesus) that fueled it during the 60's and 70's.
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1975 - serves you right. No extra brownie points sycophants
by Spectrum inthis issue came up with my jw nephew(17).
i jumped at the chance at using it to prove that the org is a fraud but then the focus changed slightly.
i said, "do you know how many people's lives were disrupted by this event.
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james_woods
Best thread in several weeks, IMHO. But I am concerned -
Are we somehow going down that ski slope of "the publishers who believed it just made it themselves"?
So, why did they "get what they deserved"?...these people DID NOT make it up themselves. Some must have sincere in believing it, no?
What about people (like me) who were already fading in the 1970-1975 years and really never believed that anything was going to happen? Did we somehow fail the lord by NOT believing it? Even though it turned out to truly be a steaming pile?
Or, were we somehow better off because we DISTRUSTED the FDS?
Whats the old saying - fool me once (shame on me); fool me twice (shame on you)? [1914 etc. vs 1975]
Maybe this is where your nephew is going with his excellent observation...
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1975 - serves you right. No extra brownie points sycophants
by Spectrum inthis issue came up with my jw nephew(17).
i jumped at the chance at using it to prove that the org is a fraud but then the focus changed slightly.
i said, "do you know how many people's lives were disrupted by this event.
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james_woods
I had a same-age friend (about 25 duriing 1975) spout forth that he thought the end would really come just a little AFTER 1975 because that would give time for people to kind of let up. This would help eliminate some of the weaker witnesses who were just doing it for brownies. I.E: Jehovah likes to trick his faithful people.
The cool thing is that this guy was disfellowshipped at least twice and reproved I cannot recall hom many times. He dragged himself back each time (after each divorce and remarriage) by saying he was sorry.
He is now an elder and I hear is just about the biggest WT thumber around.
James
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17
I am a milieage victim!
by free2beme ini would love to have a vehicle that got 30 miles or more to the gallon.
unfortunetly i have to toe things, like a boat, and that requires a truck.
so i purchased a dodge truck, with a deisel engine, and i get a thrill out of 14-16 mpg.
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james_woods
OK, this thread is entirely too green and responsible to be about CARS!
I will report that my hobby car is one of the last 1995 ZR1 Corvettes. It has 405hp and a top speed of 180+ mph.
I take it out on occasional weekends and one road trip a year. I can report that on my last trip it returned about 26 mpg. This was with the secondary fuel injection turned off (it has a power key for this) and running in 6th overdrive at about 75 - 80 mph.
It goes down to about 18-20 mpg driven they way most Corvette owners drive - still not so horrible in my books.
James
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17
I am a milieage victim!
by free2beme ini would love to have a vehicle that got 30 miles or more to the gallon.
unfortunetly i have to toe things, like a boat, and that requires a truck.
so i purchased a dodge truck, with a deisel engine, and i get a thrill out of 14-16 mpg.
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james_woods
OK, this thread is entirely too green and responsible to be about CARS!
I will report that my hobby car is one of the last 1995 ZR1 Corvettes. It has 405hp and a top speed of 180+ mph.
I take it out on occasional weekends and one road trip a year. I can report that on my last trip it returned about 26 mpg. This was with the secondary fuel injection turned off (it has a power key for this) and running in 6th overdrive at about 75 - 80 mph.
It goes down to about 18-20 mpg driven they way most Corvette owners drive - still not so horrible in my books.
James
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Society's recall of older books
by rekless indoes anybody remember when the wtbts ask all the congregations to bring back all the old outdated books.
i think it was in the late eighties.
there was an announcement from the podium, return old books so they could be returned to new york.. i was too lazy to go through my books and take them in.
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james_woods
I have an older book "The Russians" which was written by a former US diplomat to the former USSR. (I think Frederick Smith). He is writing about general life for rank and file Russian citizens.
One really unbelievable story was about a newspaper article which had to be changed after the political commisar got a look at it. So, they REPRINT that whole days newspaper with the changes made. In the new newspaper it tells citizens to bring back the original to the newspaper office so that they could be destroyed - and he says that he knew many people who actually did it! The previous post made me remember this story.
Also, while at the so-called elders school, the story was told about a brother at an earlier school who actually got a demon, went crazy, and committed suicide. What caused it was getting into the Bethel library and reading old publications! Soo - they kept them around for historical reasons, but put them into a locked room and only the writing or research people could look at them after that...how much of this to believe, I cannot say. However, the point was not to look at anything older than about 1950 (this was in 1970).
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When did having children become the right thing to do?
by james_woods inpossibly someone else who was around in the 1975-1980 time frame will remember this:.
it seemed to be that prior to 1975, the message on children was "wait until the new system".
however, it seemed to me at the time that after 1975 there was a popularization of child bearing.
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james_woods
Possibly someone else who was around in the 1975-1980 time frame will remember this:
It seemed to be that prior to 1975, the message on children was "wait until the new system". However, it seemed to me at the time that after 1975 there was a popularization of child bearing. The Awake always had some fluff article on "natural childbirth", "parenting", etc.
With the combination of no fulfillment whatsoever in 1975, and with the drop in pioneering (maybe partly due to the end of selective service about this same time), a distinct downturn in growth followed this year.
I have always thought that with the decline in growth after 1975, the society realized that haviing children meant more members, and kind of dropped the advice to "wait until the new system". Does anyone else suspect the same? Or, have they now gone back to the wait & pioneer viewpoint?
James
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What was "it" that opened your eyes?
by jiggulz inlike so many people, i'm (very carefully)trying to convey the obvious "truth" about the wtb&ts to some of the members of my family.
is there any key point that "stands out" in your memory as pivotal in the opening of your eyes?
or any particular point that may have opened the eyes of your loved ones?
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james_woods
This may be a little different from most folks first realization of something wrong, but it was really my first big doubt and disillusionment:
I had a comparitive religions professor challenge me on the Jehovah name all over the new testament. I decided to prove him wrong and started a research project about it. What I found out, of course, was that they just made up their mind to put it here and there and did not have any sound reasons. And to think that they were telling us that all other bible translators throughout history were mistranslating it to HIDE the name!!!! This was way back in 1969.
I also never believed the 7000 year creative days and had decided that the 1975 was hopeless long before it came and went. The thinking heart and evil brain stupidity was also a big issue.
But, finding out that they had misrepresented the bible itself was the start of all the other realizations.
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FRIDAY the 13th What your take?
by xjwms in.
do you think something bad may happen to you?.
o r. is just another day?
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james_woods
I have an excellent travel book by Ian Fleming (the James Bond author) called "Thrilling Cities". He took an around the world tour and tells about his experiences. Fleming liked to fly on Friday 13th because so many people were afraid to that the flights were never crowded. He had James Bond do the same in some of the novels.
However, he was flying from Tokyo to Honolulu on a Friday 13th in a DC6 prop airliner, and sure enough the #4 engine catches on fire. The pilot feathers it and hits the extinquishers. They have to divert to Midway island and make an emergency landing, which comes off without any problems. He then admits to having second thoughts about the Friday 13th thing!
As an aside, while stuck on Midway with nothing to do while they get another plane - he gets to talking to the customs agent. He had a number of parrots there in quarantine for a few weeks before they could be imported to the States. This guy was amusing himself by teaching them to say naughty words as a little surprise for their new owners...