1. apostates are divided among themselves and have nothing better to offer.
2. most left because they can't reach the high moral standards of jehovah's witnesses.. .
3. all apostates can do is tear down the truth and offer nothing substantial in its place.
I think your humour is kind of lost on some of the posters here , Slim.
I'm starting to understand why he uses a fecal stain for his avatar!!!!
I reckon it is an ancient map of the South West of Scotland , going back to Hadrians wall days. Compare and contrast:
1. apostates are divided among themselves and have nothing better to offer.
2. most left because they can't reach the high moral standards of jehovah's witnesses.. .
3. all apostates can do is tear down the truth and offer nothing substantial in its place.
Hey - don't slag off Slim! He's a good guy!
I presume he is talking about the overwhelming perception of "apostates" among JWs. Whenever I speak to any JW about those who left the truth over "issues" (rather than DFd for various "sins") , they ALWAYS describe them some or all of the following phrases - delete as applicable - "He was always a bit full of himself" , "I never really liked her - if she was chocolate , she would have eaten herself" and "He was always a bit of a nutter." There is invariably reference to existence of facial hair (in both male and female cases) as evidence that the person "always had a bit of an attitude" or "had a chip on his shoulder".
I've also lost count over the number of times someone has described apostates as "those who stand outside the assemblies with placards" - so I suspect that this activity is probably as off putting and self-defeating in its own way as the JW preaching activity.
I'll be honest - I had the same views about ex-witnesses myself , until I started to do a bit of research and realised that you were actually fairly normal human beings - well , in some cases , anyway. And some are actually clean shaven!
at our "special assembly day," they interviewed an elderly "sister" in her 70's.
she is the wife of a longtime circuit overseer who is of a similar age, but in very poor health.
a couple years ago he retired into our circuit and is being entirely supported by contributions from people in our circuit, living in one of those connected-to-the-kh apartment arrangements.
I suspect that the CO himself would probably not put as positive a slant on the WTS changes as evidence of God's backing. The CO's wife see the "black box" - the CO has direct experience of the cogs moving inside. Many (in private) are very candid about the workings of the Org.
when i was a kid, my parents (strong in the truth: father elder, mother regular pioneer) encouraged me to read.
in reality, they could hardly have held me back; i come from a long line of bookworms, including my father.
books were like water.
I enjoyed the Hardy boys and Nancy Drew books when I was a kid (though my Dad always deliberately misnamed them the Nancy Boys and Hardy Drew stories - used to annoy me , that! )
every once in a while i hear a jw say "if i hadn't been raised in the truth, i never would have come into the truth.
" have you ever heard that?
wishful thinking?
I've said this many times. So have many of my "brought up in the truth" friends (though privately). The suggested reasons:
- Wishful thinking?
- A tacit admission that either the message is unpalateable for the average person, or the preaching methods are inefficient?
- A statement that they don't really believe it's the truth, but they're stuck now?
Probably a combination of all three , but common sense and logistics mean that the odds would have been astronomic for me to have been contacted and converted as a non-witness adult , when only 0.25% of people are witnesses (and most of them are 2nd / 3rd generation.) As a young(ish) person living in a basically unreligious and godless society , I cannot conceive of any circumstances where I would have had any interest in any religion , other than a token membership to a "lite religion" like the Anglicans or Catholics.
This has been an issue that has puzzled me for many years. JWs (and , in fairness , many other Christian religions) believe that people become worshippers because God "draws" those who have the right heart condition. He looks at people intimately and individually and every person is accountable. If this was true , you would expect a reasonably uniform spread of witnesses throughout the whole earth , and you would expect that the percentage of witnesses children who become witnesses would be the same for the children of all faiths (and none). Yet both these factors (place of birth and parents religious affilliation) are clearly the overwhelming factors in determining the religion of the child.
jws have their own terminology.
it's a characteristic of a cult.
here's a few: "new system", the friends" and the "body".......can you think of more?
JWs have their own terminology. It's a characteristic of a cult.
OOh - that's a bit harsh , isn't it Minimus? Most organisations have their own jargon , religious or secular. The IT people in the company I work for have a completely different language. JWs are no different in this respect. Maybe you should get a job on the writing committee - "I say A , therefore B applies".
http://jehovah.to/glos/index.html has the most comprehensive listing of JW terminology.
I assume the expression "past / present / future truth" has now been discontinued - haven't seen it recently (though still in a couple of JW songs). The adjective "relate" (as in "let's see how this scripture relates to the principle) is almost compulsory nowadays.
i wrote this to someone else, but i think this demonstrates perfectly why i was outraged when i first found out that jehovah's witnesses do not teach that jesus is the mediator for all mankind.
it is true that they possess a different doctrine entirely, but to me the outrageous thing was that they do not actively teach any doctrine regarding jesus mediatorship.
this thread presents indisputable proof of that fact.. in my opinion, it is very important to remember that religions do not tell you the harshest doctrines or the most difficult doctrines to accept during the initial indoctrination phase.. do you have a copy of reasoning from the scriptures?
I asked my wife if she knew that Jesus wasn't the mediator of the Great Crowd & she said "Of course - all witnesses know that." , so it doesn't appear to be exactly a hidden teaching. I guess that JWs are more focused on Jesus as a ransom for their sins rather than a mediator.
just spoke with the mayor of our town about a notice in this mornings paper, re the jws are applying to build a hall in our community,,,,,,,,, would anyone care to comment on what they would say at this meeting?
i mentioned to him that it is a cult and i do not want it in our town.
he admitted he didnt know much about the jws and their beliefs and i told him about the abuse and actions being handled by the elders and not the police and also the non government views.
I mentioned to him that it is a cult and I do not want it in our town.
Your opinion (which is subjective) would not be sufficient grounds for preventing the building. The planning authorities in democratic countries do not take a theological view when permitting or blocking religious building projects , otherwise not a single church , mosque or synagogue would ever be built , as someone would object on religious grounds. On what planning grounds (eg access problems , amenity) do you wish to oppose the building project?
i know alot of people might be offended by this question but i think it is a good question to ask.
born-agains are always pointing the cult finger at jw's, mormons, moonies, 7-day adventists, oneness pentacostals, armstrong, etc; but could they themselves be a cult?
as the old saying goes "it takes one to know one"
While there is no central authority , there usually is a "pastor" who directs & teaches his flock , so the central authority is usually devolved to a parish level. When some disagree with this "leader" , they usually split and form their own group , as evidenced by the numerous "Christian fellowships" , "Assemblies of God" , Pentecostal , Evangelical and similar groups , many of whom refuse to speak or have dealings with each other.
A few years ago , I was involved in brokering a complicated property dispute when a group of "born agains" fractured into three groups under different "leaders" and fought over property rights. We were unable to appeal to the authority of any central pastoral legislative body as none existed that all three groups recognised. None would liase or discuss the matters directly, so the company I worked for organised proximity meetings and eventually we got a measure of agreement.
The best (though perhaps harsh) description I have heard , as used by an old friend of mine , is to describe "born again" style groups as "disorganised cults" (careful how you say that! ).
if we imagined for one moment that the majority of youths get baptized, then the july 1, 2006 wt paints a very different picture.
there must be a serious problem in the organization for the society to write so strong an article.
july 1, 2006 wt youths, make it your choice to serve jehovah.
I don't see anything obviously new in this article or even any new emphasis - it is basically a cut and paste job every 5 years or so for every new generation of youths. I recall similar articles when I was a teenager (always a bit embarrassing...).
“Which particular form of full-time service appeals to you?”. They do not even give the JW youth a choice in the matter. It is automatically expected that once a JW youth finishes high school they will pioneer or enter Bethel service.
An "assumptive either / or close" as it is known in sales. Using the either or strategy is employed by asking the prospect to make a choice of one of two alternatives, where both of them would indicate their positive decision. For example if the salesperson asked “have you decided which colour you prefer, will you be choosing the red one or the green one?”.
