david_10

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Posts by david_10

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  63

  About Daniel Fitzwater-Exposed on Dateline

  by LFitzwater in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  this is a very long story that i will try to condense.

  it will still probably be too long.

  life is good for us now that we know the real truth.

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  david_10

  Laurie-----Thanks for sharing your story. Your courage and fortitude are inspiring. David
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  2

  Dateline: my brother's experience at the meeting

  by david_10 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  like everyone, i've anxiously anticipated the dateline show, and i wasn't a bit disappointed by what they chose to include.

  some may have been a little upset by the length, but a 30 minute segment in prime time was fantastic.

  it was very factual and unbiased----and powerful.

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  david_10

  Like everyone, I've anxiously anticipated the Dateline show, and I wasn't a bit disappointed by what they chose to include. Some may have been a little upset by the length, but a 30 minute segment in prime time was fantastic. It was very factual and unbiased----and powerful. My wife was fighting back the tears. My brother, who is still active (although barely hanging on), was 10 minutes late to his Tuesday Book Study because he stayed home to watch it. In spite of the build up I had been giving him, he was stunned. His wife, who has just recently resigned as a regular pioneer, was visibly shaken, almost crying. At the Book Study, the elder who conducts it was also a little late and had watched the program. My brother said he had an odd green color, probably from nausea, and conducted the study like he was shell-shocked. The group was very subdued and quiet. After the meeting, they conferred privately for a few minutes and the elder just couldn't believe what he had seen. However, he didn't express any disagreement over any of the material. My guess is that he started to remember all the committee meetings that he has no doubt sat in on about this issue and how he had thought he was dealing with an isolated case here and there, and it hit him like a ton of bricks: it's not an isolated case here and there. It permeates the organization. My brother had taped it, and after the meeting, a regular pioneer sister who they are good friends with, wanted to watch it. And so she went over to their house(on the QT, of course) for a veiwing session. The sister was moved to tears. So it doesn't look like the rank and file are heeding the Society's directive to stay away from this wicked apostacy.

  Oh, yes, that program is going to have a powerful and far-reaching effects, and you can be sure that, right now, the only thing on the Society's collective mind is damage control. They've got their work cut out for them.

  Thanks to Bill,Barbara,Silentlambs,Dateline and everyone else who brought all this out.

  David
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  24

  Have your prayers changed?

  by eyeslice in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  this is a sort of follow up to "jesus- ignored, forgotten & unemployed at wts" posted by metatron.. it strikes me, that since i have re-appraised many of my religious views that my prayers have changed significantly.

  and whilst i am still an active jw, i have wondered whether my family has noticed, though they have not said anything so far.. jws prayers are not only very stereotyped (despite what jesus admonition about not using the same words, or by extension the same thoughts, over and over again) but also extremely introverted towards the watchtower society.. for example, a typical congregation prayer will include the following thoughts;.

  1. bless our congregation.

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  david_10

  Have your prayers changed?

  Yep. They've stopped altogether.

  David
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  32

  Post Dateline Defense

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  here's what i'm hearing:.

  the dateline show is beating a dead horse brought up by malcontents.. it brings up a dead issue because the society is sending out.

  letters in child abuse cases to go to the police - in individual.

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  david_10

  I swear, I've got to stop reading Farkel's posts: "Dipfuck" is emerging as the most common word in my vocabulary. It's not always socially appropriate, but it slips out before I can think about it.

  Anyway, I have to agree with Bendrr on this, at least to some extent. The abuse issue is the dirty little secret that plagues every congregation that I've ever been in or had any knowledge of. As a 13 year old boy, I was abused by a very prominent elder. Both of my brothers were abused by brothers in the congregation. Every kid that I grew up with was victimized in one way or another. And this was just in one congregation; multiply that by the 30,000 worldwide, and the situation is monstrous. Usually,the parents eventually found out and the perpetrator was run off and, in a couple of cases that come to mind, was disfellowshipped. But other than that, it was always swept under the rug. Only in one very sad case involving an 8 year old girl, was the abuser (an elder) taken to the authorities and given jail time. In the case of the elder who molested me, nothing was done to him until around 8 years later when he was disfellowshipped for making homosexual advances on his 19 year old son-in-law. How sick is that?

  And now, it looks like the dam is breaking and they can't stand there with their fingers in the cracks for much longer. People who were abused as children and assured that it was only a fluke are going to see just how used they were. Parents of victims: ditto. People are going to see that the "spiritual paradise" is a cesspool, and they are going to have face this. Sure, there are a lot of hard core life-ers who will never allow themselves to think (and one of those is the aforementioned 8 year old girl, now a beautiful 40-something woman, never married, wonder why), but many are going to be forced to come to grips with a huge problem that, percentage-wise, probably exceeds what goes on in the Catholic church. I think that the Dateline program is going to have huge effect and very far-reaching consequences for the Society. A lot more court cases, with the Society even losing or settling a few that they might have been able to salvage. A higher-than-average rate of defections. Elders who are led to believe that they are dealing with isolated cases in their congregations are going to realize that it's a world-wide epidemic . People who are studying are going to walk away. The youth exodus will escalate. Like Bendrr, maybe I'm being a little too optimistic, but I think the Society is going to be dealt a major blow. Time will tell.

  David
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  36

  How much longer?

  by JeffT in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i had this thought while reading the co visit thread, and decided to make it a separate topic.. how much longer can they keep beating the slaves before there is a rebellion?

  it is obvious that the trickle of people that are leaving is growing, and growing enough to make them worried.

  at some point it may become a flood.

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  david_10

  I don't think that the society is going to topple anytime soon, but there is no denying that that they have their work cut out for them. The kids are leaving, the money isn't coming in like it used to, the force of the internet is getting stronger every day.....it all adds up and the GB is feeling the heat. But still, they have assets totaling in the billions, and that can buy a lot of time. But for the life of me, one thing that I can't figure out what they're going to do about is the 1914 problem. In another 15 years or so, it's going to be obvious to everyone that their cornerstone teaching has been a huge mistake, and I don't see any way of explaining it away. With 1799, 1925, 1975 they ignored it and just stopped talking about it and everyone gradually forgot. But I don't think that they can get away with that strategy in this situation. What are they going to do? Comment AlanF, dmouse, anyone....?

  David
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  25

  Look at my beautiful mom!!!

  by bluesapphire in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  now if this works, you will see how beautiful she is inside and out!!.

  btw, she posts here as yadira angelini.

  ps, if you like her you should see me

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  david_10

  hubba hubba!

  David
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  59

  I'm Not Effective Here

  by Farkel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i know this and i've known this for a pretty long time.. sorry to youse who want to receive a different message than what i offer.

  you will get what you want from those who give you what you want.

  i have no problem with that.. there is a place for me to play.

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  david_10

  Hey Farkel----- What do you mean you're "not effective?" I think you're one of the best posters around here. I always look forward to reading you. Snap out of it.

  David

  PS----- What pieces are you working on?
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  39

  My Husband Died One Year Ago Today

  by Dutchie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  after eighteen years of marriage, my husband passed away last year of a terminal liver disease.

  today is the aniversary of his death.

  he died on april 22, 2001 and he was the love of my life.

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  david_10

  Sometimes I think we forget that behind the posts, there are real people with hardships and joys, struggles and triumphs. Dutchie, you have reminded us of that. I'm so sorry for your loss-----think of him often, and enjoy your life and your children. Thank you for sharing.

  David
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  27

  The collapse of the WBTS? - I don't think so.

  by dmouse in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do we apostates fall into the same trap as jehovahs witnesses when it comes to blinding ourselves to the truth?.

  how often have i confronted jws with overwhelming evidence that the so called signs of the times are simply not being fulfilled in our day only for them to bring up some barely relevant snippet of information, which, to them, shoots my argument down in flames?

  it is incredible how jws can ignore the camel of evidence that contradicts what they believe and then exult over the gnat of evidence that supports their view.

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  david_10

  dmouse-----You have brought up some very thought-provoking ideas. I looked at your profile, and it shows that you have attended university and gotten your degree. You're obviously quite intelligent and your post shows it. I agree with everything that you brought out and it has always been my belief that, in spite of the wishful thinking, the Society is alive and well and they aren't going anyplace for a while. However, there are two developing trends that may have a detrimental effect on their future growth plans: 1) the youth aren't staying with it, and 2) the money isn't rolling in like it used to. Combine this with the internet constantly snapping at their heels, and I think that you've got an organization that's definitely in trouble. But, as you brought out, they have survived some pretty devastating blows in the past and somehow they manage to answer the bell for another round. One crises that you didn't bring up was the shake-up at Bethel in 1980 and the resulting departure of Ray Franz. When he wrote his books and exposed the Society's very dirty laundry for the whole world to see, I would have thought that that would put the brakes on their growth. Instead, the organization has grown from 4 million to 6 million in the 20 years since all that happened. Pretty impressive, I would say.
  
  But still-------the kids are leaving and the money supply is drying up. They will HAVE to fix these problems, or they are in deep trouble. Time will tell.............

  David
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  20

  Need insider info on this past wk's mtg!

  by nativenyr23 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  ok. just read the thread on the "special talk" today and how they mentioned apostates.. well, that explains why i had such a painful conversation today with my sister-in-law.

  she called to let me know that she and her mother had reached a painful decision today....to abide by the shunning rule.

  up until today, we had a great relationship....everything was fine.

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  david_10

  Hi Diana. I haven't heard anything about the special talk, but others on the board will clue us in. I'm sure sorry to hear about the family problem that's developed because of it. In my opinion, I don't think that retaliating or fighting back in any way will help and it would probably be very counter productive. If you were to put flyers on cars at the Kingdom Hall or something, it would only convince them that Jehovah's arrangement is a protection and is the best way after all. No one would ever speak to you again. However, if you just ride it out and act natural, maybe it will blow over in a while and your family will loosen up a little. I really feel for you-----good luck.

  David