thecarpenter

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Posts by thecarpenter

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  14

  I'm Alive...

  by OpenFireGlass in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  .. but, unfortunatly, i was to busy this week to take any pictures....

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  thecarpenter

  Alright, I found a openfireglass smiley, here you go...

  
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  24

  Jehovah Witnesses are not brainwashed...

  by thecarpenter in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i am currently reading steve hassan's book on combating cult mind control and i came across a very interesting point about the difference between brainwashing and mind control.

  brainwashing is a coercive type of control in which a idea is forced on you with little choice.

  people who are brainwashed know they are being indoctrinated; their freedom is cut off.

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  thecarpenter

  Loruhamah

  I started researching on the internet about 2 years ago. The society has been very strong about not looking on the internet because of apostate lies. Then they upgraded to apostate half truths. the point is that they don't want any critical information about them known. They have done a very good job suppressing their history from the rank and file which is very typical of cult-like groups. That's why the internet is a anathema to them as well as other cult-like groups like the Mormons, Scientology, Moonies, etc... Once you realized what they have done, the information control, emotional control, etc.. they have over you starts to fade. The more research you do, the weaker their grip becomes. Good for you for checking them out.

  SirNose586

  whenever I would see the words "Jehovah's Witnesses" or anything negative about the dubs, my face would become quite warm. It was a curious mixture of feeling indignant, embarrassed, and nervous, all at once

  I would feel mostly fear that somehow the article may be right, I knew deep down that I wasn't objective enough and my research deep enough when I initially checked out the jdubs. I also had my own long lingering doubts that I suppressed.

  anewme

  I came home and determined I was not going to continue to live in the poverty we endured. I would get a part time job! AND I WOULD WORK OUT AND LOSE WEIGHT AND GET INTO SHAPE! I would grab life by the horns and have what I wanted.

  This desire for self improvement was a motivating factor for me as well. Stephen Covey's book 'Seven habits of highly effective people' helped my big time to take the steps to improve myself. Interestingly, the societies counsel was quite counterproductive:

  Wait for the new system, don't waste time pursuing a highly paid job...don't worry about exercise or diet, people focus too much about these things; get your exercise walking from door to door (walking is the best exercise you know); Don't read self-help books, it might stumble you...

  jgnat

  I wish I was as sensible as you. They use "You should..." and similar expressions a lot. This is how they use guilt to exert emotional control over you. It's not based on good judgment but rather what you can do to further their objective. You are left feeling like if you were really devoted, you would be doing more. I remember one CO mentioning how some people were planning to enter the pioneer work when they retire. He commended their goals but then proceeded to compare that goal with offering lame sacrifices to Jehovah. If we were really spiritual, we would give Jehovah your youth and not wait until we get old. How is that for guilt infliction.
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  1

  See 'The Gumby Movie' at a theatre near you

  by thecarpenter in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  .

  now isn't this a hoot, click on the link.

  the gumby movie

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  thecarpenter

  Now isn't this a hoot, click on the link

  The Gumby Movie
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  24

  Jehovah Witnesses are not brainwashed...

  by thecarpenter in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i am currently reading steve hassan's book on combating cult mind control and i came across a very interesting point about the difference between brainwashing and mind control.

  brainwashing is a coercive type of control in which a idea is forced on you with little choice.

  people who are brainwashed know they are being indoctrinated; their freedom is cut off.

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  thecarpenter

  It is interesting to examine the control the organization had on many of us (and to some point, still has on some of us). Many times I can see the fear in posters when the elders come calling. To be fair, not everyone is as deeply affected by the societies controls as others. I remember a few months ago when I picked up Raymond Franz's book 'Crisis of Conscience", my hands were shaking. (how that for fear based emotional control ).

  Glad to be out of the bOrg and listening to rock band like guns n' roses
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  23

  How being a JW affected me as a person

  by keo15929 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  not long ago i bet no one from this site would have been able to stand me for 2 seconds.

  i was one of the most fiercest jws of all time.

  i'd argue until i was blue in the face and i was darn good at it to.

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  thecarpenter

  Welcome about keo, enjoy your say and post often
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  24

  Jehovah Witnesses are not brainwashed...

  by thecarpenter in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i am currently reading steve hassan's book on combating cult mind control and i came across a very interesting point about the difference between brainwashing and mind control.

  brainwashing is a coercive type of control in which a idea is forced on you with little choice.

  people who are brainwashed know they are being indoctrinated; their freedom is cut off.

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  thecarpenter

  I am currently reading Steve Hassan's book on combating cult mind control and I came across a very interesting point about the difference between brainwashing and mind control.

  Brainwashing is a coercive type of control in which a idea is forced on you with little choice. People who are brainwashed know they are being indoctrinated; their freedom is cut off. Although someone may be forced to accept a idea through physical abuse and fear induced by their jailers, when they are set free, they can usually discard the beliefs forced on them in short order.

  Mind Control is more subtle and sophisticated in that the victim is many times unaware that they are being influenced by a perpetrator. In fact, the victim responds positively to what is done to him.

  What I found so interesting is that the methods for mind control can be subtle and explained away or rationalized but when you are aware of what the signs are, then it is obvious.

  Steve Hassan listed four things to look for in mind control (this is a brief summation)-

  1. Behavior control - regulation of the individual physical reality (ex: rigid schedule for their members... there is always something to do whether it be indoctrination activities or rituals) A members actions are constantly reinforced by approval or disapproval by the leaders

  2. Thought control - indoctrinating members thoroughly with group doctrine, new language system or loaded words and clichés, and thought-stopping techniques to keep their mind centered (members don't need to think for themselves, the group doctrine has all the answers; they also learn to block out any information which is critical of the group)

  3. Emotional control - attempts to manipulate and narrow the range of a person's feelings. Guilt is probably the single most important emotional lever for producing conformity and compliance. Members are conditioned to always blame themselves so that they respond gratefully whenever a leader points out one of their shortcomings. The second tool cults use is fear. This is used two ways. First is the creation of an outside enemy who is persecuting you: Satan is trying to get you, your friends and family is trying to mislead you, psychiatrist try to twist you, etc.. The second way fear is used is the terror of discovery and punishment of by the leaders. Loyalty and devotion are the most highly respected emotions. Confession and phobia indoctrination are also powerful tools in emotional control.

  4. Information control - Cult generated propaganda or material is pushed on the members and they are constantly encouraged to absorb this type of material. Anything or anyone critical of the group especially former members is shunned. As one rises in the cult, inner

  When I was reading this material, I realized that I was unaware of these types of influences being used on me. The thing that appealed to me in the beginning when I first started associating with the witnesses was the way the bible was used so constantly and in a convincing way. They seemed to have answers to everything in life and although I wasn't convinced on everything they taught, I figured it was close enough. Also another thing that appealed to me was the affection I saw in the congregation amongst the brothers and sisters and perhaps the attention I was getting, it was very alluring (love bombing). Of course, not everyone was that way but there is enough of it to get me to join up. It was only after joining up that I started to have serious questions about the 'truth' that these mind control techniques started kinking in. I really believe that if I had access to the information I found on the internet 20 years ago, I would not have joined the witnesses. The emotional control this group held on me was quite strong. Eventually it was my willingness to face my fears and really investigate the society, come what may, that helped me to break the mind control the society had on me. I look back at my experience and get a little angry that I allowed myself to be so easily manipulated.

  Were you folks aware of the mind control techniques being used on you and what finally made you open your eyes?
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  19

  IT'S OVER - I'M INCONSOLABLE

  by tijkmo in

  1. social
  2. relationships

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  the west wing...may have finished in the u.s. before this but it has just finished in the u.k.... in the history of television there has never been a better programme

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  thecarpenter

  Well, there is alway 24, good ole jack bauer, saving the US from terrorist.
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  46

  My dad died....

  by crazyblondeb in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  since i consider most of you family, i guess i need to unload.

  my dad died.

  i found out by looking under the obituaries online.

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  thecarpenter

  Sorry for your loss, hang in there, things will get better... it always does.
  
  Sweetheart, you also have to learn to forgive yourself, we all do things we regret. Burdening ourselves with too much guilt is destructive and doesn't make you a better person. Learning from ourmistakes and moving on to become a better person does.
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  175

  The facts on crucifixion, stauros, and the "torture stake"

  by Leolaia in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  finally, i will look at biblical and patristic evidence bearing on the crucifixion of jesus in particular.

  we need to examine the earliest known descriptions of the kind of crucifixion adopted by the romans and the specific terms they used to refer to it.

  apparently the society believes that crux still meant "stake" in the second century a.d., when tacitus composed his annals.

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  thecarpenter

  here is interesting paper by a Joseph Zias, Curator of Archaeology based on historical and medical research , society actually based part of a watchtower article on this guy but left out significant details

  see the W87 8/15 'Where Were His Legs'

  http://www.centuryone.org/crucifixion2.html

  Very interesting reading
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  24

  I just discovered Guns n' Roses

  by thecarpenter in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

  i just discovered how good guns n' roses are.

  i was listening to a bunch of their songs and i can't believe they wrote so many good songs.

  i was a quite a head banger before i became a witness and after joining i avoided a lot of heavy metal rock and a lot of worldly music in general.

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  thecarpenter

  
  Is that anyway to talk to a nice witness boy???
  Jehovah is going to strike you down you poztate bastard!