Hi Dune,
Department of Defense? (I had to look this up!) I'm sure that would be a very important job :) I hope you get it!
Zico
Posts by Zico
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5Talented Witnesses
by Zico indid anyone know any witnesses who were really talented at something and gave it up in order to 'put jehovah first'?
i find it really sad that the watchtower society can restrict such talented people from fulfilling their dreams in order to chase those empty promises of a paradise earth, in a similar way that they stop intelligent people from going on to higher education.
in my congregation there is a really skilled football (soccer) player.
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Zico
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1380
The Gentiles Times Reconsidered--Again but this Time By Using the Bible
by thirdwitness inthink about this: if seven times mean only 7 years then daniel could have simply said 7 years.
why does daniel specifically use the word 'times' rather than years?
as we have already shown daniel used the word for 7 times instead of 7 years.
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Zico
I've never understood how the Noah's ark story was fair if everyone's salvation was dependant on Noah's preaching work. Supposedly, it had never rained EVER. Even if he managed to preach to everyone on the Earth, I can't say I'm surprised that nobody listened to some old man who told everyone that the sky would fall on them and kill them all if they did not listen to him and help him build the Ark.
Similar to the JW's preaching work. I can see why many 'worldly' people would find it farfetched to believe that Jehovah would kill billions of people and turn the world into a perfect paradise. It doesn't seem very fair to kill everyone because they'd find such a crazy teaching hard to believe. -
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Talented Witnesses
by Zico indid anyone know any witnesses who were really talented at something and gave it up in order to 'put jehovah first'?
i find it really sad that the watchtower society can restrict such talented people from fulfilling their dreams in order to chase those empty promises of a paradise earth, in a similar way that they stop intelligent people from going on to higher education.
in my congregation there is a really skilled football (soccer) player.
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Zico
Did anyone know any Witnesses who were really talented at something and gave it up in order to 'put Jehovah first'? I find it really sad that the Watchtower Society can restrict such talented people from fulfilling their dreams in order to chase those empty promises of a Paradise Earth, in a similar way that they stop intelligent people from going on to higher education.
In my Congregation there is a really skilled football (soccer) player. He was considered a big deal among professional youth coaches, he'd been courted by a lot of big teams, most notably Man Utd and Tottenham. It was hard for him to be offered the potential to fulfill his dreams by pro clubs and have to turn them down in order to 'pursue spiritual goals', especially since he was a Tottenham supporter, but he thought it was the right thing to do. In the local leagues he had consistently been the highest goal scorer for many years, despite being younger than most of the players in his league. Until the elders stopped him from playing, as it involved 'worldly association' and 'competition'. Nothing is ever good enough for them is it? He turns down potential professional contracts, and rather than praise him, they come out and say 'Well, you're still playing in the amateur leagues...' He really is brilliant, I've played against him, and I just can't get near him. I've also watched him when he played in his amateur league, and he always manages to stand out among the rest.
I also knew of another guy who had been offered a recording contract for his band. He turned it down. He was considered very talented though, and he'd even been invited to the Welsh Music Awards and sat near some big names like Stereophonics, and Manic Street Preachers. After he turned down the offer of a contract, the recording company told him that if it was because he didn't like his band, they'd get him a new one, they were so desperate to sign him. He still refused. He was so guttered, he couldn't lose to another song for 2 years. (Except the kingdom songs!)
I just find all that so, so sad. Ok, there's never a guarantee that they would have made it big, but they had potential, and they weren't even allowed the chance to see what they could do.
Did anyone else know Witnesses like this? -
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Does anyone really have a chaperone when out with the opposite sex?
by WingCommander insomehow, i seriously doubt it.
it was spoken about when i was growing up that that was supposed to be the "loving arrangement", but i never heard, saw, or did it myself, nor did anyone else.
since i wasn't allowed out of the house, much less date until i was 16, it wasn't really an issue for me anyway.
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Zico
In our Congregation they insist on chaperones. Brothers and sisters who have been spotted without them have been spoken to by elders. It's a very frustrating rule.
And it has NO scriptural backing. -
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Problem with an elder
by Zico ini have a friend in my congregation.
he's completely indoctrinated, and genuinely believes everything the organisation teaches, but he's still a good person, and he stands up for things when he knows somethings wrong.
as you can imagine, this often causes problems, and there is an arrogant elder who he has had many run ins with in the past.
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Zico
Hi Forscher - I'm not from America. I think because I don't use IE I can't update my profile. (I'm on a Mac)
Anyway, some good news, I just spoke to my friend. He spoke to an elder tonight, apparently the elders have discussed it and have decided not to have a judicial committee, but they still want to speak to him, and would like to talk to him after the Sunday meeting.
The elder didn't go into much detail, but his take on it was that his uncle had been pushing for a judicial committee. However, as my friend asked for the charges in writing, he guessed that they simply did not have enough to take it anywhere near as far as a judicial committee! It's still an issue, and he is still going to be spoken to, but it certainly could be worse.
He did come out with an interesting quote though, and I decided not to correct it... He said 'nothing bad will happen to me, because Jehovah will not allow it.'
Yeah, right... -
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Problem with an elder
by Zico ini have a friend in my congregation.
he's completely indoctrinated, and genuinely believes everything the organisation teaches, but he's still a good person, and he stands up for things when he knows somethings wrong.
as you can imagine, this often causes problems, and there is an arrogant elder who he has had many run ins with in the past.
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Zico
Finally-Free - That would be quality! I can't see him going for this though! He's recording the whole thing anyway, so he has to remain as respectful as he can.
jgnat - I have to be careful, because I don't want my friend to know I'm an 'apostate' yet. I need to do it subtly. As I said before, he's completely indoctrinated, and he's one of these people who thinks that shunning people is love. Though this situation is helping him to see the light. A few months ago I wouldn't have been able to say ANYTHING against his beloved Org, the fact that I could tell him that judicial committees are unscriptual, and that he didn't argue is really good progress! When all this is over, I'm hoping that I can slowly discuss other issues with him, and after his experience I'd hope he'll think twice about talking to the elders about any concern.
Next time he says 'Oh well' though, I will definitely ask 'What would Jesus do?' Thanks for that suggestion! -
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Problem with an elder
by Zico ini have a friend in my congregation.
he's completely indoctrinated, and genuinely believes everything the organisation teaches, but he's still a good person, and he stands up for things when he knows somethings wrong.
as you can imagine, this often causes problems, and there is an arrogant elder who he has had many run ins with in the past.
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Zico
Mama, The rule is that you cannot serve alcohol unless someone 'responsible' is present. The elder has said that responsible means anyone who is an elder. He is using it to have something else at his nephew. My friend knew this was nonsense, and pointed it out to him, so the elder has changed his tune and is now attacking him on other grounds.
The nephew invited him to the party! He told him he could come if it made him feel better. He declined, but has denied that he was ever invited. Just one of his lies.
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Judicial committee experiences.
by Zico inrecently ive been doing a lot of research on judicial committees, as my friend is currently going through one, as mentioned here: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/118972/1.ashx
i just posted an update.
one thing ive noticed in my research, is that there is no scriptural support to back up the judicial committee system.
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Zico
Hi Mama! 'Good JW' was meant to be sarcastic! I meant 'Good JW' from the viewpoint of the elders. Good in the sense that the elders have never had a reason to complain about me, and I have always done as I'm told. So it's not really something I'm proud of! I only found this site recently, and this is the first time I've had the courage to fight against something within the Org. But they don't know that I'm helping my friend with his committee, so from their viewpoint, I'm still a 'Good JW' And of course, the elders don't know I post here either!
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Judicial committee experiences.
by Zico inrecently ive been doing a lot of research on judicial committees, as my friend is currently going through one, as mentioned here: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/118972/1.ashx
i just posted an update.
one thing ive noticed in my research, is that there is no scriptural support to back up the judicial committee system.
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Zico
Hi all,
Recently I’ve been doing a lot of research on Judicial committees, as my friend is currently going through one, as mentioned here: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/118972/1.ashx
I Just posted an update.
One thing I’ve noticed in my research, is that there is NO scriptural support to back up the Judicial committee system. I intend to make a post about this in future. Right now though, in order to help my research, I was wondering if anyone would be kind enough to share any judicial committee experiences they have with me? I am a good JW and have never been involved in a Judicial Committee... but I want to get an idea of how they work and what goes on so I can have the best hope of helping my friend deal with the situation, so I would be interested in hearing any experiences which would help me with this.
Thanks!
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Problem with an elder
by Zico ini have a friend in my congregation.
he's completely indoctrinated, and genuinely believes everything the organisation teaches, but he's still a good person, and he stands up for things when he knows somethings wrong.
as you can imagine, this often causes problems, and there is an arrogant elder who he has had many run ins with in the past.
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Zico
Just to update the situation: Originally the elder told my friend that he could not serve alcohol at his party without an elder present. He told my friend that if he went ahead with the event, he would take it to the body of elders and hold a judicial committee. Obviously the elder has no grounds to do this, my friend knew it, and called him up on it, he sought the advice of many elders and phoned Bethel, who said there was no reason why he couldn’t have alcohol at his party. (Nobody who is going to be at the party is really a heavy drinker, it’s not really a big issue, he’s just proving a point)
Due to the approach that was taken by my friend, the elder is now trying to get him on causing divisions in the Congregation, and disobeying authority. The elder said he was just expressing a concern and that his nephew has blown everything out of proportion. A committee has been set up to deal with my friend. One of the elders phoned him up to inform him of this last night. I told him to request a letter from the committee detailing the committee members, the time and place of the meeting, and the charges. The elder he spoke to has agreed to do this, but he did confirm over the phone, that his uncle, the power mad elder, was actually on the Committee! They actually made the prosecutor a judge! Crazy! I have told him that once he receives his letter he should write a letter back to the committee informing them that he is not happy with this choice, and request a change in the committee.
Thankfully, we have a source on the inside! That is, the Uncle’s daughter, who is a bit of a gossip, and is very easy to get information out of! The uncle ALWAYS tells his family everything that goes on in meetings, and this is no different. He has told her EVERYTHING. Whilst she wouldn’t tell her cousin anything, she’s told me everything, and I’ve had no hesitation in betraying her trust and taking it back the information the my friend! A lot of the things that the Uncle is saying are lies. He is lying about the conversations he has had with his nephew and the things that have been said. I bought my friend a tape recorder, as suggested to me in this thread. Now he is going to tape every conversation he has with anyone regarding the situation as well as the actual meeting.
We actually have TWO witnesses who can back up that the elder is lying, the problem is, that there two Witnesses are a married couple in their 80s! Whilst this two people wouldn’t lie to a committee, they’ve not really got their wits about them anymore, and could be easily influenced to saying the wrong things. I have heard that in a committee meeting, when Witnesses are called up, the defendant has to leave the room, and the elders do not have to tell him what was said after? Can anyone confirm this? That's awful if it's true! His whole defence has to be built around these people, so he really needs to know what they are saying, and he needs to defend himself if the elders are trying to influence them. Does anyone know?
On the bright side, I’ve constantly been able to talk to my friend about how corrupt the System is. There is no way that this issue would stand up in a court of law, firstly because the ones judging you are anonymous, not appointed men with pre-conceived ideas (They’ve had a full body of elders meeting about the issues, but of course, only heard the side of the uncle, so will no doubt be siding with him prior to the meeting) secondly, because everything that’s been said is just one word against another, and you can never really know who’s telling the Truth, so they would have to give him the benefit of the doubt. Instead I can see them siding with the elder, as the body of elders are all very close. Unless the old couple can remove all doubt. I’ve also pointed out the lack of scriptural support for the Judicial system. All his responses so far have been like ‘Oh well, what can you do?’ He’s obviously afraid to face the issues, which I can understand, but I’ll keep working on him!
This system is a joke. It completely favours the prosecutor, and judges the defendant before the trial begins. I know without a doubt that he has done nothing wrong, yet he is not only having to defend himself, he is fighting a losing battle!