Posts by Philippus79

24

Do the Brooklyn GB members have bodyguards?

by VM44 in

does anyone know if the gb members in brooklyn have bodyguards?.

if so, how many?

and....do they carry any protective devices or weapons?.

Philippus79

I know GB member Gerrit Loesch quite well.

At least while travelling, he has no bodyguards or assistants with him (if you don't count his wife...)

Phil

80

Doctrinal ramifications of large increase in 2008 memorial partakers?

by yadda yadda 2 in

the nearly 10% increase in partakers at the memorial in the 2008 annual service report is a huge increase.

there were increases in the previous years too.. this massive increase is no doubt attributeable to the 'new light' this year that the calling of the 'heavenly class' was not closed in 1935, as previously taught.

the new understanding this year is that the calling of the 'anointed' class is 'evidently' still open.

Philippus79

There is one "trick" to keep the 144k literal:

They come up with the understanding that not all Christians in the first century were part of the 'annointed class'. Basically there we people called into the Great Crowd also in the first century. After all, not everyone had the gifts of the spirit...

Phil

80

Doctrinal ramifications of large increase in 2008 memorial partakers?

by yadda yadda 2 in

the nearly 10% increase in partakers at the memorial in the 2008 annual service report is a huge increase.

there were increases in the previous years too.. this massive increase is no doubt attributeable to the 'new light' this year that the calling of the 'heavenly class' was not closed in 1935, as previously taught.

the new understanding this year is that the calling of the 'anointed' class is 'evidently' still open.

Philippus79

There is one "trick" to keep the 144k literal:

They come up with the understanding that not all Christians in the first century were part of the 'annointed class'. Basically there we people called into the Great Crowd also in the first century. After all, not everyone had the gifts of the spirit...

Phil

4

C.O.s ??

by tresdecu in

i have not seen or heard anything new about this rumor.

(cos going bye-bye) has anyone out there with lofty connections heard anything about this?.

just curious... td.

Philippus79

I heard it 2nd hand but from a reliable source that GB member Gerrit Loesch stated that there will be no changes in the C.O. / D.O. arrangement. Phil

66

VOTE YOUR "SILVER BULLET" QUESTION

by V in

i'm quizzing all my sources for the ultimate "silver-bullet" question for a jw at your door.

the best questions will be used in a video series on watchtower comments.

the goal is to help people respond to jws.. the question must be direct and designed to open the jw mind, not necessarily to win an argument.. i would prefer to avoid doctrinal debate such as trinity, cross, even thiest/athiest subjects.

Philippus79

Ask them to read and explain John 3:13 from their NWT...

13 Moreover, no man has ascended into heaven but he that descended from heaven, the Son of man.

They will superficially tell you that it means Jesus had a pre-human existence. You say, alright, but do read it again carefully...

If no man has ascended into heaven except the son of man who descended, then the son of man had already ascended before he said this statement. So Jesus, the son of man, had ascended to heaven before he descended as Jesus. But if he had ascended to heaven before he descended as Jesus, then he must have descended as someone else before that ascension in order that he could actually ascend. For it is impossible to ascend into heaven without first descending from heaven. So Jesus had descended from heaven before and then ascended back and then he descended again and made the statement above.

In other words, when Jesus came to preach to the Jews and to give his life for all mankind, this was at least his second visit to us. In other words he had come here before as someone else, before Jesus.

??????????

Phil

9

How much time between GT and Armageddon?

by cameo-d in

i know some people say its 3 1/2 years, but is there any real scriptural proof of this?.

i have heard jws say its "this close" meaning the events are almost simultaneous.

is there any scriptural proof for this?.

Philippus79

According to the "chronological model of the Sanctuary", it is 1335 or even 40² = 1600 (flood squared, the 1600 stadia of Revelation14).

According to Michael & Emmanuel the Great Tribulation starts 9/30 2008 and Jesus comes at Pentecost 2012...

http://timeoftheend2008.blogspot.com/2008/08/chronological-model-of-sanctuary-well.html

Phil

31

POSSIBLE SCANDAL/SHOCKING NEWS(POLITICAL?) IN BRITAIN IN NEXT FEW WEEKS

by badboy in

jw
friends

so it is rumouredon internet.

Philippus79

It is the collapse of the banking system, yes of capitalism as we know it!

7 years after 9/11, the attack on the "World TRADE Centre", global trade is under attack. The Dollar will take down the Pound as well...

5

Enoch - The Son of Man????

by sinis in

is enoch the son of man?

it would seem like it as jesus infers that the son of man may not be him, as he addresses him in the third person.. .

jesus seals his with this verse; verily i say unto you, there shall be some standing here which shall not taste of death, till they see the son of man coming in his kingdom (matthew 16:28).. .

Philippus79

Enoch was Michael

We shall discover that Enoch was non adamic and was temporarily possessed by the angel Michael. We read of Enoch that:

23 So all the days of Enoch amounted to 365 years.
24 And Enoch kept walking with the [true] God. Then he was no more, for God took him (Genesis 5).

So God took him at the end of his life and he was no more. But Paul further informs us:

5 By faith Enoch was transferred so as not to see death, and he was nowhere to be found because God had transferred him; for before his transference he had the witness that he had pleased God well (Hebrews 11).

So when God took him, so that his days ended, he was transferred so as not to see death. Well the only other place he could have been, if his days had ended on this earth, was heaven. So Enoch ascended to heaven, without dying.

Now the question is did God make some kind of exception in the case of Enoch amongst the sons of Adam. Did he decide that he would not apply the death penalty to him because he was such a good chap? Moses answers:

4 The Rock, perfect is his activity,
For all his ways are justice.
A God of faithfulness, with whom there is no injustice;
Righteous and upright is he (Deuteronomy 32).

So he did not break his own justice in the case of Enoch. So if Enoch did not die, then Enoch was not under a death sentence. And if Enoch was not under a death sentence then he was not a son of Adam. And if he was not a son of Adam then he was a son of God. Just like Jesus was. Now we turn to the words of Peter:

21 Then Peter came up and said to him: Lord, how many times is my brother to sin against me and am I to forgive him? Up to 7 times?
22 Jesus said to him: I say to you, not, Up to 7 times, but, Up to 77 times (Matthew 18 NWT).
The Greek Interlinear is:

22 Not I am saying to you until 7 times, but until seventy times seven (Matthew 18 - KI)

The KJV and the GLT translate this verse as above. But this is dodging the issue of whether it is to be understood as:

Seventy times seven times, i.e. 490 times or just 77 times

i.e. or whether a further 'times' is to be understood and a multiplication is to be expected. Nowhere else in the bible in the literal meaning as far as we are aware is there such a multiplication.

No bible translates this as 490 times. Actually the Greek is:

ebdomhkontakiV (seventy times) epta (seven), and the Greek for 7 times is eptakiV.

The Greek for 77 is ebdomhkonta (seventy) epta (seven).

The Greek for 70 lots of 7 times would be:

ebdomhkonta (seventy) eptakiV (7 times) which is 70 lots of 7 times we think.

We can get help from the words of a certain Lamech to his wives:

23 Hear my voice, you wives of Lamech; Give ear to my saying:
A man I have killed for wounding me, Yes, a young man for giving me a blow.
24 If seven times Cain is to be avenged, Then Lamech seventy times and seven (Genesis 4)

So in this case where 7 times is compared to a larger number of times involving 70 and 7, it is 77 times. Now the LXX translation of this, which is a Greek translation of the old testament made for the Greek speaking world about 300 years before Jesus, has:

ebdomhkontakiV (seventy times) epta (seven) for the Hebrew which we translate seventy times and seven.

So that ends that matter and the NWT has got this right. It is 77 times.

Now the great thing to realise at this point is that Jesus was the 77th in line from God through Adam, Seth etc.

14 Yes, the 7th one [in line] from Adam, Enoch, prophesied also regarding them, when he said: Look! Jehovah came with his holy myriads,
15 to execute judgment against all, and to convict all the ungodly concerning all their ungodly deeds that they did in an ungodly way, and concerning all the shocking things that ungodly sinners spoke against him (Jude).

Position The Good line The Bad line
1 Adam Adam
2 Seth Cain
3 Enosh Enoch
4 Kenan Irad
5 Mahalalel Mehujael
6 Jared Methushael
7 Enoch Lamech

Lamech (not Noah's dad but Methushael's son) was the 7th in line from Adam through Cain, the guy who was to be avenged for 7 times. Jude tells us that Enoch was the 7th in line from Adam through Seth. Luke 3 tells us that Jesus was the 77th in line from God through Adam. So Lamech's song is declaring that there seems to be some kind of relationship between the 7th time and the 77th time. But Enoch and Jesus, are related in this way, the one being the 7th time a son in the line is produced and the other being the 77th time. This does not prove that Enoch was Michael but it got us thinking that he might be.

So a comparison was definitely being made in the scriptures between Enoch being the 7th in line from Adam and Jesus being the 77th in line from God. And whereas the vengeance penalty on Cain ended after 7 times, the greater meaning of the vengeance penalty on Lamech ended after 77 generations with the death of Jesus, which was the forgiveness of Adam's sin, the end of Vengeance from God on the sons of Adam.

Consider Peter's words about forgiveness, and we see that there was a forgiveness 77 generations after God in the case of Jesus, but there wasn't any forgiveness 7 generations after Adam in the case of Enoch.

21 Then Peter came up and said to him: Lord, how many times is my brother to sin against me and am I to forgive him? Up to 7 times?
22 Jesus said to him: I say to you, not, Up to 7 times, but, Up to 77 times (Matthew 18).

Now why would the bible make such a comparison? Because Michael/Jesus was Enoch.

57 Therefore the Jews said to him: You are not yet 50 years old, and still you have seen Abraham?
58 Jesus said to them: Most truly I say to you, Before Abraham came into existence, I have been (John 8).

He has been here, that's what the scripture means. He has been here before!!

Basically mankind had killed one of its patriarchs (although Enoch procreated before Michael entered him)! When Jesus said at his death: Father forgive them for they know not what they do, they were killing their own ancestor. This was really something.

However John 8 above only proves that Jesus existed prior to Abraham, it does not prove that he existed as a human prior to Abraham's human existence, although such an interpretation is possible from the words. Now we understand this logically contorted scripture:

13 Moreover, no one has ascended into heaven but the [one] that descended from heaven, the Son of man (John 3).

This requires a clear thinking head. It is saying that the Son of man (Jesus) has descended, and he is the one who has ascended. It is saying that the Son of man has both ascended and descended. But this statement was made at the beginning of Jesus' ministry. So he had ascended before he died. So he must have descended and then ascended before his earthly ministry. So this was at least his second visit to us.

Please also realise that the Hebrew word 'Enoch' means 'one trained up' or 'initiated'. So here was Michael's/Jesus training to be the Messiah!

Phil

10

Interesting calculation for the start of the GT and Christ's return

by Philippus79 in

hi friends!

i found this quite interesting blog which gives evidence that the gt is about to start in autumn 2008 and jesus would return in 2012. at least for those who are still interested in bible chronology and prophecy it might be worth a read.

these guys seem to have no connection to ron weinland or the cog people, looks more like jws/exjws.

Philippus79

lol,

that's why I said 'for those still interested'...gg

10

Interesting calculation for the start of the GT and Christ's return

by Philippus79 in

hi friends!

i found this quite interesting blog which gives evidence that the gt is about to start in autumn 2008 and jesus would return in 2012. at least for those who are still interested in bible chronology and prophecy it might be worth a read.

these guys seem to have no connection to ron weinland or the cog people, looks more like jws/exjws.

Philippus79

Hi friends!

I found this quite interesting blog which gives evidence that the GT is about to start in autumn 2008 and Jesus would return in 2012. At least for those who are still interested in Bible chronology and prophecy it might be worth a read.

These guys seem to have no connection to Ron Weinland or the CoG people, looks more like JWs/ExJws.

http://timeoftheend2008.blogspot.com/2008/08/chronological-model-of-sanctuary-well.html

Phil