DevilsAdvocate_DA

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Posts by DevilsAdvocate_DA

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  29

  Tell Me More About 1975

  by Diner in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi, i'm interested in learning more about 1975 only from a jehovah witnesses.

  i understand it was thought to be the "end of the world" by us jws but it didn't happen.

  nonjws need not comment.

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  DevilsAdvocate_DA

  Diner this is DevilsAdvocate_DA

  I would like to say of all the comments that were given you, I as an oldtimer in this organization, believe that Zev has given you some fine advice. Especially what I have underlined. I have taken the liberty to edit his/her thoughts just a bit.

  Take some time to look a tad deeper my friend. I don't have all the answers, and I dont even know where I will go from here...but belief in Jehovah God, his son Jesus Christ and the Bible (as a whole) are rock solid. Believe in "man" and follow "man" [man=g.b.=wtbts] and you might as well stick a ring in your nose for them to lead you off. And where will they lead you?

  Diner, your first alligence is to the one's ZEV stated -- Jehovah and Jesus. True they are using the organization WBTS to accomplish their aims. But, just like Isarael of old, whom Jehovah used, in time their haughty heads got in their way. Jehovah took action to remove them from his service after their usefulness was need no more. C.E. 70. What Jehovah will do with these haughty men and women (sometime when you are behind the lock doors you come to find out that what come out of GB's mouths is the words of their wives) neither you or I nor anyone else on this board knows what He has in store ( You need to read YouKnows last post over on H20). All I do is sit and wait, sit and wait -- just as they are doing ---- watching the human family as we put on a show.

  1975 was a very hard year for me. I never did believe what was being said. At the time my wife and I had many Bible studies. In fact at one Circuit Assembly of the thirteen person baptized twelve were ones we studied with. The hard time was, the constant effort my wife and I had in down playing the 1975 hysteria. Believe me it was there. But not for us. We could find no Bibical proof for such statements. So we would not let it enter our minds as a safe guard. There were plenty other good things to talk about. Happy to say, all the ones we studied with are still hanging in. The same with the one we have studied with after the 1975 period. We stress getting to know Jehovah, Jesus Christ, God Word the Bible, and individuals in the organization that are compatable with them, but be friendly with all, just like we do with a clerk or cashier as the locate grocery store.

  Diner, I could go on and type twenty or fifty pages on this subject, but of what value, crying over spilled milk is a waste of time, plus it only adds to the waste I caused in the first place. Let it go. Move on with whatever life style you personally want to make you happy. Leave things in Jehovah Gods and Jesus Christ hands and have a life based on Gal. 5:22-23, if you want.

  DA
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  7

  "Survival Kit"

  by DevilsAdvocate_DA in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  "an everyday servival kit".

  toothpick.

  rubber band.

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  DevilsAdvocate_DA

  HappyToBeFree,

  I am happy for you -- Truly.

  I hope the best of everthing will come your way. Life is real and it is not aways easy, as you and I know.

  DA
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  40

  Where do they sit in your hall?

  by ns7 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  what i find bemusing is, if there are any disfellowshipped ones in your hall they have to sit at the back.

  now without getting into the merits/rights/wrongs of whether this should be still acceptable, where do they sit in your hall?

  you see i seem to remember that they would sit on the back row, come in quietly just after the song and prayer and leave at the end just as quick.

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  DevilsAdvocate_DA

  Flowerpetal, you said in you post under "Were do they set in the Kingdom Hall".

  As far as these other stories of some congs not regarding df'd people as persons and not being allowed to contribute money to the hall, that is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard! I'm not arguing that it hasn't happened, but what are some of these elders, etc. thinking???

  I believe you have a learning disabilty or reading handcap. But that's ok. There are millions of us who are in the same boat. It's how you or the one you have appointed to row you boat that counts.

  Let me explain.

  It is apparent that you did not read my post correctly, for whatever the reason.

  Reason #1, I did not say that disfellowshiped people are not persons. Nor did I say the WBTS doesn't accept their monies.

  I have probably been around this organization, WBTS, for longer then you have lived. Just my guess.

  Let me tell you what I have seen since the debacle of 1975.

  I have been in a grocery store, gas station, at parks, etc, etc, and have seen what is called active Jehovah's Witnesses talk to everybody and anything (dogs, squirrels, birds, etc.). But when a what is call a disfellowshiped person approaches the active Jehovah's Witness acts as though they are invisible.

  My point is:

  Point # 1. When these so-called disfellowshiped persons come to the kingdom hall they are treated as though they are invisible, not a person. I believe you should have grasp this point from all the other posters on this subject.

  Point # 2. If these persons that are disfellowshiped are invisible or not a person, why is it that they are counted as one taking a seated space, as though they were a person . Why is it that the WBTS will accept their monies, even checks with their names on, if in fact they are invisible, not a person. In fact many of my fellow witnesses, and I hope you are not one of them, treat these disfellowshiped persons (if we can call them a person), worse then they treat a stray dog.

  So while the letter of the law is one thing it's application is something quite different.

  DA
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  2

  How to say, "I'm sorry".

  by DevilsAdvocate_DA in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  in view of the thoughts for a day or so i believe, not being judgmental, these thoughts may apply.. for all of us:.

  "healing touch".

  apologizing is an esseniual skill that adults need to master by practicing over and over (so do jehovah's witnesses no matter what state in life he/she is to jehovah and jesus christ).

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  DevilsAdvocate_DA

  Battman,

  I agree.

  DA
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  2

  How to say, "I'm sorry".

  by DevilsAdvocate_DA in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  in view of the thoughts for a day or so i believe, not being judgmental, these thoughts may apply.. for all of us:.

  "healing touch".

  apologizing is an esseniual skill that adults need to master by practicing over and over (so do jehovah's witnesses no matter what state in life he/she is to jehovah and jesus christ).

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  DevilsAdvocate_DA

  In view of the thoughts for a day or so I believe, not being judgmental, these thoughts may apply.

  For all of us:

  "Healing Touch"

  Apologizing is an esseniual skill that adults need to master by practicing over and over (so do Jehovah's Witnesses no matter what state in life he/she is to Jehovah and Jesus Christ). It is also important enough to teach children the whys and hows of saying "I'm sorry." Dr. John Taylor, a psychologist explains: "Nobody is perfect in relationships. Apologies add a level of sincerity that is unbeatable." But merely saying "I'm sorry" alone isn't enough. The erring person (all of us) also must make amends by fixing the problem he/she caused, or do the other person(s) a favor to demonstrate his/her desire to rebuild the relationship.

  In addition the person (you and I) also must change the behavior that caused the problem in the first place .i.e. a husband gets mad (angry, dogs get mad) at his wife and angrily throws his wife's favorite vase against the wall, spewing flowers (that he just gave her) and water all over the carpet(that he must clean-up).The husband first must admit that what he did was wrong and apologize for his actions. He also must buy another vase of equal or better value, plus flowers. Then he must tell her that he won't throw things when he's angry, and he must do his best to stick to this new behavior.

  However, each relationship (be whatever) has a limit to the number of apologies that it has to take. Taylor compares a relationshiop to a beautiful peice of wood; Every act that causes hurt in a relationship (be whatever) is represented by a nail pounded into the wood. An apology lifts the nail out, but it leaves a hole. Making amends fills the hole, but the mark is still there. If a person contunues to pound more nails into that piece of wood, even if the nails are pulled out the wood loses it strength and beauty (and we all see the holes and the one who put them there). Some people will apologize but don't want to listen to the other person talk about the hurt he/she caused, said Dr. R. Patterson, family therapist and author. Listening to another person talk about the hurt means we have to face our own guilt. We have to admit to ourselves that we are capable of hurting our spouse and children. In this case our fellow HUMANS in, or as some say, outside the organization. Parents (and fellow humans) need to apologize in front their children (fellow humans), even if it means practicing with another adult (in this case fellow JW Dissussion board). Children need to see that their parents can resolve problems that may have been created by anger, because then anger isn't so scary. Taylor suggests having children write down the steps of making an aplolgy, role play with a parent and refer to their notes if necessary.

  HOW TO APOLOGIZE BY DR. JOHN TAYLOR.

  1. Admit the mistake.
  2.Account for the incident. Tell why you behaved that way.
  3.Acknowledge the pain you're caused.
  4. Apologize for hurting the other person.
  5. Ask for forgiveness. You don't have the right to demand forgiveness.
  6. Affirm the friendship or the relationship. (I want to continue to be your friend. it's important to me)
  7. Make amends. Fix the problem (replace the vase as may be the case) or do the other person a favor if you can't fix the problem.
  8. Adjust your behavior so the problem doesn't happen again.

  DO THE ABOVE ONLY IF YOU MEAN IT.

  DA

  P.S. I have seen this put into practice here on this board and over on H20. I make me, and I believe it is the same with you all, when ones practice this benevolent manners. I just thought we needed a little brushing up.

  P.P.S. Friends don't you believe or feel that IF the WTBTS would put these items into partice, the holes would still be there, but wouldn't it change the hurts some have toward them?
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  6

  Repent and come back to the organization

  by cocolocoii in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  this is for all of you who have left god's spiritual garden(wt), there is not hope without the organization.. all of you are going to be destroyed, including your kids.. so repent in the name of the organization and come back to us.

  why would you like to die and be like manure in the soil.. don't you know that the organization is the only channel of comunication with god.. don't you know that the faithful and discreet slave is inspired by angels.

  yes you are out of the organization because the angels have seen how weaked your hearts has become.. glory to the watch tower.

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  DevilsAdvocate_DA

  Son or Daughter, Cocolocoii.

  In all my years as an active Jehovah's Witness I have never heard such talk (typing) as yours.

  I believe you need to reread your post with Gal. 5:22-23 in mind. I am not judging you, but you are too far out in left field.

  You must truly be a very lonely person, whomever you are. If you are in need of physiotherapy treatment there is probably a good physicist in your neighbor. Personally, I can not handle your case. They call it confict of interest. But you need to get help, please.

  DA

  What I have said, I have said.
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  17

  Just Arrived.....

  by biblexaminer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i am settling in here after a long stay on anoter site.

  well, that's the nice thing with cyberspace.

  you can be in two places at one time.. i see many faithful christians here.

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  DevilsAdvocate_DA

  This Devilish one says, welome.

  Have a good stay.

  By the way there are truly many christians here. Whether some organization want to recongize them or not. Just in hiding, like the 7,000 that did not bend their knees to Baal

  DA
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  54

  You might be a JW if...

  by Seven in

  1. social
  2. humour

  * http://www.serve.com/larryi/mightbe.html

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  DevilsAdvocate_DA

  Girl, you are so right.

  Yes, I remember and went on with my life.

  Somethings I just DO NOT letitems stay with my mind very long. Especially if I see no real reasoning behind it.

  Your thought was one such reasoning.

  DA
• 
  40

  Where do they sit in your hall?

  by ns7 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  what i find bemusing is, if there are any disfellowshipped ones in your hall they have to sit at the back.

  now without getting into the merits/rights/wrongs of whether this should be still acceptable, where do they sit in your hall?

  you see i seem to remember that they would sit on the back row, come in quietly just after the song and prayer and leave at the end just as quick.

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  DevilsAdvocate_DA

  Hi NoJw86,

  I noticed that this is your third post here on this board.

  You probably do not know anything about me, but I would like to say, I agree with your thought, as a whole.

  My question -- WHAT IS THE ANSWER? As an oldtimer as a witnes for my Great God Jehovah and His Son Jesus Christ (notice I did not say as a WBTS member) I find nothing in the Bible to back up the WBTS view on disfellowshiping. I,like you , agree there must be something to control Satan devilish actions. However, I believe, from what I read in Jehovahs' word, that any action taken against my bad reflection against Jehovah should come from individual members of Jehovah's Witnesses. Individual consciences not a body of people.

  For example: If you saw me doing something that was out of harmony of Jehovahs' arrangement. Then you apply Matt 18. If in your eyes, and yours only, because you were the single party involved, (and that is usually the case), if you in your heart can not approve of my action. Then you and you alone can (using the WBTS word) disfellowship me. If someone else finds me out, then it should between him/her and me to work it out.

  Just my thoughts of many years of watching the show with Jehovah and Jesus.

  I would like to add, that this BULL, as has been correctly called, did not raise it's ugly head until the late 70's. I personaly believe it is an attempt to keep control by a few up in the white tower over the masses after the 1975 debacle -- which they have no right to. Try Ted Jaracz for one. The only ones that have the right to control, and I do not look at it as control from them is Jehovah and Jesus. I look at it as mutual respect.

  What I have said, I have said.

  DA
• 
  40

  Where do they sit in your hall?

  by ns7 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  what i find bemusing is, if there are any disfellowshipped ones in your hall they have to sit at the back.

  now without getting into the merits/rights/wrongs of whether this should be still acceptable, where do they sit in your hall?

  you see i seem to remember that they would sit on the back row, come in quietly just after the song and prayer and leave at the end just as quick.

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  DevilsAdvocate_DA

  Waiting,

  Hello,

  Sounds like these guys minds are in the sewer gutter.

  Waiting, this reminds me of a time I was giving a talk at a large gather. The pants I had on had four ways to close. I forgot one. My good wife was trying as well as a few other to tell my about it. I thought they were telling me I was doing a good job. After the meeting the whole gather was talking about my zipper being open. We had the best time in the world laughing about it. As you can see after 30 years I still laugh about it. If I would not have had those white underware on they would never been able to tell. Guess who plays with my zipper before every meeting for the past 30 years.

  Think they need to take another look at Gal. 5:22-3.

  Just my thought.

  DA