Alpheta
JoinedPosts by Alpheta
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14
"Published by Jehovah's Witnesses"
by Nosferatu in"published by jehovah's witnesses".
what the hell is up with this statement?
i've seen it occur a lot since i've been out of the org.
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Alpheta
There is a legal concept from which the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society will not be able to protect itself - it's called "piercing the corporate veil." The bottom line is that the GB can't speak out of both sides of its mouth - it cannot pretend that it does not control the "other" corporations, that it does not control what is printed in the Watchtower and Awake, that it does not control what goes into the books, that it does not control who the DOs, COs and elders, are, etc., when everyone knows damn well they do. The legal department and outside counsel can set up as many shell corporations and sub-structures to try and hide assets and obfuscate control as they wish - all over the world - but in the end, if the suits are filed in the United States Federal District Courts under "diversity" jurisdiction, those suckers are going to be nailed. It's just a matte rof time. The times, they are a-changin' - it's just a matter of time until the first BIG judgment is entered against the WTBTS, et al. As other posters said, it's just a shell game, and not a very good one.
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12
Still beating the flock, sadly.
by Gill ini ran into a jw lady i have known most of my life a couple of weeks ago.. she told me that she had left her non jw abusive husband and that she was still very upset about all that had happened.. the elders had been 'visiting' her.
infact visiting is probably the wrong word and should be replaced with harrassing.. they kept telling her that 'jehovah hates a divorcing!
' she said that they wanted her to go back to her abusive husband as she should not have married a non jw in the first place.
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Alpheta
Perhaps this topic has been discussed so many times before that people don't feel like posting responses, but I'm shocked by this, and probably always will be. Your lady friend should (1) leave and have a safe place (2) institute divorce proceedings immediately (3) punch the a-hole in the mouth and kick him in the nuts for good measure. Then she should do the same to the elders who gave her such bad advice. Geez!
Of course I know the sister probably won't do most of the above. but she should find a save place, leave and get divorced from the jerk. If she is in a jurisdiction that has restraining orders, she should get one against the abusive sob too. But if she cannot, she should still find a safe place and get to it, and not ever go back to where he can find her - and certainly not go back to the Hall where the elders gave her such crappy advice.
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9
JW Numbers
by JWdaughter ini want to look more fully into this if someone else hasn't already.. how many pieces of literature were taken by jws at the hall to 'place', versus how many actually were placed?
we all know there must be a significant difference-it is the only way to explain the piles in the backs of closet, in basements and lining birdcags of jws.
how much of the money given to the 'world wide work goes to building halls, giving to jws who cannot affort literature?
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Alpheta
Good synopsis, Highlander. I would contribute for the magazines and when I was regular in the field service I did place some (but never all), and I never asked for any contributions, so the WTBTS was not getting double-paid for their magazines from me. I was also putting in a lot more than what the magazines were worth, I was putting in $30 a month. If, say, 70% of the JWs are not putting in money at the counter when they pick up their literature every month, and they also are not asking for or receiving contributions in the door to door work (assuming they place, say, 20% of their magazines), it stands to reason that the Society is hurting for money since the donation arrangement was put into place circa 1990 (all in order to avoid paying sales taxes). I know there are threads here on this topic.
Getting back to JW Sister's question, I do not think there is anyway to actually determine the difference between how many magazines are printed and how many are actually placed every month. Assuming the Society is telling the truth about how many magazines it is printing, we cannot assume that the publishers are telling the truth on their field service reports about how many they placed. I've been out over three years now and I still have a cabinet full of old magazines that I am slowly recycling in the newspapers every two weeks! Particularly toward the end I was out and out lying on my field service reports about placements and no one questioned it. Now, I'm not saying that active JWs are lying on their field service reports like I did, but judging from what I've read here, at least some of them are. There is no way, therefore, to really calculate reliable numbers on placements. There are just too many uncertainties and variables.
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23
Can It Get Any Worse????
by liquidsky ini know most people have way worse problems then me but i just need to vent.
i have had the worse 3 months ever!!!.
my husband may be losing his job within the next year.
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Alpheta
Why would anyone ever order anything off e-bay?
This is a joke, right? You could be in Iraq right now. Get some perspective and get a grip, woman.
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11
Are all those "minor prophet" books relevant today?
by becca1 inaccording to the wt, just about everything in the hebrew scrips.
has a "type" and an "architype".
it all applies somehow to the "last days".
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Alpheta
The thing about the so-called "minor" prophets - if you take the time to read them, everything they say could be aptly applied to the WTBTS.
No wonder the Writing Department and Legal Department pick and choose - very carefully - just WHAT parts of the minor prophets are used.
It's a big fricking joke!
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9
JW Numbers
by JWdaughter ini want to look more fully into this if someone else hasn't already.. how many pieces of literature were taken by jws at the hall to 'place', versus how many actually were placed?
we all know there must be a significant difference-it is the only way to explain the piles in the backs of closet, in basements and lining birdcags of jws.
how much of the money given to the 'world wide work goes to building halls, giving to jws who cannot affort literature?
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Alpheta
JWDaughter,
The problem is this: In the United States, which is probably the richest yielding money wise for the WTBTS, there is no obligation to file tax returns or any kind of financial reports with the federal or state governments. The WTBTS is a religion and therefore is exempt from all reporting requirements. Therefore, we truly have NO IDEA how much money, or how little money, is flowing into the New York coffers.
We can DEDUCE this based on prior and current history: First, money inflow from third world countries does not equal cash outflow to support the DOs and COs and build those crappy grass-hut kingdom halls. Second, because of the zero growth/negative growth in most western European countries, there are cash flow problems there. Where is the cash coming from to support the DOs and COs and branches in western Europe?
I have seen on the internet OLD financial reports for the Canadian branch, and OLD financial reports for the English branch. I have not seen any current reports. If I knew where to go to get them, I would get the current financial reports.
A few months ago, I did extensive internet research about the real estate holdings of the WTBTS in New York City and Brooklyn. Recently the Society sold a building for over $200 million. That is just one building. The Society owns much real estate on waterfronts - that means BIG $$$$$$. You can be sure that as needed, the Society will sell off the real estate, one piece at a time, as the intent now is to bunker down in Patterson.
In my opinion, eventually the Society will file Chapter 11 in the United States due to judgments against it won by victims of sexual abuse. Regardless of what the Society may report in their WT and yearbook publications, it is my personal belief that it is in a downhill spiral. It is losing more members than it is recruiting in money-making countries. Without cash flow, a business cannot survive. The New York and Brooklyn real estate will only keep the Society alive for so long, particularly once the plaintiffs start winning the law suits and getting big $$$ judgments against the Society. It is, in my opinion, inevitable. It is just a matter of time.
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Alpheta
I like quick and easy generally, but I have been known to go to lengths. I have my favorites and my guests like them too, served with tossed salad and something light for dessert: cheeseburger casserole; beef burgundy (served with wide egg noodles); filet mignon (served either with baked potatoes or new red potatoes mashed with the skins on); cheeseburger pie (the basic recipe also makes a good breakfast casserole if made with crumbled sausage instead of hamburger); beef valencia; chicken tarragon; chili; tuna casserole. Spaghetti and meatballs, but this takes two days to make the meatballs and let them keep overnight.
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74
WTS Has Lost +35% of Elders in US Since 1994????
by Seeker4 inzack, on another thread, said he heard this figure from the platform at both the 2006 elders' school and his recent pioneer school:.
that there were 93,000 elders in 1994, and less than 60,000 today, in the united states.. i thought these figures deserved their own thread, as they are shocking to me, and to see if anyone else has heard anything similar.. i'll post a link to the other thread as well.
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Alpheta
Quoting from Seeker 4:
BUT, she then said she'd heard of congregations outside the area where entire bodies of elders have been removed. She said, "You know there are corrupt elders, and they are getting rid of them."
This is what I call cutting off your nose to spite your face! Ha ha ha! Just let the WTBTS keep deleting entire bodies of elders. That is SO hilarious!
In the congregation I came from, there were several older sisters who ran things in their own groups with no interference from the elders. Either they didn't have the time and energy to deal with these women or they didn't have the cojones - or both. If the absence not only of willing males but also of ANY male bodies from the congregations continues to grow, there won't be anyone left BUT the sisters to run things. What was that scripture - something about the women are a large army... When I was still in I heard stories about several congregations in Domincan Republic and other places in Central and South America where there wasn't a qualified male to run things, so the sisters do it all. I could sure see that happening here in the USA and in Europe - unless the Society wants to put 8 year old boys in charge.
Really, except for that stupid scripture by Paul that "I do not allow a woman to teach" (yeah, right, and what are the so-called demonstrations then, heh?), WHAT authority does the GB have to say that ONLY men can run things when it is crystal clear that both men and women are annointed and will rule as kings and priests?
Well, whatever. The anecdotal evidence I've read here makes it VERY clear that it's just a matter of time before the entire WTBTS house of cards folds in on itself.
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74
WTS Has Lost +35% of Elders in US Since 1994????
by Seeker4 inzack, on another thread, said he heard this figure from the platform at both the 2006 elders' school and his recent pioneer school:.
that there were 93,000 elders in 1994, and less than 60,000 today, in the united states.. i thought these figures deserved their own thread, as they are shocking to me, and to see if anyone else has heard anything similar.. i'll post a link to the other thread as well.
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Alpheta
Hmmmm, fascinating subject. Before I left in October, 2003, I know personally that my congregation "lost" three elders within a few months; one older brother and his wonderful wife (she was a friend to me when I needed a kindly ear to listen to my "woes") moved to Florida for their retirement; their son, a nice guy but not someone who ever struck me as a "pillar of strength", who shocked everyone in the congregation when he married a woman from South America he met through some kind of Witness internet dating service (!!!!), resigned as an elder before the wedding; and a third, the husband of one of the women who was one of my bible study teachers, was df'd a few weeks before I mailed in my DA letter.
During this time, other than my DAing, I'm not aware that we lost any other members - other than the pioneer sister who was df'd at the same time as Brother ___; so that means there were 3 less elders to do the same amount of work that (not sure of the exact number, I never paid attention to that sort of thing because I never relied on the elders for anything; actually, I wanted them to stay the heck away from me) 8 men did before, for a congregation of about 120 people.
Yep, and there weren't that many younger ones coming up behind. Looking backward now, I think it was because the elders who were in my congregation were basically good guys and they wanted to appoint other good guys too, not just fill the ranks with warm bodies. But by now, perhaps they haven't had any choice. Or maybe the congregation has been halved. I know shortly after I started going to meetings in 1993 about 20% of the people who'd attended were sent to another smaller congregation because we were considered too large, or something like that. I didn't understand it at the time, but with hindsight I see now that the other congregation had imploded and the WTBTS was trying to salvage things by moving over a large chunk of people (including 2 elders and their wives) from our congregation to theirs. Get this - we shared the same kingdom hall!