Paralipominom said:..."Anyone else think Perry stopped posting because he was getting embarrassed by Vinny's behavior?"
So hilary, do you believe all things, the universe, earth, life upon the earth arose from NOTHING AT ALL? A big ole BANG, right into an earth with many amazing, harmonious and complex systems with atmosphere, water cycles, microbial, spinning and roataing at just the right speeds for life, all without any guiding hand of intellect?
That through this big ole BANG some primordial soup-like conditions resulted allowing some process where life can arise from lifeless? Where we have polymers to little fishes, to human brains and beyond?
Then if you believe THIS, then you my friend are the proud wearer of a red vette on your forehead; complete with pain job, door handles, fine tuned engine, gas and keys.
Go ahead put up or stop whining.
Here, I will help you so you can't be too confused:
1- Hilary, how does life evolve from lifeless matter? Please tell us.
2- Hilary, how does it feel believing that red corvette simply could arrive all on its own since universe, life and earth (all far more complex) all arrived on their own with no intelligence involved?
3- Hilary, if its true that all these things just happened on their own, why cannot the same science and technology which sends folks to the moon, create ANY LIFE (even the simplest of living things) from non-living matter today?
4- Hilary, what about the universal fact of life PRINCIPLE that EVERY BEGINNING MUST HAVE A CAUSE CAUSE? What does THAT do for atheism?
5- Hilary, what does it say to you when people such as Einstein, Copernicus, Sir Francis Bacon, Johannes Kepler, Galileo, Descartes, Newton, Boyle, Faraday, Mendel, Kelvin, Max Planck, and thousands of others scientists, philosophers, leaders such as Ghandi, MLK, every single President elected and many other successful people as well as BILLIONS of others believe in a Supreme Intelligent Designer and REJECT ATHEISM OUTRIGHT.
"You may view this as a 'cop out' on my part, that is your perogative" (yes we DID)....
Name calling, no arguments, thinking they are so intellectual when they are in actuality just BLOWING SMOKE.
Posts by Vinny
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Vinny
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Vinny
I am not trying to ignore you Dave. But the only trouncing I have taken on this thread was last night, by my WIFE. I have spent just TOO MUCH TIME on this thread and in debate mode here as well as many other places dealing with JW's. I made a definite promise last night to wrap things up today. Am trying to get to as many posts as I possibly can. Whatever is left over, well that's life.
So do not feel avoided. I think you know me better than that. There is not a question on this earth I would ever avoid. All of my posts deal directly with other people's questions. Again and again.
Einstein was agnostic. His words not mine. (quoted by alan f on page 17).
Einstsin, not an atheist and being agnostic stated, "God does not play dice with the universe".
Not being an atheist, he believed that some kind of intellectual force was responsible for the things we see today.
I’m not an atheist. I don’t think I can call myself a pantheist. The problem involved is too vast for our limited minds. We are in the position of a little child entering a huge library filled with books in many languages. The child knows someone must have written those books. It does not know how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. The child dimly suspects a mysterious order in the arrangement of the books but doesn’t know what it is. That, it seems to me, is the attitude of even the most intelligent human being toward God. We see the universe marvelously arranged and obeying certain laws but only dimly understand these laws.”
and
But because he flat-out stated that he was NOT an atheist, along with the two quotes above, along with many other quotes already posted, along with his "God does not play dice with the universe", I believe the context of how I am using the quote along with the general characterization that Einstein beleived in some higher power is correct.
Though I clearly do not believe that all things came to exist through random chances, without the guiding hand of intellect, as my many arguments cleaarly reflect.
Not even close.
Back to my replies.
Best,
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19
Public Speaking
by lonelysheep inhow do you get over the jitters to talk in front of people??
i have a speech class and make my first one tomorrow.
i'm f'ing petrified, despite everything we've talked about in class.
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Vinny
Preparation, preparation, preparation.
Yes you can over prepare too. To the point where you are too mentally tired to remember your own name.
But that us rather rare. -
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Vinny
Infamous one's SMACKDOWN TIME:
good luck with your battle. lore, i suggest you let it end too... these guys are jerks.. i try to say that they have no proof either, they try to make me feel stupid... your responces just show me how close minded you guys are... i am not the stupid one the infamous one"
First of all I am not Perry. He is not me. I have never met the person until a few days ago on this thread. We just both happen to agree that the universe, earth and life thereon did NOT originate from nothing through some series of random events and lots of luck. We both also so happen to believe in Christ, as do approx two billion other people. So what's the problem with that?
But let's discuss just WHY God may allow these situations to exist for a moment anyway. While it is true that nobody enjoys suffering, pain and the like, it is also true that these conditions can help develop desirable qualities in the individuals that experience them. In fact the scriptures says that Jesus LEARNED OBEDIENCE and other desirable qualities through his difficult times and sufferings while on the earth. *If* God is the Creator of all things, and if he allowed his only begotten SON to take the beatings and persecution that he did, then obviously SOME GOOD can also be the result by allowing these less than desirable situations to exist today as well.
In support of this, James Chapter 1:2-4 tells the reader, "to consider it all joy when you meet with various trials, knowing that this tested quality of your faith works out endurance. But let endurance have its work complete, that YOU may be complete and sound in all respects, not lacking in anything." So once again we can see some value in God's eyes by allowing trialsome conditions and situations to exist. Just because we humans may not fully understand exactly WHY God has allowed certain things to take place, does not mean that he does not exist at all. This may be some kind of opportunity for humans to gain an inner strength, perhaps a greater appreciation for when life is better, free from all these problems plaguing mankind. When I had a very serious staph infection earlier last summer, I was very scared and worried for a few days. However, When I knew I made it out of the woods, safely, I was really happy to be alive. My appreciation had ACTUALLY GROWN through that experience. The existence OF these problems however, does not just automatically discount or deny God's VERY existence. At least not in my mind. HE has simply decided to allow these conditions to exist at this time, for reasons, that are not crystal clear to humans. And again, he has promised to permanently remove these negative features that affect life today.
Life would have hope. Eternal life under wonderful conditions is at least possible.
He asks that we search for Him, walk with Him and help others come to know about Him.
In return, everlasting life with no pain, no suffering or even death.
By throwing God out along with the WT Society, you are throwing the proverbial baby out with the bath water.
And who wants to do THAT? -
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Vinny
ROUND TWO FOR ABADDON:
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Vinny
Either way, it's a tough name to have to quote and quote again.
sorry par. -
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Vinny
oops, sorry for the double odrade post.
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Vinny
ODRADE SHOWS UP AGAIN AND SAYS:...."At some point the mods are going to realize that he's only interested in a flame war and he will BWAHAHAHA his way to a ban".:::I agree, I wonder why he's still here?
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Vinny
Parellpomenenan whined that vinny could not answer his questions.
This is why you athesists are STUCK with red corvette on your foreheads for life. It applies, it fits, it works. -
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Vinny
ODRADE SHOWS UP AGAIN AND SAYS:...."At some point the mods are going to realize that he's only interested in a flame war and he will BWAHAHAHA his way to a ban".:::I agree, I wonder why he's still here?