Posts by OnTheWayOut

72

Coping With Atheism (Long-ish Post...sorry!)

by humblepotato in

jw
friends

long time lurker (2009-ish), first time poster.

first of all, i want to say thank you everyone who contributes to these boards and provokes stimulating conversations and thought processes.

all the opinions and different perspectives are very enlightening.

OnTheWayOut

Sound, Stage, and Mics were dumped on me the first week, then a month later I was assigned as a Watchtower and CBS reader, and I was put on the schedule to pray at the meetings. (Which I felt really bad about because there were brothers who had been in that congregation their whole lives and hadn't got to do any of that stuff!)

REALLY? Everywhere I went, they couldn't hand those assignments out fast enough to any baptized males, young or old. They might have taken away reading the Watchtower if the "brother" wasn't tolerable, but the rest of that is ordinary privileges. Why do you suppose your congregation is so different on that?

Anyway, I think I get what you are saying. While I don't say anything like "coping with atheism," you concerns are similar to what I went through. Jehovah supposedly saved my life (long story) and gave me a purpose. But to come to the realization that He wasn't even there threw me back into a depression over issues I avoided from before I was a JW. It took me time and serious soul-searching. I went to counseling, but it wasn't over the atheism, rather it was over those issues.

For atheism, I read many books and watched many videos. Everyone has to find their own path, so enjoy it rather than "cope" with it. My wife is not "hardcore" in many ways, but she does seem to be in the JW's for the longhaul, so I have to cope with that also. I slowly shifted to more freedom to be myself and ran into some snags with my wife. I honestly think I would have divorced her and had nothing else to do with JW's were it not for the need to try to keep contact with my JW mother, so I faded out from the congregation. Don't get me wrong- I love my wife. It's just that I might have thought both of us would be happier if we went through all the pain of divergent paths all at once. Since that did not happen, we have learned to be happy and not discuss religion and beliefs. I don't really say anything to her about being atheist, but I am sure she knows.

52

Questions for those that believe in Electricity

by OnTheWayOut in

jw
friends

you can't see electricity or hear it or feel it.

well, there are sparks and lightning bolts and heating elements and the light and heat of filaments.

and somehow, it lights up neon in a tube.

OnTheWayOut

Hey, I started this thread on a lark. Great that it lumbers on.

Some of the explanations for electricity make it more difficult to understand.

I will back off and say this now: I know that something powers my laptop computer and my smartphone. I don't have to understand it to believe the power exists. Whether I get that electrons don't flow like water or that it's a fair analogy to describe the results to a layperson, it doesn't matter.

Some have to be told this in order to apply it to other things.

Even as I write this, knowing that leaving off the obvious conclusion will cause people to go both ways: YES, WHAT I BELIEVE IN IS OBVIOUS AND HAS PLENTY OF EVIDENCE. EVOLUTION IS TRUE, EVOLUTION IS FALSE. THE GOD OF CHRISTIANITY EXISTS, THE GOD OF CHRISTIANITY DOESN'T EXIST. ETC. ETC.

53

questions

by DanielC in

i've been dating a jw girl for about 4 years and we've recently had a lot of issues with the fact that her family doesn't like that i'm not a jw.

i've been looking into the religion and am interested in it.

but is it wrong to join just so i don't lose her?

OnTheWayOut

In the movies, they show one of the chief recruitment methods of dangerous mind-control cults is to have pretty girls out there gaining the interest of young men. Jehovah's Witnesses do not intentionally use that method, but it happens. The young girls are often seen as pure and innocent. The young man sees the only way to have her is to join her religion.

If she's slightly bad and dates outside the religion, she typically won't "go all the way" and that makes the guy want her more.

She's violating JW rules by dating you. If she allows any touching or sexual contact of any kind, she's violating more rules. Eventually, she will feel guilty about it and drop you or go to the elders about her guilt or she may leave the JW's. Either way, you are making her near future a crazy one.

If you care for the girl, find out the truth about her religion and tell her. If she chooses her family and friends in the religion over you, try to understand it's all she knows and let her go.

24

Went to a Catholic Funeral Today

by Captain Schmideo2 in

jw
friends

it was for a dear friend of the family that i have known all my life.now, bear in mind that i was born and raised jw, so my experience with catholic ceremonies can be counted on three fingers, a wedding, a "regular" mass, and this funeral mass.once they got down to the actual speaking about the deceased, i felt emotionally involved, but prior to that, i was watching and had questions about aspects of the services (these i have seen in common for all three times i have been in an rc church):why the "sing-song" voice during the prayers?

does god hear it better if you sound all spooky tenor?i observe that every time a reading from one of the gospels takes place, it is preceded by a big musical number:"alleluiah!

alleluiah"( "and nowwwwwwwwwwwwwww, heeeeeeeeeeeeeere's jesus!".

OnTheWayOut

Why the "sing-song" voice during the prayers?

I think the real reason is because white people are too uptight to really let loose in church.
At a Catholic funeral, what freaks me out is that my non-practicing relatives still know when to say "Lord, hear my prayer" whenever it's supposed to be said.

28

Do You Think Humanity Will Ever Be Completely Free From Religion?

by InjusticeSystem in

i realize that many here still have a form of spirituality or faith, and i mean no disrespect to those individuals.

i suppose i am posting this question to those, like myself, who have come to the conclusion that religion in general is a major hindrance to the progress of our species and needs to be put aside so that we can advance to our full potential.

so my question is, do you think this will ever actually happen, and how do you think we can get there?

OnTheWayOut

Humans have between 1.75 and 3.25 (arguable) billion years left before earth is uninhabitable. That's a long time. We'll go conservative and assume that humankind has up to a billion years before his time is up.

That's a long time. In that time, I do believe that mankind will give up on God and Jesus and Mohammad.

It wouldn't surprise me if man picks up some completely different radical practices in that time, but I think most all of religion as something organized will disappear.

It may seem impossible now, but two factors will work against religion: the wasted resources and time for religion and the education of the population. Some taxing authority will end religion's tax-free status and it will spread. Eventually, everyone will be able to google without typing a keyboard- we are almost there now. They will figure out that religion is a scandal.

37

£150,000,000 Jehovahs Witnesses HQ approved

by defender of truth in

the jehovahs witnesses have gained planning to build a vast uk headquarters complex in chelmsford.the international bible students association, which manages the christian groups literature, gained planning to redevelop a derelict farm near galleywood with a 1.2m sq ft scheme.the 150m complex will provide homes for 1,200 people spread across 16 five-storey blocks, a large printing plant, offices, auditorium, health and fitness centre, water treatment plant and on-site parking for 1,040 vehicles.. the ibsa is now set to begin groundwork at the 82-acre temple farm site and start construction by 2016.. .

www.constructionenquirer.com/2015/04/29/150m-jehovahs-witnesses-hq-approved-for-chelmsford/.

OnTheWayOut

They might have felt it was necessary to hire people for the steel construction. It greases the wheels to get local government to approve and it may have been really not possible to train members and do it right for less.

Still, their figures are probably extremely inflated to impress. It's what they do.

And I have little doubt that they will say that this new place is so ideal for the job that all other European branches can close.

19

Sorry, But Your Sad Story Doesn't Make Me Feel Better. Is it supposed to?

by Tempest in a Teacup in

jw
friends

i have very recently come out of a bout of severe depression which lasted for years.

i have ginormous underlying issues which i hardly talk about, especially to my family.. today my sister came in, wanting to force me to do something she wanted.

her strategy was to make me feel bad for feeling bad, just to show me that my problem (which she has no idea of but thinks she does) wasn't the biggest in the world.

OnTheWayOut

While it didn't help, I would try to understand that's the best she's got. It seems you get that.
Better might be just being there for you, ready to listen or just to be there.

But I make the same mistakes your sister made. We just have to try to fix it when we see something broke.

55

why did man go from living 900 years to 90?

by sowhatnow in

i cant recall the scripture, where it says than only a few men will he live to be 80 years or so, can anyone recall that?.

so then im wondering, if it is a fact that men lived long years 900 in some cases, for what reason would god limit our lifespan if our time is so short compared to his?.

how on earth does man go from living 8 and 9 hundred years down to 80 to 100 ?.

OnTheWayOut

Man has been slowly expanding his lifespan. Historically, the oldest person ever lived to 122. It is possible that some lived longer than that without being part of recorded history,but statistics don't make it likely.

Statistics are tricky on this one. Life expectancy at birth was very short in ancient times, but those that did live past infancy and childhood could have lived to grow old. So it seems that some have virtually always managed to live past 70, but now many more do so and many of them live into their 80's and 90's.

As far as the Bible goes, the same book that says people lived nearly 900 years says that man started out only a bit over 6000 years ago and that a global flood happened some 4300 years ago, give or take, and wiped out all animal and human life except for a tiny gene pool.

And don't forget that the story forgot that dinosaurs existed. That's evidence enough for me that the writings were based on what people believed at the time of writing and that no supernatural power helped them with the story.

57

"Normal family affections and dealings" continue - If only?!?

by LHS123 in

i am new to this forum - it is only a couple of weeks since i have allowed myself to acknowledge and research my doubts.

i am trying to be fair by reading both sides of the story and considering jw official explanation of confusing matters.

one of the issues i have been looking at is shunning - and i was shocked to see the misleading information about shunning on the jw.org website: .

OnTheWayOut

I am trying to be ‘fair’ by reading both sides of the story.....

Most of us have been there, so we fully understand. We also expect that once you start to see matters for what they are, there really is no turning back, so we expect you to figure that out on your own. Bravo.

This is one area where they mislead. What gets me in some of those areas is that they can do it right out in the open. Any JW knows that isn't really the truth, that adults outside of the family home will tend to support the shunning. Despite any JW knowing that, they read or hear what Watchtower says and they go "YES!" So they have learned to sort of lie to themselves because they figure it will never happen to them anyway.

If you want more examples, what they say today about 1914 vs. what they said back then was already mentioned. There was "Millions now living will never die." What happened to that? Read up on all they had to say in print about 1975 and what they said afterward. Also consider what they say about all the "field service" being voluntary, and then try to actually just stop turning in time. There's also how they try to say "We are the only ones who...." If you research each point, you will find others who do or think the same way. Mormons do a preaching work, others consider themselves pacifists (or neutral), there are plenty of Biblically moral groups.

13

Saw my first JW literature cart

by undercover in

jw
friends

i saw a jw literature cart, and two dubs standing behind it this weekend.

they set up at a popular well attended event in a small town that brings thousands of people from around the country.

even though i've been out and away from jws for some time, and no longer identify as one of them, and the people i was with had no clue, it was a bit embarrassing to see the cart and cult zombies with it.

OnTheWayOut

I have seen them breaking the cart out of the car or loading it. I have seen them in downtown-type places. They are so far away from the main crowds though. They are "out of the way" of traffic, which is good.

But they don't approach people or hold some flyers to pass out. They are very passive in this work.

All that matters to a JW is "getting their time in." I think Watchtower is fully at the point where literature is a loss for them and they don't care that much is getting out to people.