Posts by OnTheWayOut

475

What is the alternative to JW?

by Formerbrother in

i mean this with all due respect, i would like to hear from genuine people who think jw have it wrong and then what is the truth?.

im not talking about silly little quibbles here and there.. is jehovah real?

the the bible is word?

OnTheWayOut

Formerbrother: The truth from the JW org, does have the ring of truth to it.

Yeah, I get that you believe that. Here's the thing.

1. They do Biblical gymnastics to make all their doctrine seem to fit the Bible. If you want to believe the Bible, the JW teachings will seem to be true.

2. Most JW's believe what they say. So you read that Mormons believe in the alien stuff and it doesn't have the ring of truth to your mind, but you have heard directly from JW's that God will destroy 99% of humankind and the people telling it to you were positive that it was true, so you heard the ring of truth.

43

Counsel from Bro Losch (GB Member) to the Elders about the NFL

by James Jack in

while attending a week long training class for elders in patterson, bro losch gave the concluding talk about loyalty to the borg, which i was in awe of(i went more in detail in a recent post about a s.a.d.

where losch was the speaker).

at the end of his talk, here's what he said: .

OnTheWayOut

I guess when you're just "sprit-directed" instead of inspired, thsee difference's arise.

24

I'm ready to get my first Powerball ticket -- NOT!

by FatFreek 2005 in

jw
friends

it's up to some 800 zillion dollars now and hasn't suckered me in yet.

i've been out of watchtower for some 38 years now and i suppose the lottery is one of their nonoze.

i have nothing morally wrong against it or anyone who enjoys doing it.

OnTheWayOut

Leave it to Perry.

24

I'm ready to get my first Powerball ticket -- NOT!

by FatFreek 2005 in

jw
friends

it's up to some 800 zillion dollars now and hasn't suckered me in yet.

i've been out of watchtower for some 38 years now and i suppose the lottery is one of their nonoze.

i have nothing morally wrong against it or anyone who enjoys doing it.

OnTheWayOut

I buy the occasional ticket because Watchtower says it is wrong. I also like to imagine for a day or two that I will be a multi-millionaire later this week.

I have considered telling my JW wife that we can only keep our hundreds of millions of dollars if Watchtower says it's okay to keep the money or else we will do whatever Watchtower says to do with it. Either that, or she can leave Watchtower and we won't ask.

I consider that, but I know I would never give them all that money.

76

What is your relationship with ALCOHOL?

by nicolaou in

here in the uk new drinking guidelines have been issued which suggest "no more than 14 units a week - equivalent to six pints of beer or seven glasses of wine.".

another piece of the advice which is getting a lot of attention is that "if people drink, it should be moderately over three or more days and that some days should be alcohol-free.".

already people are making cries of "nanny state!

OnTheWayOut

I am an alcoholic. I wouldn't stick with two drinks a day or 14 drinks a week or many limitations.

Some people need to do a self-examination to see if they do (or can) go alcohol-free for several days or even just one day.

That said, I think that there are many young people who party and drink heavily, but are not alcoholics- it could be just an occasional thing or something of a phase they go through. Others drink a little every day and are not alcoholics.

The guidelines are okay, but they are not the end-all. They might just be a good guide to make people look at their habits.

152

If YOU had to make the decision, would you respect a JW relatives wish to refuse a blood transfusion?

by nicolaou in

a few years after i quit the meetings my mum needed her medical directive signed and witnessed and she asked if i'd do it.

i was surprised to say the least!.

i think she was just angling to include me and maybe find some lever to get me involved again.

OnTheWayOut

Simon, I think our difference came with your words, "There is no reason for them to be unhappy..." Yet I never see it happening that way. Every frigging story about the blood issue ends with someone being unhappy. Otherwise, we are fully on the same page.

You speak logically about the result and I refer to the emotional aspect of it.

49

Slightly different approach - JW my tradition

by closed in

hello everybody :) i have been visiting this forum for some time.

i noticed that many can't really free from the past in the org despite many years outside of jw.

i was awaken with a bang.

OnTheWayOut

Welcome. Before I comment, please go back and read carefully what LisaRose said on page 2. Here's the highlights I want you to catch:

LisaRose on page 2:

You and your family may be suffering in ways you don't realize, just because you are so used to it. .........
.............Many have been abused and are suffering due to hidden child sex abuse, abusive marriages, depression, missing out on educational opportunities, etc. The person sitting next to you in the Kingdom Hall may want to leave, but they look at you and think "brother Closed keeps going and he is a nice person, so it must be the right thing to do".................
Your being a part of this organization, even if it's to a lesser degree than before, validates it and gives it power and authority. You are helping to maintain the status quo of an organization you know to be corrupt, because it suits you to stay at this time.

You see the elders abusing their privileged status (and denying they even have status). I mean, it's great if you can see that and not let it bother you personally. What about your family, especially the children? Will they surely know the religion is not to be taken so seriously, or will they fall into the trap of becoming zealous adults for Jehovah, or maybe will they just suffer the ostracizing caused by JW's?

There's really no reason to stay with a corrupt organization because you like the moral standards. You can establish moral standards and try to pass them on to your family without Jehovah's Witnesses.

Now that I said that, I am a faded JW- meaning I don't attend meetings anymore and I don't disassociate. I do this simply to keep contact with JW loved ones. If I had children being raised in the lies, I would disassociate and help them see how important it is to find a better path, and how they can decide whether or not to celebrate a friend's birthday or go to college or play high school sports or YADDA YADDA!!!

Some think that even a faded JW should take a stand and "get out of her." So I get that you may make unpopular decisions with others in this group. You are free to do as you please, but you should know why so many disagree with you. Anyway, I hope the best for you.

47

Hello, this is my first post

by noralee in

jw
friends

hello, this is my first post, i would like to introduce myself and say thank you to every one on this forum, you have been a lifeline to me these last few years.. i had been a jw for 30 years when i walked away a few years ago disgusted by the treatment victims of child abuse, domestic abuse and rape receive from the wtbts.. at first i thought it was a local problem, elders personal opinions, the way they handled the situations, imperfect men etc., until i checked out jehovahs witnesses and child abuse/domestic abuse online.

that's when i realized they had the same modus operandi worldwide.

that led me here, tbuo this forum, and then to crisis of conscience, jw facts, watchtower documents, jw survey, old watchtower literature and cd s, reading a couple of steve hassans books, and more recently exiting the jw cult.. the feelings of shock, betrayal, anger at the wtbts, angry with myself for being so gullible, depression, reflection, loneliness, have taken their toll.

OnTheWayOut

That led me here, tbuo this forum, and then to Crisis of Conscience, JW Facts, Watchtower Documents, JW Survey, old watchtower literature and cd¨s, reading a couple of Steve Hassans books, and more recently Exiting the JW Cult.

Just so everyone is clear, I believe that last one you mention is the book, "EXITING THE JW CULT." Even though I am already out, I read that book and it was great. So were your other choices.

It is refreshing to read how many woke up. Welcome to the forum.

91

Is the Watchtower organisation facing the biggest crisis of its history?

by slimboyfat in

recent developments make me think they might be.

the problems they are facing are not just lack of funds but also draining authority, and the two could be a heady and explosive mix.

one of the best analyses ever written of the watchtower was a book called "trumpet of prophecy" by sociologist james beckford in the 1970s.

OnTheWayOut

I tend to agree that the GB members were, in the past, mysterious and thought of as so much better than the members. And now that image is shot to hell.

The "overlapping generation" along with other strange changes allowed many hardcore JW's to start questioning.

But it is money problems that really do it to hurt the organization among the membership. From reduced printing to layoffs to the big money grab and now there just isn't enough money for anything, the membership is seeing a lack of God's blessings.

152

If YOU had to make the decision, would you respect a JW relatives wish to refuse a blood transfusion?

by nicolaou in

a few years after i quit the meetings my mum needed her medical directive signed and witnessed and she asked if i'd do it.

i was surprised to say the least!.

i think she was just angling to include me and maybe find some lever to get me involved again.

OnTheWayOut

You can say "their choice was not to receive blood but my choice is to allow it" and that is your choice to make if they entrusted that situation to you. If they didn't want you to be able to make the choice then they shouldn't have asked you to.
There is no reason for them to be unhappy because receiving a blood transfusion while unconscious was not their choice so they have not violated any commandment anymore than someone being drugged and raped has been immoral.
If they or their religion can't differentiation that then it's their problem - you have done the right thing by saving their life and giving them the options to make future choices including how to handle the difficult choice you were put in a position to make.

Simon: That's pretty much what I will go through if my wife needs blood. But I have to disagree with "There is no reason for them to be unhappy because receiving a blood transfusion while unconscious was not their choice so they have not violated any commandment..." That frigging cult makes such a big deal of this that it doesn't play out that way. With a child, I believe it does. Deep down, every JW parent hopes the court forces the issue. But for hardcore adult dubs coming back from unconsciousness to discover they were given blood, the cult makes them feel that they have to be angry, feel like they failed.