Posts by Frequent_Fader

11

The "perfect human" being ...

by Frequent_Fader_Miles in

according to the jw belief, what definition/explanation were you given for the concept of "human perfection"?

what exactly would make a "perfect human" ... well... perfect?.

i remember once when i was a child, my mom told me that when i decided on my adult profession, i should make sure it's one i would be able to use in the "new system".

Why assume that we're so far removed from what Jehovah wants us to be? Aren't we all free moral agents, able to choose out our own path? For example, a tree has absolutely no choice but to stand where it's planted, take in carbon dioxide, give out oxygen, photosynthesize ... It doesn't even have choice of food. Why would God make us in his own image just to have us behave like robots. Human personalities are so very diverse, making life so interesting. That seems really illogical to me.

As regards the human body ... in my humble opinion it's already perfect! That's why man has never been able to create one, only copy from it.

11

The "perfect human" being ...

by Frequent_Fader_Miles in

according to the jw belief, what definition/explanation were you given for the concept of "human perfection"?

what exactly would make a "perfect human" ... well... perfect?.

i remember once when i was a child, my mom told me that when i decided on my adult profession, i should make sure it's one i would be able to use in the "new system".

Frequent_Fader_Miles

According to the JW belief, what definition/explanation were you given for the concept of "human perfection"? What exactly would make a "perfect human" ... well... perfect?

I remember once when I was a child, my mom told me that when I decided on my adult profession, I should make sure it's one I would be able to use in the "New System". I thought for a second, then said "Okay, I'll be a doctor then". Her response was ... "We wont need doctors in the New System since everyone will be perfect". Of course, this explanation made absolutely no sense to me. So my next question to her was ... "What if someone falls down and breaks their arm?" Her explanation went something like ... "As perfect human beings we would know the right way to fall down so as not to break any bones." This made even less sense to me than her previous answer. I enquired further ... "Suppose you were pushed from behind and didn't have time to fall the right way?" She then said ... "We still wont break any bones since we'll have perfect bones that won't break." By this point in the conversation I decided to turn my attention to something more interesting, so I moved on.

What interesting explanations of the subject did you get?

10

These annoying hour requirements ....

by Frequent_Fader_Miles in

once more i'm paying tribute to pie-on-airs.

here's something else out of the trusty branch organization manual.. chapter 17/ page 117. .

57. missionaries and special pioneers who take two weeks of vacation in one month are expected to report at least half the normal requirement of hours of field service.allowed to deduct five hours of field service from his total field service time for the month for each vacation day used and still receive his reimbursement.

Frequent_Fader_Miles

Once more I'm paying tribute to Pie-On-Airs. Here's something else out of the trusty Branch Organization Manual.

CHAPTER 17/ PAGE 117

57.

Missionaries and special pioneers who take two weeks of vacation in one month are expected to report at least half the normal requirement of hours of field service. If one is eligible for additional days of vacation time, then when such days are used, whether in connection with the two weeks' vacation or otherwise, he will be allowed to deduct five hours of field service from his total field service time for the month for each vacation day used and still receive his reimbursement. Of course, missionaries and special pioneers who are eligible for four weeks of vacation* and who take all of this time in one month will want toreport some field service time so as to continue regular in field service. For a month when one takes some vacation time he should mention the dates of his vacation and the number of days used on the monthly report form under "remarks concerning report" or at the bottom of the form.

*this tidy amount of vacation days comes only after some 12 years of full-time service

59.

From time to time there may besomepersonal matters that those who are special pioneers or missionaries may wish to attend to other than when they are on their vacation. In such a case they may leave their assignment for one or two days without taking vacation time. Of course, they would still need to meet the normal hour reqirement. If more than two consecutive days are involved, then vacation time would need to be used. It is not the intention to add such days to regular vacation time, but they may be taken at times other than when one is on vacation.

Take note of the loaded language .... "may wish to" as opposed to "would need to"

CHAPTER 117/ PAGE 118

65. SHARING VACATION TIME:

Married persons may not have been in the service the same length of time. For example, one special pioneer or missionary may have more vacation time due than his mate. So a married person is permitted to share his vacation time with his mate if he wishes to do so. Thus, if the man has three weeks' vacation due to him and his wife only two weeks, he may give his wife half of the third week and notification of this would be made to the branch. Additional days allowed under the vacation arrangement also may be shared in this way.

Whooopeeee! A whole three and a half days! How generous of the society. Couldn't they just allow the wife the extra without her husband giving up anything? Oops ...sorry, my bad ... that's an entire three and a half days worth of hours less to report.

26

My life after Bethel

by new boy in

thank you for this place in cyber space, this is therapy for me.

there is something about writing things down, that helps put things in perspective........ the day i left it was pouring rain........i really screwed up, i found out the night before, as i was packing things up, that i had way under estimated how much stuff i had.

i had two large suit cases (that i could barely shut the lids on) and a large army duffel bag.

Frequent_Fader_Miles

What a horrible way to leave Bethel ... drenched in rain ... just plain angry. On the bright side however, THANK GOD YOU LEFT!!! I bet you had a sweet rush taking your new bride through on tour. Please tell us more.

20

NEW LIGHT ! Wedding Rings!!!!!!!!!

by bigmouth in

does this sound right to you????!!!!!

to all congregations; .

xxxxxxxxxx .

Frequent_Fader_Miles

Is this letter for real? They can't be serious!!! Thank god I'm not under any stupid rules anymore ... my wedding ring has 12 diamonds and there's no way in HELL I was giving it up!!!

4

Aaaah yes ... what a privilege to be a Pie-On-Air..

by Frequent_Fader_Miles in

yes people, it's that time of year again!

it's the time when all dubs are "encouraged" to pioneer.

in my neck of the woods, the streets are crawling with them, standing under the burning under the hot sun, trying to "make their hours" before heading off to work in the morning.

Frequent_Fader_Miles

Yes people, it's that time of year again! It's the time when all dubs are "encouraged" to Pioneer. In my neck of the woods, the streets are crawling with them, standing under the burning under the hot sun, trying to "make their hours" before heading off to work in the morning. I'm sure you all can just TASTE their brimming joy!!!

Maybe they should do some "personal study" and read the following in the Branch Organization Manual :

CHAPTER 17/ PAGE 111

2. THE PIONEER'S ROLE:

When someone is appointed as a regular pioneer, special pioneer or missionary, it does not put him in a higher position than one who is a congregation publisher. He should cooperate closely with the local body of elders and should also appreciate the importance of showing active concern for others in the congregation. He should be grateful that he can arrange his personal affairs to be in the full-time service*, but there is no reason for him to have a high-minded or superior attitude.

(If we are really to believe that crap, then why use the term "Pioneer Ranks"?)

(*what a joke!)

CHAPTER 17/ PAGE 113

27. INFIRM PIONEERS:

Pioneers who have been exemplary and have served for at least 15 full years and who are over 50 years of age, but who are unable to meet the hour requirement because of infirmity, and who desire to remain on the list, may be permitted to do so if they make such a request and the elders give them a good recommendation. Those placed on the infirm pioneer list should be encouraged to do as much as they can in field service, even though they may not be able to meet the requirement of hours. The infirm arrangement is not a provision for an individual to take care of his sick relatives, do added secular work, etc. Rather, it is an arrangement that enables one who is advanced in years and/or with infirmities who is no longer able to meet the hour requirement to continue as a pioneer.

Just imagine that someone has to work at this nonpaying, "pensionless" job with no benefits for 15 straight years before being allowed "permission" to fall beneath the hour requirement ... and remain on the Pioneer list!! It raises the question ...why would someone who's sick enough to even consider this dumb arrangement, bother to make the request since pioneers shouldn't consider themselves better than others. Wouldn't it be better to just "do as much as they can in field service" without the additional hassle? What if someone began pioneering at age 20, and falls ill at age 35? Also, how unloving it is to even specify that the "infirm arrangement" is not for catering to Christianlike responsibilities such as taking care of a sick relative (thus showing "active concern"), or doing added secular work that would allow someone to contribute more financially to the "preaching work"? Who do they think support the pioneers pioneers by taking on "extra secular work" ... certainly not the Governing Body!

3

CAN YOU SAY ... SELFISH? (part 2)

by Frequent_Fader_Miles in

jw
friends

here's what the bible says .... .

psalms 40:1 - happy is anyone acting with consideration toward the lowly one; in the day of calamity jehovah will provide escape for him.. here's what the branch organization manual says .... chapter 9/ page 78.

17. refusal of blood transfusions: if our brothers' obedience to abstain form blood is being ignored by healthcare providers with or without court authority, legal action may be warranted.

Frequent_Fader_Miles

Here's what the Bible says ...

Psalms 40:1

- Happy is anyone acting with consideration toward the lowly one; In the day of calamity Jehovah will provide escape for him.

Here's what the Branch Organization Manual says ...

CHAPTER 9/ PAGE 78

17. REFUSAL OF BLOOD TRANSFUSIONS: If our brothers' obedience to abstain form blood is being ignored by healthcare providers with or without court authority, legal action may be warranted. If you recommend such, provide us with a complete overvies of the case. Set forth what you hope to accomplish. we are not inclined to get involved if winning will not help the brotherhood in general.

18. PERSONAL DECISIONS: Individuals in the congregations may ask the opinion of the Legal Department or Desk on what to do in matters involving citizenship, neutrality, marriage, divorce, employment, etc. However, if the person does not know what to do from his own knowledge of the Bible, it is wiser not to take the responsibility from him by telling him what to do. The Legal Department or Desk should limit its work to legal issues affecting the branch's interests rather than personal requests for legal advice or assistance.

10

HOW HYPOCRITCAL CAN YOU GET (part 1)...

by Frequent_Fader_Miles in

jw
friends

i used to view the pharisees as the 'evil spawn of satan'.

i still remember that image in the literature of a bearded man looking down at people.

boy was i clueless!!

Frequent_Fader_Miles

I used to view the Pharisees as the 'evil spawn of Satan'. I still remember that image in the literature of a bearded man looking down at people. Boy was I clueless!! Anyone of you out there ever laid eyes on the Branch Organization Manual? I managed to get hold of one and some of the things in there are just incredible! Here's one of the things that stood out to me (unbelievable!) ...

CHAPTER 24/ PAGE 147

14.

When an article is sent to the Writing Department in Brooklyn it must be accurate in every detail . Basically, that responsibility rests with the writer. We should use as writers only individuals whom we know will do dependable research and present the facts carefully . However, when the Branch Committee coordinator or the branch representative of the Writing department reads an article and sees anything at all in it that raises a question , this point should be checked with the original writer, or it should be looked up to make sure that what is said is absolutely right . If the point is in error, an appropriate correction should be made . Similarly, if statements are ambiguous, they should be clarified. Maters should be expressed, not only with a view to explaining them, but so that they will not be misunderstood by translators or by readers. Avoid use fo expressions having unnecessary political or propagandistic overtones.

What a classic case of "do as I say and not as I do"!!!!! Apparently this guideline applies only to lowly minions, and not to the Society in their own publishing. Why does this rule not apply to 1914, 1975, or even the 'generation change'?

Check this one out ...

CHAPTER 25/ PAGE 153

50.

It is important that translators keep their work confidential . Apart from the responsible brothers and those involved in the project, others (including marriage mates and other Bethelites) do ot need to know (a) what is being translated and (b) who is translating a particular item. No publication should ever be associated with a particular person. This is especially so in the case of Bible translators. This confidentiality protects both the organization and translators .

Seems like a 'catch 22' situation to me. Even in the dictionary they list the names of the editorial team and the linguists!!! What makes them any less accountable for the work they publish? How is anyone to be sure of their qualifications? The Society claims that confidentiality protects the organization and the translators ... but who's PROTECTING THE 'FLOCK' FROM INACCURATE INFORMATION? Things to make you go hmmmmm ….

13

An update

by Frequent_Fader_Miles in

thanks so much for the really warm welcome.

just a small confession .. my last post was actually written a couple months ago before i'd gotten the nerve to post.

i copied and pasted it ... and forgot to update it.. my wedding came off in december 2006, and my mom did attend.

Frequent_Fader_Miles

Hi everyone. Thanks so much for the really warm welcome. Just a small confession .. my last post was actually written a couple months ago before I'd gotten the nerve to post. I copied and pasted it ... and forgot to update it.

My wedding came off in December 2006, and my mom did attend. Her PO didn't see a problem with her attending. Mind you, the nosey elder who threatened to take away her 'privileges of service' isn't even a member of her congo! He researched her phone number in a file at the Branch Office, then took it upon himself to call and 'counsel' her ... behind my back! She was so scared of losing her 'privileges' that she was prepared to miss her only child's wedding day. Eventually I convinced her to seek a second opinion on the matter, which thankfully she did.

I'm now happily married, and my mom loves her new son-in-law. Our 2 months together has seemed more like 2 weeks. I believe I'm lucky to have found one of the few good men left. I'm positive that my marriage will be happier than some of those 'capable wives' whose husbands treat them 'according to knowledge' (supposedly).

Just the other day my mom called me asking if I had returned to the meetings yet ... of course my answer was NO. She commented that if I were to "return to Jehovah" that my husband would follow. WHY IN HEAVEN'S NAME WOULD I WISH SUCH A FATE ON MY HUSBAND? We celebrated our first Valentine's day together, and we have so many more celebrations to look forward to. REAL CELEBRATIONS!!!! Not pseudo-celebrations like 'spiritual food at the proper time', conventions, boring assemblies. field service, boring return visits, worshipping at the altar of the CO ..... (you all know what I mean)

12

It's so good to be free

by Frequent_Fader_Miles in

ive been lurking round this board for a couple months now.

all the experiences ive read have been so eye opening for me.

i thought i was the only one with doubts gnawing at the back of my mind; its so nice to know im not alone.

Frequent_Fader_Miles

I’ve been lurking round this board for a couple months now. All the experiences I’ve read have been so eye opening for me. I thought I was the only one with doubts gnawing at the back of my mind; it’s so nice to know I’m not alone. I just wanted to share my story also.

I was ‘raised’ in the ‘truth’ since my mom converted in 1974 (my dad was an unbeliever). Since discovering this board, I believe she converted during the 1975 end-of-the-world hysteria (she’s never admitted this openly though). Honestly, I never liked going to meetings. Having no siblings, the best part of the meeting for me was the end when I’d get to play with my friends. Then there was the kind brother who would share out goodies among the children after meetings. I remember placing magazines on field service as a child, but it was just a game to me. As a pre-teen we changed congregations. There were no teens my age in the new hall; there were either “pediatrics” or “geriatrics”. Loneliness set in for me then. I still hated meetings, but at least they offered me a chance to get out of the house since I was never allowed to go anywhere without the characteristic ‘grilling’. If it weren’t for my ‘worldly’ friends at my all-girls’ High School I think I would have gone bonkers! Oftentimes I wondered how come these ‘worldly’ girls showed me such warm affection while the congregation members were so ‘cold’. Despite this inner turmoil I was what everyone considered a well-behaved young lady. My mother regularly read Ephesians 6:1-3 to me during my formative years, and I suppose those words held deep meaning for me. Regardless of how angry I was inside I never wanted to do anything to upset my mom. Little did I know it would later bite me in the behind.

I was a frustrated teen. I was also what you could call an introvert. Sometimes I would feel like the walls were closing in on me. It was my plan to avoid baptism, but I was pounced upon at a weak moment – I was 21. The elders were constantly nagging me about everything; “why not widen out?”…”he who is isolating himself”…”why are you a low-hour publisher?”…”why are we not hearing your comments at the meetings?” Oh how I dreaded those so-called shepherding calls!! Lots of questions circulated in my mind e.g. How come “Jehovah loves a cheerful giver” when there are not enough contributions at the Assembly, but accepts my service hours when I give them in grudgingly? Why is ‘voluntary’ service coerced? Why do they read the congregation’s financial accounts every month, but no statement is read concerning my contributions to the World Wide Work? Why are women looked down upon in the organization? If every year more women are baptized than men, isn’t “marry only in the Lord” oppressive to sisters? In spite of all this, I was still viewed as ‘exemplary’ in the congregation. We had since changed congregations again. There were many young adults in this congregation, but apparently, they were engaging in “normal” young-adult stuff and giving the elders a run for their money. They never included me in their activities, so I guess I was rather clueless. Being ‘exemplary’ was a heavy yoke on my shoulders; assignments were never-ending. I was constantly giving talks, being a householder, or being used in demonstrations; sometimes back to back. I had no life. My entire life consisted of work, home, meetings, field service. I felt it was being wasted. I finally left my parents’ house in my late twenties.

I’m now inactive, and I’ve been ‘fading’ since 2000 …. BEST DECISION I EVER MADE!!!! I’ve since met a wonderful man and we’re planning to get married. Of course word got to a particularly nosey elder about the wedding. He then tried to spoil everything by looking up my mother’s phone number in a file and ‘threatening’ to have her ‘privileges’ removed if she attended the wedding. He also blew the whistle to her on my ‘fading’. The situation has since been resolved and she will be attending, and thanks to this site I’ve found really good advice on how to deal with any elders who might drop by to offer ‘encouragement’. It’s so incredible being able to go to a movie on a meeting night, or walk along the ‘dub-free’ streets on Convention days. Almost all my life there was someone breathing down my neck, but the change has done me soooo good. Oh how my newfound freedom is sweet. I intend to enjoy it for all those years I’ve wasted in the ‘TRUTH’.

Frequent_Fader_Miles

Posts by Frequent_Fader_Miles