AllTimeJeff

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Posts by AllTimeJeff

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  59

  Hmmm...I have a question

  by hmmmmmm in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  hi.. somethings seem weird.. for example - wages of sin is death - so if you sin you die, and if you die you have paid for that sin completely, so you have no more sin.

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  now what if everyone in the world was killed - by a nuclear domino effect - in theory we have saved everyone .... any ideas?.

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  AllTimeJeff

  Careful their Mad Sweeney. You are using logic. Perry is liable to change the subject on you.
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  145

  GETTING SUCKED IN? Ask the right questions to get the right answers.

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  it is too easy to get sucked in to the wrong argument at the wrong time.. asking the wrong question leads to the wrong answer.

  a wrong answer does nobody any real good.. i once had a heated discussion with an old friend who is still an active jehovah's witness.. he came back at me with this:.

  "okay, then--if jehovah's organization is a false religion, where is the true one?

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  AllTimeJeff

  You didn't respond to his question, you raised a different one Perry.
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  38

  Are JWs discouraged from seeking mental help?

  by Kristina1972 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  my husband was raised in this religion, but was never baptized and does not go to meetings, although my mil is heavily involved.

  although my husband doesn't practice his religion, he believes it is the truth and i hate asking him questions, because he is very defensive of the religion.

  he and his mother, many years ago before i knew either of them, were treated for severe depression and hospitalized (at different times as a result of them going through divorces.

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  AllTimeJeff

  There is no doubt that the Governing Body tacitly and directly discourages what should be considered normal mental help. Therapists and the use of medication is commonly accepted and well known to provide a great deal of help and relief.

  But because this is outside the realm of their control, the GB marginalizes it. It is sick.
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  145

  GETTING SUCKED IN? Ask the right questions to get the right answers.

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  it is too easy to get sucked in to the wrong argument at the wrong time.. asking the wrong question leads to the wrong answer.

  a wrong answer does nobody any real good.. i once had a heated discussion with an old friend who is still an active jehovah's witness.. he came back at me with this:.

  "okay, then--if jehovah's organization is a false religion, where is the true one?

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  AllTimeJeff

  Now go pick up the pieces of your Jihad against Christians and play outside.

  With other Christians like you? What if they are going to go on a Crusade of mercy against me? What if I ask them a question about evil and they start talking about Gods mercy?

  The CENTRAL issue with Terry has BEEN FOR YEARS, and will continue to be the logicalness of God's mercy in light of Justice. This is what underpins all of his arguments.

  Terry is more then able to speak to this if he wants. I will just observe that he asked a question, and here you are making something else the central issue. No, that wasn't the issue or the question Terry asked, and your reponse to it was to talk about something else. That is called a DODGE. Lets face it Perry, you only want to talk about what you want to talk about. And you can't answer Terry's question. Thats fine.

  Besides, if this has been going on for years, why even bother to interject yourself? You came in, debated, didn't answer the question, then claim that some here 'just don't get it.'

  Well, speaking for myself, I don't get you.

  Religion is religion. Worship is worship. It is what it is.

  Saying "false religion" is as insane as saying "He's wearing false clothes", "She's eating false food", "That big city banker is practising a false profession", "A Tibetan shepherd is living a false lifestyle".

  Interesting statement Quillsky, and that would be all it was if other religions weren't using these labels. For the sake of argument, I would think the point must be conceded that it is religions themselves that claim to be true and others false. Non theists merely pick up on this and point it out. If all religions abandoned that claim, then I doubt threads like this would exist.
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  25

  A Thought on DFing: Shafting the Hounders

  by Farkel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the wts has repeatedly stated that one of the main reasons for disfellowshiping is to "keep the congregation clean.

  " another reason is to shame the offender into toeing the wt party line, although they don't quite put it that way.. on the other hand, there are numerous examples of elder hounders hunting down and dfing people who have totally and voluntarily extricated themselves from the "congregation" and its members for years.

  obviously, they aren't bothering the congregation(s) or active dubs at all, and obviously they aren't interested into being "shamed" in order to get back in.. one can only conclude that the motives of the elder hounders are vindictive.

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  AllTimeJeff

  I am not sure of how it will turn out, but just the ability to threaten to name individual elders in a lawsuit has been enough in some cases to have the Service Dept send a letter saying basically "Let it go for now. They haven't associated in years."

  As always, the entire reason why fading is an option is because if you are away for a while, it is legally harder to justify the disfellowshipping of a person who has been away and not officially announced their intent as to leaving the cult. For the cult to kick anyone out in absentia doesn't follow their own internal rules. It is the "following of their own internal rules" that is the legal measurment behind any lawsuit.

  Now I suspect in the future, the GB is working on finding "scriptural" (excuse me while I puke) rationale to disfellowship in absentia. But that isn't currently an option.
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  145

  GETTING SUCKED IN? Ask the right questions to get the right answers.

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  it is too easy to get sucked in to the wrong argument at the wrong time.. asking the wrong question leads to the wrong answer.

  a wrong answer does nobody any real good.. i once had a heated discussion with an old friend who is still an active jehovah's witness.. he came back at me with this:.

  "okay, then--if jehovah's organization is a false religion, where is the true one?

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  AllTimeJeff

  Just as a commentary on this latest exchange:

  Perry, your answer was pure drivel. Not only did you not answer a basic yes or no question, you purposely dodged it.

  For the sake of discussion, one has to assume the existence of god to debate the issue with a theist. Can I get a big "DUH WEE" from the congregation? Amen.

  Perry, the logical weakness in your argument is your total lack of willingness to think critically about "Gods" "justice". You are the one who assumes that humans can't question it. And that is your fallback position.

  Without the ability to measure the morality of "Gods" "justice" in pragmatic terms, there is no basis to go forward. Why would I plead for mercy before a despot? Why assume that this "justice" is best when one can merely look at history and find very compelling reasons to reject this despotic god and his version of "mercy".

  It is clear to me that your preferred method for debating with those who disagree with god is to consistently change the subject to a basic "You don't believe in god, so why are you arguing as if god exists? If you are assuming god exists for the sake of argument, who are we to question him?"

  Anyone can read Perry's posts and see that is his fallback position. It is a blackhole filled with the dodging of reasonable questions.

  This is just a guess, but my guess is Perry, you have been able to answer Terry's direct simple question to you days ago, but as a tactic, you wait for a few days to come back to it, and then ignore it anyway to change the subject.

  I respect so many Christians on this board for their reasonableness and ability to answer questions, as well as their ability to recognize the limitations of their beliefs. You evidentally, do not want to concede an inch.

  You are the walking living example of what Terry originally started as a premise for this thread. You only answer questions that you believe support you, and dodge ones that you basically can't answer, because a good answer doesn't exist.

  Now if you will excuse me, I am going to pray for gods mercy and justice on me for treating you, Perry, gods representative to us all, with disrespect. (sarcasm implied)
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  218

  What Birth Sign Were You Born Under ?

  by flipper in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  didn't know if this has been addressed before , but it's kinda interesting.

  when we were witnesses we were always told,oh!

  don't look at horoscopes or read anything about your sign because it's demonized !

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  AllTimeJeff

  LOL @ Outlaw
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  218

  What Birth Sign Were You Born Under ?

  by flipper in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  didn't know if this has been addressed before , but it's kinda interesting.

  when we were witnesses we were always told,oh!

  don't look at horoscopes or read anything about your sign because it's demonized !

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  AllTimeJeff

  Yeah, that was interesting! A lot of things that applied to me....
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  218

  What Birth Sign Were You Born Under ?

  by flipper in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  didn't know if this has been addressed before , but it's kinda interesting.

  when we were witnesses we were always told,oh!

  don't look at horoscopes or read anything about your sign because it's demonized !

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  AllTimeJeff

  Thats cool. I have no idea of what my sign entails. I would look it up, but I am too addicted to this site.... ;)
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  218

  What Birth Sign Were You Born Under ?

  by flipper in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  didn't know if this has been addressed before , but it's kinda interesting.

  when we were witnesses we were always told,oh!

  don't look at horoscopes or read anything about your sign because it's demonized !

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  AllTimeJeff

  Just to explain, I dropped my computer on my above post. I am a Capricorn. Hope that helps...